China Flanker Thread II

[Hyperwarp]

@Hyperwarp ... I would have to disagree with you, remember J-11A and early J-11B use AL-31x series ... and no issues at all. I believe the main reason WS-10A is used for most J-11B and later is because Chinese Govt would promote indigenous engine, for J-10C (and prototype J10B) and later WS-10x variant will be used.

If China had decided to use AL-31x for all variant J11x, I am pretty sure Russia would be extremely happy to sell those

All J-11/11A use AL-31F. All 95 of them. Russia still continues to supply spares for them and other Flankers such as Su-30MKK/MK2 and probably the newest Su-27UBK.

J-11B in-contrast was always a WS-10 based fighter. Even the very 1st batch of the J-11B had WS-10 from the beginning but the fleet was grounded and had to be re-engined with AL-31F. Those AL-31F were not bought from Russia. PLAAF/SAC had to scavenge those AL-31F from other aircraft until the WS-10 problems were sorted out. Rumor is that they were cannibalized from the earliest Su-27SK or taken from spares bought for the early Su-27SK.

 

[antiterror13]

@Hyperwarp ... J-11 are part of the contract, but J-11A are not as China scrapped all SU-27 after only 95........ and still Russia supplied AL-31x for J-11A

 

[Hyperwarp]

@Hyperwarp ... J-11 are part of the contract, but J-11A are not as China scrapped all SU-27 after only 95........ and still Russia supplied AL-31x for J-11A

Huh?!

The agreement between China and Russia was for 200 Su-27 variant built locally under the designation J-11. The difference between the J-11 and J-11A are minor. Some avionics, number of cockpit MFD, missile compatibility, etc. The earlier J-11 may have been upgraded to J-11A standard. SAC may have made further modifications to those J-11 on the their own. J-11 1st flew late 1998 and J-11A late 1999. Both J-11 and J-11A fall under the initial license of 200 jets. Russia directly provided provided kits for the 1st 60, after that SAC would have produced them locally excluding the AL-31F.

But after 105 were produced China switched to its own J-11B. J-11B and its subsequent variants like J-15, J-16 do not fall under that agreement. Russia only supplies spares for the 105 J-11/11A that were built as well as other flankers purchased directly like the Su-30MKK and MK2.

 

[antiterror13]

deleted

 

[Air Force Brat]

it's actually amazing they found enough AL-31F to field 20+ J-15s. I don't know where they got that many AL-31F lying around considering that Russians are definitely watching to prevent China from building their own flankers.

Heh!, Heh!, Heh!, like two girls fighting for homecoming queen, Russia and China have similar goals?? (STOP USA) Its important to win the beauty contest, but its far, far, more important to keep little SUZY from winning! Besides if you can get the other chick to buy last years "prom dress"? that give you "cashola" to buy a new one with more sequins and bangels?? (ask me how I know this???)

Anyone who doubts this should take a close look at the UN security council vote condemning Israel for building settlements? (Barack Obama revealed his "churlish nature" to the whole world? in order to stick his finger in Bibi Netanyahu's and Donald Trump's eyes!)

As the Father of 7 daughters, I have witnessed "power plays, and strategic alliances". At this stage for anyone to doubt China's willingness to give a little to Russia, in order to solidify its own role. Russia will make sure China has enough AL-31F to build enough Flankers to keep the USA busy. Obama's "announced" "Pacific Pivot" backfired as Obama sought to turn the worlds attention away from his weakness to confront Russia on the Ukrainian issue, he inflamed tensions with China, and in fact is directly responsible for both China and Russia "stepping up" to strengthen their own forces, as well as a mutual pact to defeat USA, at first economically, and then militarily!

So the more Flankers the USA has to contemplate contending with, the less energy USA can concentrate on "projecting power" on both fronts, Europe and the China's Eastern and Southern coasts and seaward. That public announcement by the Obama administration was mainly put out there to "deceive itself" into believing they were "world class"?? what nonsense?

This "alliance" will celebrate 100 years of cooperation with the 100 year anniversary of "RED OCTOBER"? If indeed Russia has sold the Chinese those much talked about and contentious SU-35s, and if China has indeed purchased them?????? the fix is in.

 

[tphuang]

I don't see why the Russian wouldn't sell AL-31x series to China, even for J-15 .... China is unstopable (and Russians know that) whatever Russia would do, so better sell them when you still can

because Russia considers these to be clones of their flankers. They are not going to willingly help China in this process. Any AL-31F that China gets are most likely engines that are supposed to be used for replacements.

 

[FORBIN]

@Hyperwarp ... J-11 are part of the contract, but J-11A are not as China scrapped all SU-27 after only 95........ and still Russia supplied AL-31x for J-11A

Huh?!

The agreement between China and Russia was for 200 Su-27 variant built locally under the designation J-11. The difference between the J-11 and J-11A are minor. Some avionics, number of cockpit MFD, missile compatibility, etc. The earlier J-11 may have been upgraded to J-11A standard. SAC may have made further modifications to those J-11 on the their own. J-11 1st flew late 1998 and J-11A late 1999. Both J-11 and J-11A fall under the initial license of 200 jets. Russia directly provided provided kits for the 1st 60, after that SAC would have produced them locally excluding the AL-31F.

But after 105 were produced China switched to its own J-11B. J-11B and its subsequent variants like J-15, J-16 do not fall under that agreement. Russia only supplies spares for the 105 J-11/11A that were built as well as other flankers purchased directly like the Su-30MKK and MK2.

No antiterror13 Hyperwarp get right J-11A are the last J-11 build with especialy a better radar seems about 40 on 105 after Russians discovered the J-11B happy... stopping providing the kits to manufacture the aircraft... and others deals in progress for 48 Su-30MK2/3 and eventualy Su-33 canceled.

 

[FORBIN]

As agreed in principle in 1995, Russia consented in 1996 to allow China to co-produce as many as 200~250 Sukhoi Su-27SK Flanker-B single-seat multirole fighters under license, initially consisting of assembly from Russian kit. China has designated the Su-27SK Flanker's Chinese version, which is being produced at Shenyang Aircraft Industry Co. (SAC), as the J-11 Flanker. The first 1st Fighter Division received the J-11s in 2002. The 1st Fighter Division's J-11 Flanker were modern and long-range fighters.

And

Chinese People's Liberation Army Air Force Shenyang Military Region in early 2003

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The first unit to receive J-11 is 2nd Division (6th Regiment Suixi) but a part only 9 replacingSu-27
First full Rgt : Anshan/ 1st Div/1st Rgt first Rgt in 2001/02 replacing J-8F after do transition on J-11B in 2008, 24 fighters.

 

[siegecrossbow]

Rumor has it that WS-10 equipped J-11Bs wiped the floor with J-10s, Su-30s, and J-11As. Does this mean that the WS-10s are finally ready?

 

[Deino]

Rumor has it that WS-10 equipped J-11Bs wiped the floor with J-10s, Su-30s, and J-11As. Does this mean that the WS-10s are finally ready?

Pardon, but WS-10-equipped J-11B are not really new !??

Or did I miss Your point???

Deino