J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread IV (Closed to posting)

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flateric

Junior Member
I see the concept picture says "Navy" on the F/A-XX, where's the Air Force version?

officially released F-X concept drawings

Boeing

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Lockheed Martin

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Nortrop Grumman

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Schumacher

Senior Member
Perhabs you knows more about the background of this article more than i do (i dont navigate chinese internet) but this article doesnt mention WS-15 anywhere. Perhabs people assume it is WS-15 that is being tested, but WS-15 isnt mentioned in the article.

Even if this is WS-15, that means that WS-15 is still in simulator tests, and that it still hasnt been tested in flight. But this is speculation at this point.

Yes, I know more about the background. It's ok if you don't want to believe.
What's more important to note is not to hold your breath waiting for China's official press to spell out the names of WS15 or other projects for you. At best you'll end up years late with your PLA news, at worst, it'll damage your health.
 
Yes, I know more about the background. It's ok if you don't want to believe.
What's more important to note is not to hold your breath waiting for China's official press to spell out the names of WS15 or other projects for you. At best you'll end up years late with your PLA news, at worst, it'll damage your health.

I love the ending.
 

latenlazy

Brigadier
Where is Kroko?. Here is the latest on WS 15 Turbo fan engine. it is now entering high altitude test from CDF bing translation by Alex first posted by GT in Chinese

