Yield isn’t the only problematic claim in the report. 5,000 wfm wouldn’t be enough for both AI and phone chip production
The bigger red flag in the report is 5,000 wfm imo.
Chinese semiconductor thread II
- Thread starter vincent
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anyhow, Huawei is introducing MatePad 11.5 2026 version and this will use new CPU Kirin T82B and T82. Claims 30% improvement overall compared to 2024 version
It seems like they designed a new CPU for pads rather than just reusing 8000 or 9000 series. They also have the X90 series iirc for PCs. Basically, they are completely off Intel and QCOM chips now. So, everything they produce needs to be fabb'd in China.
Actually using chips on budget phones actually could be a sign of lower yield. Cause the way Chip manufacturing works is that a certain percentage of chips are upto design spec and have no failed areas, those are designated as the top of the line flagship processors.
There is a certain percentage that have some regions or cores which are in non-working condition. Those chips are then designated as the mid-range chip.
Finally, you have chips that have most of its cores in a non-working condition, those chips are then designated as budget chips. This is how intel for example designates its core I9, i7, i-3 and then celeron chips.
If Huawei chips are high yield, that means most of the production chips will be used on flagship phones. If there is lower yield, that means more chips will not be upto flagship specs and those will then be used on budget phones.
this is not how things works.
in semiconductor fabrication it is the opposite. Yield refers to the percentage of functional, non-defective chips produced from a single silicon wafer with same efforts and manufacturing. higher yield means less defective chips and more useable chips hence more chips for different products.
also yield is different on different chips. SoC chip usually have higher yield and Ai chips have less yields. there are so many mistakes in that article.
Edit- i just saw this. guy deleted his tweet. maybe this report was about Ai chips.
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I don't actually know what's your point here? So, getting a fully working chip with no issues leads to lower yield, so they run ones with some issues at lower clock and maybe disable a core on other ones to have a much higher yield. That seems normal and logical.
Why would they not use all the chips they produced? Do you think their chip limited or demand limited on the Mate/Pura phones?
The fact that they are able to put flagship chips a little downgraded onto lower end product means that they have enough capacity now to actually put more capable chips on non-flagship phones.
well, may you should have calmed down instead of getting so worked up about the original post. The report including the yield and the capacity likely was only talking about for AI chip production.
15k wpm for next year is a reasonable number. If we assume 2 400mm2 die for Ascend-950 and 50% yield (smaller die vs Ascend-910B die), then you could get close to 80 good die per chip or 40 good Ascend-950s.
40 * 15000 = 600k per month or 7 million in one year. Of course, Huawei will need to split up that production with Alibaba PPU, Kunolunxin and others. So 5 million ascend is probably the upper limit (likely lower since they need to ramp up production and will produce larger and lower yielding 910B/C dies).
And then let's say another 15k wpm is used to produce server CPUs and PC CPUs. That leaves maybe 30k left for Kirin chips for phones, tablets, smart wearables and everything else. Not sure how much this leaves for other chip designers.
But 60k wpm next year is possible.
What I mean is Huawei has very high demand for flagship chips, they are supply constrained when it comes Mate/Pura flagship phones. They usually sell out and customers have to wait months to get these phones. So, they have no reason to sell budget phones.
But Huawei is still selling budget phones with lower capability chips made on the same process. This means these are the semi-failed chips which didn't get perfect enough to be used for the topline phones.
Why would they do that? when there is so much demand for flagship phones and laptops?
Its because their manufacturing process creates high rate of semi-defective chips and those chips needs to be utilized somehow, therefore they create these budget phones to be able to make use of those lower capability chips.
So, my thinking is selling budget phones is a sign of lower yield. If they had higher yield, they will only be selling topline phones or laptops or tablets. There is enough demand that they don't need to sell budget phones or tablets at all.
That is flat out not true. Huawei phones are very expensive and they are not selling out because people are either Apple fanboys or like the values in other OEMs better.
The Nova and enjoy line of phones have always existed. You cannot only sell 5000RMB+ phones in China. You can take a look at how big the market is.
中瓷电子/Sinopack said that orders for optical transceiver ceramic products are robust.The 3.2T optical module support solution is mature and its subsidiary's 8-inch SiC production line has achieved mass production and used in EV electric Drive.
CPO ceramic substrates have entered final R&D stage based on what they are saying here and its optical module products have formed matured supporting solutions in power device, DCs and AI fields.
Each equipment that they sell of electronic ceramics is worth > 100m RMB.
the company's 1200V/18mΩ and 750V/14mΩ SiC MOS chips have successfully passed verification by several leading domestic automotive companies and have signed multiple strategic cooperation agreements, establishing stable supply channels
1200V/10mΩ, are currently under development. That's really low resistance and pretty cool if they can achieve.
They have started production of 5000 wpm of 8-inch SiC wafers
CPO ceramic substrates have entered final R&D stage based on what they are saying here and its optical module products have formed matured supporting solutions in power device, DCs and AI fields.
Each equipment that they sell of electronic ceramics is worth > 100m RMB.
the company's 1200V/18mΩ and 750V/14mΩ SiC MOS chips have successfully passed verification by several leading domestic automotive companies and have signed multiple strategic cooperation agreements, establishing stable supply channels
1200V/10mΩ, are currently under development. That's really low resistance and pretty cool if they can achieve.
They have started production of 5000 wpm of 8-inch SiC wafers
EDWC project is progressing in depth. Traditional 400G lines are insufficient to meet the needs of efficient collaboration. As such, 800G transmission tech is needed.
By 2027, there will be 500k+ 800G coherent port.
China Mobile, in collaboration with Fiberhome and other manufacturers, completed the first 800G live network pilot in Sichuan. It focuses on data center interconnection and other things.
"the Mate 70 series saw huge demand and early sales exhausted the stock, resulting in a short supply. The supply chain restraints also created problem in increasing the production. The momentum then surged toward Xiaomi 15 series, and surpassed the Huawei Mate 70."
"Simply put, there was no additional stock capacity for the Mate 80 Pro Max due to its first-time appearance in the market. The company prepared only a few units, which sold out immediately, owing to its surprising features."
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Mate 60 pro also saw huge demand but short supply. Huawei faced supply shortage for its flagships rather than demand shortage.
I think there is enough "patriotic demand" to sell huge flagship volume for Huawei but they have been constrained by supply for flagship chips. This happens everytime since Huawei usually uses a new chip utilizing a new process for its Mate phones and has trouble ramping up chip production. By the time they ramp up production next year, Mate phones are already old and Huawei starts releasing its Pura phones.