PLA Strategy in a Taiwan Contingency

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
All governments of the world ultimately has the goal to survive, yes?
In dire times. In brilliant times, it is to dominate.
So they can either surrender to the mainland and risk being lynched by their own population or they can put up a fight and hope that an outside ally deigns to help them.
No. They can surrender, have the population understand that their surrender saved everyone's lives, and then they can go live in peace somewhere in China. Or they can fight and die. That is the calculus for whether or not to surrender.

Or even better, they can start saying they'll fight, get all the radicals killed overnight, then surrender saying they gave it a shot and it's obviously fatally stupid to continue.
Overall it would be foolish on China's part to bank on Taiwan's prospects of surrending.
We don't bank on it; we are ready for a WWIII level fight over Taiwan. But it would be wise for them to understand that their lives depend on them doing it. And it makes sense as well.
There has not been once historical precedent in which a (de facto) country surrendered to a greater power without any resistance, regardless of how lopsided the forces are.
Actually there are an almost endless number of examples in history where small territories submitted themselves to empires without engaging a suicidal fight. Every empire that sprung up in the Eurasian continent saw this trend.

I disagree that is it impossible to take Taiwan without fighting a war; there may be minimal fighting to show them that the PLA is not just for show, but it's very very possible that it won't take more than that. Or maybe it won't take any violence at all directly on Taiwan, especially if something where to happen where China deals the US a limited military defeat in Asia (Korean War II, defeat and ousting of American forces in SCS, defeat of USA+Japan over Diaoyu Islands, etc...) thus demonstrating that China is the supreme force in Asia.

I agree with you that we are in no rush. The task gets cheaper, easier, and less risky for us by the day so it makes sense to wait
 
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SanWenYu

Captain
Registered Member
I've no doubt that China has been preparing for such a contingency, even to have some baseline capacity to attack Taiwan at any moment's notice. What I do doubt however is that the Chinese leadership has a specific date in mind before which a Taiwan reunification must be carried out.
This is why I say China is trying to do a bloodless armed unification. The timing of that will be dynamic not fixed. And it is likely to happen given the relative strengths of China and the US. This doesn't mean China hasn't prepared for a bloody one though.

The best time for Taiwan to declare independence and succeed has always been in the last year.

The 2027 deadline once wildly circulated on the Chinese internet, IIRC, started when Xi removed the term limits for himself. People were hoping that by 2027, when his third term ends, and in the year of the 100th anniversary of PLA, the Taiwan issue will have been resolved. At the time IMF, World Bank, etc. were also, coincidentally I think, predicting China surpassing the US in nominal GDP by 2027.

Then somehow the western picked up it believing it a deadline set by CCP or Xi himself.
 

00CuriousObserver

Junior Member
Registered Member
the general sentiment in Taiwan is not one of boldheadedness but rather an apathy and pessimism

a) China never attempts AR,
b) That the ROCA completely overpowers the PLA,
c) that the PLA militarily but bloodlessly takes over Taiwan,
d) that American sons will die for Taiwan, and
e) that their neighbor's son will die for Taiwan

Taiwan is not Ukraine; there isn't the same kind of genuine patriotism in fear there. It's either that Xi will never attempt, or that Xi will never succeed. The point is acknowledged when the entire point of the Zero Day TV show to come out in a few months is to get Taiwanese people more afraid of China. The people most reluctant to the idea of annexation are:
.
China has to some extent won the psychological war, but that "China is strong enough to have assured and total dominance over the US" is yet to be fully realized. China has military dominance yes, but not one with margins wide enough to completely legitimize Taiwan as a province. Only when INDOPACOM is to China what India is the same, can AR be bloodless (for PLA soldiers).
I think the unification will be bloodless, i.e. an armed unification without gunfire. As PRC keeps building up its military power and economic strength, the possibility of foreign interference is diminishing. Taiwan will be forced to accept the conditions set by the mainland.
China is absolutely not satisfied with the status quo across the Strait.

I've written a list to give you guys an idea of what some of the "dark green" DPP supporters think, and frankly what a good portion of the Taiwanese population thinks. By no means is this exhaustive and only some points apply to some poeple, but they definitely have a different perspective to say the least.

They genuinely believe the CCP will not attempt armored reunification (AR)
• The AR talks are just internal propaganda meant to maintaining power (
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). When we see military exercises around Taiwan, they see "CCP is wasting money on propaganda to appease pinkies again".
• AR is extremely risky, and the CCP would never risk their rule for such an uncertain outcome
• Many CCP leaders have relatives and interests overseas, making them unlikely to take actions that could harm those connections.
• "China hasn't attempted AR for over 70 years and China isn't going to start now."