WS15 prototype into the high altitude tests

Development of weaving. "Emei" aeroengine technical validation machines in May 2006, running successfully for the first time. This indicates that China's independently developed aero engines and achieved a historic leap on the road, journey in the development of China's fourth generation of medium fighter represented a major step towards a solid. In March 2007 a prototype machine bench running successfully for the first time, is scheduled for completion March 2013 engine design type testing July 2014 train the production engine.
Basic information
Brand: turbofan 15
Name: "Fabri" turbofan engine
Applications: military turbofan engine
Type: Turbo-fan Jet engine
Architect: River and
Research Unit: Institute of gas turbine in China
Manufacturer: XI ' an engine company in Guizhou liyang Aero Engine Corporation
Machine object
WS-15-10 for J-10M (export)
WS-15-CJ for a landing at the opening of the vertical/short takeoff fighter
(CJ is the first vertical take off and landing fighter Chuizhiqijiang Jianjiji-letter abbreviation)
WS-15X for double-billing heavy stealth fighter J20 of the leading test flight
Technical data
Max afterburning thrust: 16186.5daN
Thrust: 10522daN
Afterburning specific fuel consumption: 2.02kg/daN/h
Intermediate consumption: 0.665kg/daN/h
Thrust-weight ratio: 8.86
Air flow rate: 138kg/s
Ducted: 0.382
Overall pressure ratio: 28.71
Turbine inlet temperature: 1477
Maximum diameter: 1.02m
Length: 5.05m
Quality: 1862.3kg
Research and development background
In the Russian Yu 1992 spring began expand hard negotiations, in after 3 years of saw zhihou, because Russia of economic situation is poor, for military research of funding rarely rarely, and because in 92 Minsk maqiulisha Conference ya grams-141 is terminated Hou, P-79 engine no has using object, and no other of fighter using this engine, so "Union" aviation engine research production Consortium (original Paul mansky engine design Bureau) of economic situation is poor, in this situation Xia, In June 1995, Russia signed a transfer P-79 engine production license agreements. In August 1996, Russia "Union" aero-engine research and production association P-79 engine was delivered to the Chinese side a full set of design drawings and technical information, in particular the introduction of the P-79 engine core production equipment and manufacturing process information. Unfortunately for Jacques-141 P-79B-300 engine nozzle technology has not been.
Subsequently, in 1998 during the Asian financial crisis Russia economy into a multiple crisis, China not only purchase the P-79B-300 engine for Jacques-141 vectoring techniques, while Moscow has also been made Union thrust of Aero-Engine technology development group for 20-ton R179-300 engine design and P-79M design drawings and technical data. R179-300 engine this engine is for vertical takeoff fighter Jacques 141 research and further development of R-79V-300 engines.
In this context, early in 1996, Jiang and Liu Da together academicians is responsible for organizing the "95" national defence major background (vertical take off and landing fighter plan) pre-research project--a new turbofan engine (based on the P-79 engine for further development) critical technical pre-research work. Organization P-79 engine core machine mapping of generic work; P-79 engine high pressure compressor, combustor, turbine, three core components such as imitation of surveying and mapping work. For theory method, and calculation method and test method of exploration research; to breakthrough advanced parts key technology mainly, focus around three large high pressure parts, proportion full size test pieces of design and trial and the test to and related of strength, and control, system for integrated application research, in three large core parts of mapping imitation in the, bold advocates used has aviation power many frontier design technology results and large application material, and new technology, to breakthrough has more than 120 more than items key technology.
624 has made Moscow Union thrust of Aero-Engine technology development group for 20-ton R179-300 engine design and P-79M design drawings and technical information, YWH 130-27 core engine has been developed, YWH 130-core 27 core engine is based on the P-79 engine as the basis for further development. CJ-2000 is based on YWH 130-27 core engine for further development, WS-15 is CJ-2000 code model development.
Research and development process
After the 1999 national day, 624 references R179-300 and P-79M engine designs, launched to YWH 130-27 improvement based on the core engine design, in competition for next-generation fighter aircraft Jian -13 engine, win 2000 was selected as the conventional fighter-13 singles in early abdominal DSI intake stealth fighter aircraft of power plant layout. The number is WS-15, named "Emei" turbofan engines. Parent request "WS-15" engine development to the full implementation of a new national military standard GJB241-87 "General specification for aviation Turbo-Jet and turbofan engines and completely implement the structural integrity of the engine framework. Also decided to include development of WS-15 is divided into three phases: the development of three high-voltage performance parts and core research, develop, validate and prototype development. This WS-15 project development, this is my first time to follow "-the key to technical breakthroughs in basic research-advanced development-model-validation machine parts-core machine" the development model of turbofan engine development work, therefore it can be said that is of landmark significance! Comprehensive development work began in early 2000.
