Next Generation DDG and FFG thread (after 055, 052D, 054B)
- Thread starter ACuriousPLAFan
- Start date
It could either be March or May, though given that the comnent was made on May 7th, hence I thought that the more probable month would be March.
Could be wrong, though.
Assuming this is intended to be a new 055 variant or an 055 successor, it could be a credible reasoning for the 2nd batch being only 6 hulls instead of 8. The remaining 4 are all launched and outfitting already for quite a while, and no other new hulls have been seen since.
But we did hear about new 055 orders from Yankee et al, I expect 055 and 055B/057 to be built concurrently until the next 5YP which has apparently been the tradition from the dawn of time.
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There are already 45 Type-052C/D, and the vast majority of these will not reach a 30 year service life for another 17 years.
That should be enough for anticipated missions (eg. 3 per carrier group, SAGs, etc)
So instead of developing and building 2 modern destroyer classes (which would end up very similar - 9K tonnes versus 12k tonnes), they might as well just focus on Type-055 construction. There isn't the expense to develop a new Type-052D sized successor design and it will be more efficient to just build more Type-055, which is a mature design now.
The Type-055 is larger, so is better suited to distant blue-water operations anyway.
Plus this may free up shipyard capacity and funds for additional aircraft carriers.
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But if they do find they need a new 9000 tonne general purpose destroyer, there are another 15 years before they have to start construction, so they can afford to wait and ensure there is a modern up-to-date design, whilst still going with the Type-055.
The main issue with the 052C/D fleet is that they might not have enough onboard power generation for expected future capability requirements. I think there’s a possibility that the 052C/Ds eventually get downgraded into a frigate role and a 9k tonne class takes over as the mainstay destroyer fleet while a new 18k to 20k tonne class gets slotted into the flagship cruiser role. The 055s then become a tweener class that can either fill in some fleet flagship roles or fulfill mainstay destroyer duties.
We know the Type-052C/D don't have enough electricity generation for the future, which is why we've long been expecting them to stop production and be replaced.
But "future capability requirements" essentially means two 600kW point defence lasers to replace the CIWS and HHQ-10. So call it a total power draw of 4MW. This doesn't detract from the primary mission of long-range air defence.
The Type-052C/D do have large AESA radar panels and the UVLS, which should still be effective in 30 years time. So I don't think they will be downgraded from the long-range air defence role. In carrier groups, I expect they will still serve as picket ships on the threat axis.
In comparison, Frigates are a lot less capable with a small rotating AESA radar and a lot less VLS cells.
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As for a new 18-20K tonne ship, what would be its role?
Fleet flagship or mainstream destroyer is too vague I think.
For long-range air defence, the Type-055 has 112 VLS cells, which should be enough.
I imagine a slight larger version could fit 128 VLS cells, if required
A larger 18-20k ship only makes sense if:
a) it can't resupply, such as in scenarios where it is operating by itself, without air cover and replenishment. But then you want something like a nuclear-powered Kirov battlecruiser or Trump battleship. My view is that China would be better off building additional aircraft carriers instead.
b) you want to add significant long-range strike capability (like with CPS cells?) or need the space for an enhanced BMD capability.
The DDGX was supposed to be able to swap 32VLS cells for 12 CPS cells. For the BMD mission, the Type-055 should already be able to handle the power draw, but would need a larger X-Band AESA panel comparable to THAAD.
My guess is that a 18-20k tonne ship would primarily be tasked with BMD and long range strike.
It’s not clear to me that lasers will be substitutive rather than additive to current close range defenses. There might also be a need for microwave kill weapons as standard equipment.
You have to consider what kinds of onboard capabilities you’ll need for future threats and how that shapes fleet doctrine, for example if the counter threat capabilities have to cover multiple different vectors of hypersonic attack as well as large volume drone/missile swarms. In those scenarios the standard destroyer capabilities of today might be the bare minimum for a frigate role, and on the high end you’ll need something a lot more capable than current flagship cruisers.
I would agree before, but AFAIK 052D is now said to be able to be upgraded with shaft-based generators that coupled with CGT-30 can provide probably enough extra power for an MLU with new radars and DEW. The main concern would be interior space as with more things added on to the ship, it'll inevitably get even more crowded from an already undersized hull which might affect blue water capabilities and endurance.
9K ton destroyer has apparently died, given that there haven't been any talks about it for a good while with most people that were talking about it now being more cautious when it comes to the existence of that project, there in fact wasn't even any direct evidence of it existing in the first place except for some super vague papers that are likely reusing old 055 models which ended years ago with no follow up unlike other projects that are seemingly circulating around with a long paper trail.