Chinese Engine Development

gelgoog

Brigadier
Registered Member
I think you guys are expecting too much from China's industrial base at that juncture or even this one.

The Chinese transport aircraft industry was basically non-existent. Except for some clones of small or middling 1960s or older Soviet aircraft. They started providing outsourced work of parts for Western aircraft builders. Now they were doing joint aircraft development with foreign partners. This is not dumb. It reduces the risk the project will fail completely because of lack of domain expertise. Perhaps some components will need to be made native later. But the fact the development was more incremental and expertise was built up gradually was done for a reason. In the end this will save time and make a better product.

China was pursuing a similar model to the one used for the high speed train development. That worked well and there is little reason to think it won't this time either. There might be some bumps along the way and sanctions but it will get done.
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
This is the problem of the Chinese engineer. They are too afraid to take a risk and don't believe in their own capability. Always depends on western tech. Why not just put WS-20 engine in C919 and do more testing. DON'T be afraid of failure because USA also start with failure too. China government need to ban airbus and Boeing to bring more pressure to engineer. Hard work and pressure is needed for success. Desperate Times Call for Desperate Measures.
I don't think that is the problem. Based on personal experience in machine design, you cannot designed every single component for prototype. It is just time consuming and not practical. You concentrate on designing the critical and difficult part first and left the not so critical part latter. But built that prototype first and get the performance data or "proof of concept" first See if it worked and what performance data can you get. Does it meet design spec? And worry latter about not so critical component!

The japanese did the same thing when they built their Turbo jet they use Sandvik designed double spooled shaft. Not only that they import the production machine and their engineering support. Japan can do that but not China
 
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Orthan

Senior Member
Can you please continue this currently strictly engine-related discussion in the correct thread!

It seems to me that you also participated on this:

Calm down ... with the WS-20 the C919 will surely be able to fly but it takes times, money and even more with the WS-20 it won't reach its performance parameters since it is an older generation engine. As such, to be competitive, they need to wait for the CJ1000A
 

Deino

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
It seems to me that you also participated on this:
You, as a reminder that the CJ-1000A is irrelevant. I won't rate this a "participation".

The engine is the core component of aircraft. Nothing wrong to discuss engine in this thread
Oh come on ... and therefore you need to discuss C919 sales prospects, CJ-1000 development timeline and so on? The WS-15 is also an engine, so you like to discuss this too? :mad: I noted you should continue this discussion in the engine thread, but simply NOT in the tanker & transport thread since the CJ-1000A is NOT aimed for the Y-20.

Seriously.. often these admin warnings are just ruining very much fun discussions...
Why, since it is fun for you to discuss off topic stuff? Again, I never said to STOP the discussion, only to continue in the engine thread. If you are too lazy to take care what to post where it is exactly my duty to remind you ... the same with this endless discussion on which 052 DDG entered service after what time in comparison to US DDGs in the Type 003 thread; it's irrelevant.


Again, it is not my intention to stop any meaningful and serious discussion, but to take care that we are not going too far off topic!
 
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Xizor

Captain
Registered Member
Are these details about WS-20 cross verified and accurate?

It consists of a 1-stage fan, a 3-stage supercharged compressor, a 7-stage high-pressure compressor, a short-ring combustion chamber, a 1-stage high-pressure turbine, and a 3-stage low-pressure turbine. Convergence nozzle and full authority digital control (FADEC) system.


I don't think it can be compared to CFM-56 series. Stages aren't adding up.
 

Tirdent

Junior Member
Registered Member
Agree, that doesn't seem right. An engine based on the WS-10 core should have 9 HPC stages, and the expected BPR (>4) would very likely require more than 3 LPT stages.

With cutting-edge technology (i.e. CJ-1000A or better) it might be possible to execute the CFM56 thermodynamic cycle with only 7 HPC and 3 LPT stages, but that doesn't seem to fit the timescale and claimed heritage of the WS-20.
 
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siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
This is the problem of the Chinese engineer. They are too afraid to take a risk and don't believe in their own capability. Always depends on western tech. Why not just put WS-20 engine in C919 and do more testing. DON'T be afraid of failure because USA also start with failure too. China government need to ban airbus and Boeing to bring more pressure to engineer. Hard work and pressure is needed for success. Desperate Times Call for Desperate Measures.

Dude, the C-919 is a civilian aircraft with a much higher requirement for engine reliability. WS-20 is not a passenger aircraft engine.
 
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