From China gas turbine Institute (624 by) work will Shang was informed that, my themselves development of thrust thrust-weight than for 9 of turbine fan aviation engine of core machine CJ2000 Yu on April 14, 2005 first ignition success Hou, thrust-weight than for 9 of turbine fan aviation engine of core machine has Yu July 2005 early in Taiwan frame running test Shi, various performance full reached has design indicators, speed push to ground Supreme speed (conversion speed 102.2%)-----"e eyebrow" Aeroengine technical validation machines in May 2006, running successfully for the first time. This indicates that China's independently developed aero engines and achieved a historic leap on the road, journey in the development of China's fourth generation of medium fighter represented a major step towards a solid. In March 2007 a prototype machine bench running successfully for the first time, is expected in June 2009, "Fabri" engine of the prototype machine will complete the FRET (flight identification before the pilot phase), is scheduled for completion March 2013 engine design type testing July 2014 train the production engine.
Overview of engine
Aircraft mission requirements, "Fabri" Aero-Engine on the cycle parameters selected using higher turbine inlet temperature, medium ducted of overall pressure ratio and lower than. Used of technology main has injury capacity limited and efficient of wide string leaves, and three dimensional viscous leaves turbines design method, and overall leaves disc structure of fan and pressure gas machine, and single crystal gas cold turbine leaves, and powder metallurgical turbine disc, and brush type seal strict, and resin base composite outside culvert machine magazine, and overall type Afterburner combustion chamber design, and ceramic base composite nozzle regulation tablets, and ternary vector nozzle and has fault diagnosis and State monitoring capacity of double more than degrees type full digital type electronic control system. Engine is composed of 10 units.
Engine structure and system
Inlet:
Full titanium structure of annular gas inlet casing, with 18 variable camber inlet guide vane, whose front is radial plate, rear adjustable sections, leading-edge air from high pressure compressor ice.
Fans:
Fan 3-stage axial-flow solid titanium alloy for wide-chord fan blades, 1th grade fan blades using the wide chord design, the fan blade removable, with a convex set in the middle. 2nd and 3rd grade fan for linear friction welding technology welding into a blisk structure. Fan casing ring structures, fan rotors make accessible that the 2nd-class disc front and rear are drum loops, and respectively, 1th, level 3 connection. Booster than about 4.01. Level 3 stator and rotors are designed for three-dimensional flow.
High pressure compressor:
6 stage axial-flow high pressure compressor, turbo-charged than the 7.16. First 3 rotor disc structure as a whole, is forging on with electrochemical machining. 3 stage rotor blades after through dovetail Tenon and connections. First 3 stator blade material for titanium alloys. Rotor for hybrid structure of electron beam welded and bolted connections, using three-dimensional flow design. Stator part of inlet guide vane and the 1th, 2 stationary blade adjustable, first 3 disc made from high-temperature titanium alloys, 2nd-class disc front and rear are drum loops, and respectively, 1th, level 3 connection. Di4~6ji plate made from nickel-based high temperature alloy powder metallurgy, using electron beam welding as a whole, long before the bolt connection with a 3rd level together. Overall medium of titanium alloy casing and the outside compressor casing, a borescope peep hole, for the observation of the rotors and other parts.
Combustion chamber:
Used a short loop of combustion chamber type combustion chamber, combustor using porous structure cooling laser drilling, flame tube double floating wall structure as a whole, the outer annular shell as a whole, uses the double nozzle, fuel by 22 biconical nozzle and 22 small swirl Cup out and atomized spray to achieve smoke-free combustion, with uniform temperature field.
High pressure turbine:
High pressure turbine single stage axial-flow, using the second generation single crystal turbine blade material, heat insulation coatings and advanced cooling structure. Single-stage axial-flow, without the Crown, using film cooling plus shock cooling methods. Rotor blades and guide blade material are the second generation of single crystal materials, leaf bore physical vapor deposited thermal barrier coating. Casing lining segment tip clearance control by cooling the air. Rotor blades and guides can be replaced individually. Structure design of the turbine components unit, by the turbine rotor casing, guide, turbine, turbine rear casing and the bearing casing consisting of five components.
LP turbine:
Low pressure turbine single stage axial-flow and high pressure rotor rotating, hollow gas-cooled rotor blades, with ring. Rotor blades can be replaced separately, subparagraph guide valve can be replaced. Low pressure turbine guide vane is still used. Low pressure turbine wheel centers opened with large holes, so that high pressure rotor rear bearing.
Afterburner:
Afterburner style is used, radial flame stabilizers, flame holder from 1 "v" shaped Centre and consists of 36 radial stability of flame stabilizer. Radial fans air cooler used for stability, boost burn resistant titanium alloy to reduce the weight of the cylinder, cylinder insulation sleeve, in the gap between the two flow through the culvert outside air to cool the cylinder, center ring-shaped flame holder made of circular 12, free expansion, flame holder can be mounted in the engine package under the conditions in an aircraft for a replacement.
Nozzle:
A tail-pipe nozzle using whole adjustable convergence, expansion-pitch direction vector nozzle may be used for deflection of ± 25 °. From +25 ° to-25 ° schedule just 1.5 seconds. Used to adjust the aircraft pitch attitude. Equipped with advanced ceramic matrix composites nozzle adjustment.
Control system:
Adoption of thrust vector control system by digital electronic control system of dual-redundancy rights control (FADEC), according to adjust fan speed and core compression ratio engine, and fault isolation.

