J-XY/J-35 carrier-borne fighter thread

[Air Force Brat]

There is no official claim, just leaks. The 15T number came because the person who described the J-20 as 16T class described the F-22 as 20T class, so there was the assumption that when he says "class," be means less than, so up to 15.99T was the interpretation. However, the next person said that the weight with AL-31X is just under Su-27 empty weight (16.38 tonnes) and with WS-10X is just over Su-27 empty weight, meaning it is around 16.4T. Then, after a long while, the third person said that those who wanted the J-20 to be in the 16T range will be disappointed to learn that it is now 17.5 tonnes in production form. So I believe the last number, 17.5 tonnes. I'm not sure which big Shrimp it was but I think it was a fellow who worked in the WS-10 factory.

So here our friend has finally confessed his 15T was a total fabrication, (remember his 25% overall weight reduction claim?) reality is finally soaking in, he's back up to 17.5Ts

"no official claim, just leaks"

my work is done here

 

[manqiangrexue]

The problem is with your grandiose claims and then your attempts at obfuscation when being called out. You have yet to present any evidence besides offering ridicule as if you can hide behind such tactics. It does not work with me. .

I don't think even you know what you just wrote. It's nonsense.

A big shrimp's word is generally the best evidence one could hope for on this forum. What evidence do you want? Western-published paper? Someone snuck into Chengdu's factory and took a picture of a ground scale that J-20 happened to be on? LOL Gimme an example.

So here our friend has finally confessed his 15T was a total fabrication, (remember his 25% overall weight reduction claim?) reality is finally soaking in, he's back up to 17.5Ts

"no official claim, just leaks"

my work is done here

Oh your work is done here because it's 17.5T? Man, your work sure is easy, since it started at 17.5T and after your work is done, it's now 17.5T!
https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/j-...rrier-borne-fighter.t8173/page-32#post-567202

Read the whole statement above. Nothing has changed and nobody has admitted anything other than the original statement. A 25% reduction was discussed discussed a long long time ago when the only source at the time said that the then current J-20 is 16T. Mathematically, that is ~25% less than 19.7T; it cannot be disputed. But after that, since the big shrimp said that the weight rose to 17.5T in the final product, of course the reduction is no longer 25% but rather 12.6% (assuming very similar volume). The only pure fabrication is the 19T claim. The 15T is something that came from a wording technicality that I myself debunked when ougoah brought it up (https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/j-...rrier-borne-fighter.t8173/page-35#post-567394). As a matter of fact, it is you who originally could not accept that J-20 is lighter than F-22, pinning it at 21T and then saying maybe it's 19T, but now, you like 17.5 cus it's heavier than 16. I have merely retold the story, which you at first could not accept because apparently, it's beyond your understanding of 3D printing.

See? I remember everything, Brat, and you can't even correctly recall a conversation 4 pages ago.

 

[taxiya]

If I understand the issue of additive parts conversation, the following claim was the genesis.
"They were talking about some 40% weight savings over the comparable parts (such as the bulk-heads) of the F-22 design."

The claim itself may be factually true but the claim may be highly misleading because actual weight reduction may be limited and questionable at best as suggested by AFB.

As is often said "proof is in the pudding". Given all the Phd;'s, experts and breakthrough in weight savings as claimed, the J-20 is still a heavy bird at 19 tons. Are you saying that the 40 % weight savings breakthrough is delivering only this end result?

Just to be clear, my involvement was only about "product strength between additive fabrication and traditional fabrication", neither supporting nor rejecting the claim of 40% weight saving. Neither do I believe the 19 tons (dry mass) claim for which there is no proof.

 

[Deino]

Ok guys ... you are now off topic by a wide margin and in fact this quite strange duscussion based on super-speculative assumptions mixed with theoretical conclusions and personnel issues has nothing to do anymore with the future naval fighter. Just stop this.

 

[Air Force Brat]

No doubt J-XY will indeed use many new and innovative construction techniques to build in strength and toughness, should it be a upgrade FC-31, it would indeed benefit from better engines and avionics as well.

So lots of exciting things continue to happen in Chinese Naval aviation....

 

[Inst]

17.5 is believable when you consider Titanium weight savings.

As for the J-20 in carrier mode, TVC will help with slow-speed maneuverability. Moreover, it has greater lift at high AOA due to its body lift format (the J-20 should have 20% more lift when body lift kicks in vs conventional canard deltas due to lerx canard lerx delta config).

 

[Schwerter_]

Indeed, Minnie is well known since years for several reports that are so much off, sometimes plain wrong against all which is confirmed by images and much more reliable sources. She always refers to "unknow" soures or "another military source close to" says ... and still reports, the J-15 are powered yb WS-10H, the J-20 already uses pre-serial WS-15 ... and so on.

Thanks, I thought the "anonymous source" sounded suspicious.

 

[Schwerter_]

Indeed, Minnie is well known since years for several reports that are so much off, sometimes plain wrong against all which is confirmed by images and much more reliable sources. She always refers to "unknow" soures or "another military source close to" says ... and still reports, the J-15 are powered yb WS-10H, the J-20 already uses pre-serial WS-15 ... and so on.

Thanks, I thought the "anonymous source" sounded suspicious.

 

[SinoSoldier]

Supposedly something to do with the J-XY. If someone is able to provide a translation, that'd be great.

Original post from "angadow":

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【总师的话还是要听的】现在的很多网友真是搞不明白啊，总师这个级别的人是不会胡乱说话的，尤其对这群搞技术的大拿来说。海四什么时候出来，大四处于什么水平，人家把能说的都说了…

 

[siegecrossbow]

Supposedly something to do with the J-XY. If someone is able to provide a translation, that'd be great.

Original post from "angadow":

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View attachment 55383
View attachment 55384

Crux of the matter is that China's next generation naval fighter will be unveiled before 2020. Yang Wei claimed that the U.S. is the only first tier country in military aviation. China, Russia, and Europe are in the second tier and it took China a lot of effort to catch up to the second tier. Chinese civilian aviation still needs work.