East China Sea Air Defense ID Zone

[Schumacher]

Re: US incursion in new Chinese ADIZ: no reaction from China

That article is so full of drivel I'm just going to ignore it.


In any case, this is a drawing of the progress of the B-52 bombers.
Hardly worth intercepting given their lumbering progress literally on the edge of the ADIZ.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

So that's why the western media en masse choose not to report the Chinese statement about 200KM to the east of Diaoyu. It would put the flight route outside of the zone.
Looking at the flight path, the B52s seems to be there to acknowledge the zone rather than defy it.

China should consider declaring an ADIZ in the south pole, USAF will then be forced to fly there regularly to 'defy' it taking resources away from their trainings. lol

 

[Schumacher]

Re: US incursion in new Chinese ADIZ: no reaction from China

Classical case of media making stuff up as they go again to attract attention.

I think the U.S. response was measured, considering the fact that it was planned before the zone was implemented. I'm sure that the goal of the U.S. Military is not to escalate the already high tension in the area by flying over disputed territory and circling for hours on end. That is not the reasonable thing to do. Since the original flight plan involved skirting the air defense zone, and the U.S. has no intention of recognizing it, of course they are not going to abide by the rules. But both the Chinese and Western media played it up like some sort of huge humiliating event to the general populace.

This is not the late 19th century any more. Media, please report accurately instead of acting like an attention whore all the time. Stop instigating conflicts!

Well, don't just blame the media for it. The Pentagon clearly wanted these effects. It was no accident they left out the flight path knowing full well the effects would have very different otherwise, that's why my first post asked for details & evidence, not just words from an official.

 

[port_08]

Airliners out of safety would file compliance. I would see step by step, it's a long game and would see who follow. The screw can be tighten in steps.

The next step, if these airliners want to operate "safely", they have to file their flight plans, if not would be block by military jet and ask for diversion.

Knowing business $$$ , money talks, bullshit walks world...nobody want to be inconvenience and waste fuel, risk safety of being accidentally shot down while flying accross the ADIZ.

They just need to identify, keep communication, file their flight plan to the Chinese authority..as simple as that. =)

Although government (Korea, Japan etc) can make noises, but business talks.

Already, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Philippines, Singapore been filling compliance.

Japan, Korea can posture here and there...but China is there. The missiles are there, jets are there...civilian aircraft don't have missile. Who wants to play chicken?

The only alternative, don't fly to China...don't do business. Want business, comply.

Well, don't just blame the media for it. The Pentagon clearly wanted these effects. It was no accident they left out the flight path knowing full well the effects would have very different otherwise, that's why my first post asked for details & evidence, not just words from an official.

I think that China more concern with civilian aspect of it. For sure, no egoistic pride of any nation military worth it salt would want to comply with the ADIZ rule. Probably the reaction already calculated and known.

The aspect here is what 99% of the other would think? the normal john, janes, the lees and the abes, average joes who got nothing to do with government military stance and propaganda.

Imagine you're a passenger of JAL, travelling to China, sitting in your nice business class...you dare play chicken with PLA? yeah, hell yeah, go Captain Yamato, dare the PLA hailing you and don't care, a flying cruise straight to hell...yes. Would you dare? Nobody is innocent, they don't deserve to die....I just going for a holiday...hell yeah, I still got to feed the fishes at home...screw the ADIZ...

When many start to comply...then we see the effect. These things takes time..

..And in past economic disputes - Japan has backed down.
..

I think so as well. A nation with the stronger economy have the stronger military. They can afford to spend, doll up their hardware, beef up the weapon system. While the bad economy, shrinks and shrivel their military, cut spending here and there. If you have a strong economy you need to invest in military, more destroyers, carriers and so on.

Japan need to become economically strong, pump more money to inflate to overcome China.

 

[Jeff Head]

Re: World News Thread & Breaking News!!

China Says it RESERVE the Right to take defensive measure against intruding US planes. Keep in mind the word RESERVE.

What kind of defensive measures? Could it like the hainan incidence send a plane up there to Collide with B52, probraby a UAV and then claim that as ACCIDENT. I believed last time that US spy plane had to force to land in Hainan after the collision.

So, don't be cocky.

BigWang, you are new to the forum and have posted very few times. Welcome to SD.