From post by GT
中国航空新闻网讯:1月15日,中航工业党组书记、董事长林左鸣,在集团公司总工程师葛子干陪同下,到中航工业涡轮院指导工作。

林左鸣深入高空台试验区,现场观摩正在进行的发动机试验,对涡轮院所完成的重点项目任务给予充分肯定。他说,通过长期探索和技术积累,我国航空发动机研制真正走上了自主创新之路。在试验现场,他对辛勤付出的全体参研人员表示衷心感谢。他还听取了涡轮院近一个时期的科研工作汇报后,就其后续工作提出了要求。

2013年,是汶川地震后五周年,涡轮院拟定开展纪念活动来弘扬抗震救灾精神,宣示感恩回报社会,展示灾后重生和发展形象。对此,林左鸣要求:要把“5?12”五周年纪念活动与贯彻落实党的十八大精神结合起来,把伟大的抗震救灾精神内化到科研攻关和完成任务和行动中,把焦点聚集到中华民族伟大复兴的事业上,做出航空人的贡献。

在涡轮院期间,林左鸣会见了绵阳市委副书记、市长林书成一行。林左鸣对绵阳市委、市政府长期以来对航空工业的大力支持表示了感谢。双方就“航空城”等中航工业在绵阳项目进展情况,深化合作事项等进行了交流。

WS-15发动机简介
WS-15全称涡扇15“峨眉” 涡扇发动机,是为我国第四代中型战斗机而研制的小涵道比涡扇发动机。由606所、624所、614所、410厂、430厂和113厂等单位专家组

WS15原型机进入了高空台试验

织研制。“峨眉”航空发动机的技术验证机在2006年5月首次台架运转试车成功。这标志着我国在自主研制航空发动机的道路上又实现了历史性跨越,在研制我国第四代中型战斗机的征程上迈出了坚实的重大一步。2007年3月原形机首次台架运转试车成功,预计2013年3月发动机完成设计定型试验,2014年7月生产型发动机定型。
基本信息
牌号:涡扇15
命名:“峨眉” 涡扇发动机
用途:军用涡扇发动机
类型:涡轮风扇喷气发动机
总设计师:江和甫
研制单位:中国燃气涡轮研究院
生产厂商:西安发动机公司/贵州黎阳航空发动机公司
装机对象
WS-15-10用于J-10M(出口型)
WS-15-CJ用于某在研的垂直降落/短距起飞的歼击机
(CJ是垂直起降歼击机的Chuizhiqijiang Jianjiji字母第一个简写)
WS-15X用于双发单座的重型隐身战斗机J20的领先试飞
技术数据
最大加力推力:16186.5daN
中间推力:10522daN
加力耗油率:2.02kg/daN/h
中间耗油率:0.665kg/daN/h
推重比:8.86
空气流量:138kg/s
涵道比:0.382
总增压比:28.71
涡轮进口温度:1477℃
最大直径:1.02m
长度:5.05m
质量:1862.3kg
研发背景
中俄于1992年春天开始展开艰苦谈判,在经过3年的拉锯之后,因为俄罗斯的经济状况很差,用于军工科研的经费很少很少,又因为在92年明斯克马丘丽莎会议雅克-141被终止后,P-79发动机没有了使用对象,又没有其他的战斗机使用此发动机,所以“联盟”航空发动机科研生产联合体(原图曼斯基发动机设计局)的经济状况很差,在这种状况下,1995年6月,中俄签订了转让P-79发动机生产许可证的协定。1996年8月,俄罗斯的“联盟”航空发动机科研生产联合体向中国方面交付了P-79发动机的全套设计图纸及技术资料 ,特别是引进了制造P-79发动机核心机的生产设备及生产制造工艺资料。遗憾的是用于雅克-141的P-79B-300发动机矢量喷管技术却没有得到。
后来,1998年亚洲金融危机时俄罗斯经济也陷入多重危机,中国此时不仅购买了用于雅克-141的P-79B-300发动机矢量喷管技术,同时也取得了莫斯科联盟航空发动机科技集团研制的推力为20吨的R179-300发动机设计方案和P-79M的设计图纸和技术资料。R179-300发动机这台发动机是为垂直起飞歼击机雅克141研制的R-79V-300发动机的进一步发展。
在这种背景下,1996年初,江和甫协同刘大响院士负责组织“九五”国防重大背景(垂直起降歼击机的计划)的预研项目——某新型涡扇发动机(以P-79发动机为基础进行深度开发)关键技术预研工作。组织完成P-79发动机的核心机的测绘仿制工作;P-79发动机的高压压气机、燃烧室、涡轮三大核心部件等比例的测绘仿制工作。进行理论方法、计算方法和试验方法的探索研究;以突破先进部件关键技术为主,重点围绕三大高压部件等比例全尺寸试验件的工程设计和试制及试验以及其相关的强度、控制等系统进行综合应用研究,在三大核心部件的测绘仿制中,大胆倡导采用了航空动力许多前沿设计技术成果和大量应用新材料、新工艺,从而突破了120余项关键技术。
624所在取得了莫斯科联盟航空发动机科技集团研制的推力为20吨的R179-300发动机设计方案和P-79M的设计图纸和技术资料后, 研制了YWH一30—27核心机,YWH一30—27核心机就是以P-79发动机核心机为基础进行深度开发的.CJ-2000是以YWH一30—27核心机为基础进一步开发的,WS-15是CJ-2000的型号研制的代号。
研发历程
1999年国庆节后, 624所参照R179-300和P-79M的发动机设计方案,推出了以YWH一30—27核心机为基础的改进设计方案,在争夺下一代战斗机歼-13的发动机时,获得胜利,2000年初正式被选定为歼-13单发常规布局腹部DSI进气的隐身歼击机飞机的动力装置。编号为WS-15,命名“峨眉”涡扇发动机。上级要求“WS-15”发动机的研制要全面贯彻新的国军标GJB241-87“航空涡轮喷气和涡轮风扇发动机通用规范和全面贯彻发动机结构完整性大纲。同时决定将WS-15的研制分为三个阶段实施:即三大高压性能部件研制与核心机研制、验证机和原型机的研制。至此WS-15正式立项研制,这是我国首次遵循“基础研究-关键技术突破-先进部件-核心机-验证机-型号研制”这一发展模式所开展的涡扇发动机研制工作,因此可以说是具有里程碑式的意义!全面研制工作于2000年初开始。
从中国燃气涡轮研究院(624所)工作会上获悉,我国自行研制的推力推重比为9的涡轮风扇航空发动机的核心机CJ2000于2005年4月14日首次点火成功后,推重比为9的涡轮风扇航空发动机的核心机已于2005年7月上旬在台架运转试车时,各种性能完全达到了设计指标,转速推到地面最高转速(换算转速102.2%)-----“峨眉”航空发动机的技术验证机在2006年5月首次台架运转试车成功。这标志着我国在自主研制航空发动机的道路上又实现了历史性跨越,在研制我国第四代中型战斗机的征程上迈出了坚实的重大一步。2007年3月原形机首次台架运转试车成功,预计,2009年6月“峨眉”发动机的原型机将完成FRET(飞行前鉴定试验阶段),预计2013年3月发动机完成设计定型试验,2014年7月生产型发动机定型。
发动机综述
按照飞机任务要求,“峨眉”航空发动机在循环参数选择上采用较高的涡轮进口温度、中等总增压比和比较低的涵道比。采用的新技术主要有损伤容限和高效率的宽弦叶片、三维粘性叶轮机设计方法、整体叶盘结构的风扇和压气机、单晶气冷涡轮叶片、粉末冶金涡轮盘、刷式封严、树脂基复合材料外涵机匣、整体式加力燃烧室设计、陶瓷基复合材料喷管调节片、三元矢量喷管和具有故障诊断和状态监控能力的双余度式全权数字式电子控制系统。发动机由10个单元体组成。
发动机结构和系统
进气口:
进气口采用全钛结构环形进气机匣,带18个可变弯度的进口导流叶片,其前部为径向支板,后部为可调部分, 前缘则以来自高压压气机的空气防冰。
风扇:
风扇采用3级轴流式宽弦实心钛合金风扇叶片,第1级风扇叶片采用宽弦设计,风扇叶片可拆换,带有中间凸台。第2和第3级风扇为用线性摩擦焊技术焊接成的整体叶盘结构。风扇机匣是整环结构,风扇转子作成可拆卸的,即第2级盘前、后均带鼓环,分别与第1、3级盘连接。增压比约为4.01。3级静子和转子均为三维流设计。
高压压气机:
高压压气机采用6级轴流式,增压比7.16。前3级转子为整体叶盘结构,是在锻坯上用电化学加工出来的。后3级转子叶片通过燕尾形榫头与盘连接。前3级定子叶片材料为钛合金。转子为电子束焊和螺栓连接的混合结构,采用三维流技术设计。定子部分进口导流叶片和第1、2级静子叶片为可调,前3级盘用高温钛合金制成,第2级盘前、后均带鼓环,分别与第1、3级盘连接。第 4~ 6级盘由镍基高温合金粉末冶金制成,用电子束焊焊为一体,用长螺栓前与第3级盘连在一起。钛合金整体中介机匣和对开的压气机机匣,设有孔探仪窥孔,用以观察转子和其他部件。
燃烧室:
燃烧室采用短环式燃烧室,火焰筒采用激光打孔的多孔结构进行冷却,火焰筒为整体双层浮壁式结构,外层为整体环形壳体,采用双通路喷嘴,燃油经22个双锥喷嘴和22个小涡流杯喷出并雾化,实现无烟燃烧,具有均匀的出口温度场。
高压涡轮:
高压涡轮采用单级轴流式,采用国内第二代单晶涡轮叶片材料、隔热涂层和先进冷却结构。单级轴流式,不带冠,采用气膜冷却加冲击冷却方式。转子叶片和导向器叶片材料均为国内第二代单晶材料,叶身上有物理气相沉积的隔热涂层。机匣内衬扇形段通过冷却空气进行叶尖间隙控制。转子叶片和导向器可单独更换。涡轮部件采用单元体结构设计 ,由涡轮转子、导向器、涡轮机匣、涡轮后机匣和轴承机匣等五个组件组成。
低压涡轮:
低压涡轮采用单级轴流式,与高压转子对转,空心气冷转子叶片,带冠。转子叶片均可单独更换,导向器叶片可分段更换。仍然采用了低压涡轮导向器。低压涡轮轮盘中心开有大孔,以便安装高压转子的后轴承。
加力燃烧室:
加力燃烧室采用整体式,采用径向火焰稳定器,火焰稳定器由1圈“V”形中心火焰稳定器与36根径向稳定器组成。径向稳定器用风扇空气冷却,加力筒体采用阻燃钛合金以减轻重量,筒体内作有隔热套筒,两者间的缝隙中流过外涵空气对筒体进行冷却,中心环形火焰稳定器沿圆周做成12段,可以自由膨胀,整套火焰稳定器可以在发动机装在飞机上的条件下进行更换。
尾喷管:
尾喷管采用全程可调收敛、扩张式三元矢量喷管—在俯仰方向可作±25°偏转。从+25°到-25°的行程中只需1.5秒钟。用于调整飞机俯仰飞行姿态。装有先进的陶瓷基复合材料的尾喷管调节片。
控制系统:
控制系统采用推力和矢量由双余度全权限数字电子控制系统控制(FADEC),按风扇转速和核心机压比调节发动机工作,有故障隔离功能。