Of course, as myself and others have already discussed on this thread and on others, I understand what the Chinese statement about the ADIZ says and means. That was not really the issue of my post anyhow.

As to your "warning" to me not to get, "cocky." I have posted my sincere feelings regarding this issue in a reasoned manner and without rancor. So, with that in mind, let me help regarding a few things about SD. Please read and understand the following.

Do not accuse people (either myself, or others on this forum) of things like this without much more evidence....and then if you feel you do have such evidence, contact another Moderator on SD about it via PM instead of positing it as you have done. Those are the rules on SD. Please read them and follow them.

If you have problems with moderation and complaint about moderation, PM directly it directly to Webmaster or the moderator in question or another moderator.

Also, I would suggest that you be very careful about threatening, or using veiled threats, about actual fighting between the US and China, Japan and China, or any other nations. We try to retain professionalism on SD without anger, emotion, or any of that. Trying to use an unfortunate incident ten years old to score points or as a veiled threat is not appropriate here on SD.

Not allowed: Posts that prompt hatred between different countries or groups of people. This includes, "Nationalistic chest thumping."

No offense intended to you, BigWang, just hoping you will read the rules and follow them as you post here on SD.

Thanks. (BTW, the Blue Text indicates moderator instructions regarding posting on SD)

Follow the instructions of the moderators. Do not quote or question a moderators instructions in blue or red text.

FORUM RULES

 

[vesicles]

Re: US incursion in new Chinese ADIZ: no reaction from China

Can anyone confirm that Liaoning was actually sent to the Diaoyu islands? Is the exercise mentioned in the vicinity of Diaoyu islands, or Liaoning is simply passing through?

 

[FarkTypeSoldier]

Re: US incursion in new Chinese ADIZ: no reaction from China

Can anyone confirm that Liaoning was actually sent to the Diaoyu islands? Is the exercise mentioned in the vicinity of Diaoyu islands, or Liaoning is simply passing through?

All news now are that CV-16 are gong to the south seas for training only but didn't mention which area.

But the fact thanks Diary Islands are in the south seas means a chance for western media to blow things up!

 

[Jeff Head]

Re: US incursion in new Chinese ADIZ: no reaction from China

Can anyone confirm that Liaoning was actually sent to the Diaoyu islands? Is the exercise mentioned in the vicinity of Diaoyu islands, or Liaoning is simply passing through?

From all I have read, the Liaoning and her group are heading into the SCS. Now, how close did they pass to the islands as the transited past them on the way south? I honestly do not know.

 

[joshuatree]

Re: US incursion in new Chinese ADIZ: no reaction from China

From all I have read, the Liaoning and her group are heading into the SCS. Now, how close did they pass to the islands as the transited past them on the way south? I honestly do not know.

Without knowing the actual transit path of the Liaoning CBG, this presents a possible tense scenario. If the CBG sails close to Diaoyu in transit, the Japanese will probably send in their planes for the usual picture taking. In turn, these planes will now be in the overlapping ADIZ, so what happens in that situation will be interesting. Scramble and intercept?

 

[chuck731]

Re: US incursion in new Chinese ADIZ: no reaction from China

Shouldn't this thread move to the Strategic Defence Forum or the Member's Club?

It doesn't involve much Air Force.

 

[plawolf]

Re: US incursion in new Chinese ADIZ: no reaction from China

While I agree that this was more of a media and political exercise by the US that was blown out of all rational and sane proportions by the media, it was still a mistake by the PLA to not intercept the B52s.

This was the very first case of foreign aircraft intruding into China's ADIZ without complying with its rules, and how China responds matters. It does not matter that the B52s only skirted the edges of the zone, all that matters is they entered at all.

As soon as they did that, someone from the PLA air defence monitoring station should have radioed them a warning that they have entered China's ADIZ and asked them to ID themselves and activate transponders etc while at the same time fighters should have been scrambled.

All those fighters had to do was simply to fly to those bombers and keep in formation with them until they left the ADIZ. If the fighters didn't have the fuel to do that, replacements should have been sent to take over without loosing visual of the B52.

That would have been established in no uncertain terms that China means business with its ADIZ, but also assure the US somewhat that China would not interfere with freedom of navigation in its declared ADIZ even if you don't follow the rules. It would also have been good training for the PLAAF pilots and C&C operators.