I don't really buy this article either. The move from design test to production test seems far too optimistic. Nonetheless, those dates give us something testable.
 

MiG-29

Banned Idiot
officially released F-X concept drawings

Boeing

If i was going to design a fighter i would skip the canard, a few months ago i was at Paralay`s and i saw a drawing that really inspired me, i made this small model
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I find the LEVCON more interesting than canards and skipped the the horizontal tail by adding wing trailing edge extentions like the MiG-1.44 but of course i guess is possible to skip the vertical tail with TVC nozzles, but still 2D TVC nozzles might force a tail.
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MiG-29

Banned Idiot
Actually, IMHO its never wise to completely skip the vertical or horizontal stabs, even if like the J-20 and Pak Fa you end up with smaller all flying surfaces, their inclusion takes a lot of guesswork out of aerodynamics and the flight control systems. On a bomber or aircraft with a limited need for manueverability, it obviously is more stealthy, (ie B-2), but I suspect that even Boeings new bird will grow a set, once things get serious, if indeed they are going for kinemetic exceptionalism as they state. But we shall see, thank-you for showing us your work on the model, it does help us understand where you're coming from, and indeed clean sheet aeronautic design while very entertaining, eventually does have to come back to the real world, and why all airplanes do look something alike.

I do agree, I'm not a big canard fan, but as the J-20 proves it is certainly a viable concept, it just doesn't appeal to me aesthetically. Brat

Brat

Aircraft design is part an art and part a science, i have a book very illustrating about it, it is titled "Fundamentals of aircraft design" and it has a really funny joke about aircraft design, it says if the group in charge of propulsion would had designed an aircraft without limits they would had fit six engines into the Eurofighter, if the Eurofighter`s flight control group would have had no limits they would have fit giant canards and vertical tail, the undercarriage group would had fit eight landing gears instead of 3.

I mean aircraft design is a compromise in itself.

I guess it is possible for example redesign J-20 with no vertical tail and no canards, but they need a balance between the different design departments in an aircraft.

I guess as i see the advance in fire over the shoulder capability of helmetless high offbored missiles (HHOBS) in modern fighters in the future they will skip more aerodynamic surfaces since agilility in terms of turn or roll is less important.

I do not think the Boeing concept is very agile without the use of TVC nozzles and i do not think it will need to be very agile having HHOBS, in reality they need to be faster, stealthier with a bit of agility only.

So who knows perhaps the J-20++ variant of 2025 will skip the tail and the canard too.

But i agree, the tails are usually reduced in size with TVC nozzles, but still they need a tail.

But the trailing edge extentions on MiG-1.44 work as pitch control.
Basicly they help it as it was a triplane
 

kroko

Senior Member
Yes, I know more about the background. It's ok if you don't want to believe.
What's more important to note is not to hold your breath waiting for China's official press to spell out the names of WS15 or other projects for you. At best you'll end up years late with your PLA news, at worst, it'll damage your health.

Im not saying that you are wrong, but people here can claim whatever they want, but without presenting sources, or something, i (and i think others too) wont believe. Is that ok? you can bet it.

And no, it wont damage my health. I dont care that much about WS-15. If it flounders, i wouldnt give a damn.
 
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