They genuinely believe the PLA is trash
• With all the corruption scandals and personnel changes, they believe the PLA is corrupt to the core and incapable of fighting
• All the big-ticket items are for graft and prestige
• They've been consistently
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—whether true or not—of PLA equipment failures, reinforcing the belief that PLA hardware is fundamentally shitty. They genuinely view PLA aircraft, missiles, radars, and other systems as non-threats, much like how some people dismiss Indian military equipment.
• The PLA hasn’t fought a war in decades and lacks real combat experience. While the U.S. hasn’t faced a peer adversary either, they don’t fully buy this comparison because the U.S. has been consistently engaged in military operations, which they see as providing battle-tested experience

They genuinely believe their "friends" will help them
• They’ll compare the U.S. and Chinese militaries, counting the number of carriers, destroyers, aircraft, etc., and noting U.S. technological advantages like advanced engines and nuclear-powered carriers. Based on this, they’ll conclude that China can’t compete with the U.S. militarily (it’s all about perception).
• The "freedom-loving, democracy-valuing countries"—Japan, South Korea, the Philippines, Europe, and others—will "gang up" against China
• Sanctions, sanctions, sanctions. They’re convinced that China’s economy would be in ruins if it ever attempted AR

They genuinely believe they can fend off the PLA—at least long enough
• The Taiwan Strait is too formidable of a barrier, and amphibious landing is too difficult of a task
• With modern surveillance technologies, any preparations for AR would be detected well in advance, giving them ample time to prepare an effective defense
• Their anti-ship missiles will sink all the transport fleets

It’s funny because, from what I’ve observed, they’re more worried about the “fifth column” than the PLA’s hard power. Their mindset is, “The CCP can’t defeat us, but those among us can (so vote DPP!).”

My opinion is that nothing China does will pop this bubble, except AR itself. Keep in mind it's all about perception. Regardless how much you argue, they'll only believe it when they see it. (I have a theory that the DPP pursuing a strategy of betting on the assumption that AR won’t happen. I’ve happily coined it the “台赌论”. But I’ll save this for later)
 
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Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
This is assuming that the Chinese side sees a diminishing risk of peaceful reunification post-2027/2028 (or whatever year you wish to use in your example), hence justifying an expedited operation to reunify with Taiwan. I don't think that's the case here, especially when military and economic winds are in China's favor in the long term.
Military and economic considerations are very often trumped by local political considerations. For example if China attempts a Taiwanese reunification during a US president's first term, the chance of war between the US and China are EXTREMELY high regardless of any balance of power considerations. Also, China may already believe it can currently handedly win a war over Taiwan between itself and the US/Japan +/- other allies.

If anything, it would be in the interest of Taiwan and the US to provoke China into launching an early military expedition and, in consequence, tying up her economic and military resources while the US capitalizes on the opportunity to reinforce herself in the Pacific.
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and seems to be taking steps to avoid this geopolitical trap.
I have a suspicion this time may have already passed. I believe China's recent (last several years') rapid/massive military buildup has been to shorten the time interval during which the US believes it can still reasonably win a war with China. The speed of the buildup as well as the level of China's military technology maturation has probably caught the West by surprise, and now they are developing desperation tactics like "Hellscape" to deal with a Chinese military that they can no longer deal with by the usual brute force-on-force means.

While Trump might push an isolationalist policy for the United States, I seriously doubt that China sees this as worth the risk of such a huge military operation at a time when its forces are not sufficient for a guaranteed & quick victory in a Taiwan scenario. While I agree that China's ultimate endgame is to reunify with Taiwan, its modus operandi has been and will likely continue to be maintaining the current situation and develop its military until such an operation is almost guaranteed success.
I hope you are right, but I am absolutely going to hedge on this in my personal life. By the beginning of 2027 I'm going to have a security system installed around my house with lights, cameras, and remote-controlled rolling security shutters at every window and door, along with a large supply of perishables and some bugout bags for my family. I've already got all the guns and ammo I will ever need. Not even kidding.
 

Wrought

Senior Member
Registered Member
I hope you are right, but I am absolutely going to hedge on this in my personal life. By the beginning of 2027 I'm going to have a security system installed around my house with lights, cameras, and remote-controlled rolling security shutters at every window and door, along with a large supply of perishables and some bugout bags for my family. I've already got all the guns and ammo I will ever need. Not even kidding.

If you genuinely believe in some kind of societal collapse happening, that will not help you. I mean, it will protect you from lone opportunists, but as soon as the first gang shows up you are toast. There are no superhero 1v10s in real life.

The better strategy by far is to simply relocate somewhere insigificant enough to be (mostly) unaffected. Ireland, for example.
 

Wrought

Senior Member
Registered Member
Which countries will suffer more from disruptions of trade? China or western countries? Which ones are more likely to have social unrests due to lack of daily necessities?

Between Ireland and China? I'm going with the one that is not involved in the war, for obvious reasons.

I didn't say you should move to "western countries," I said you should move somewhere insignificant.
 

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
If you genuinely believe in some kind of societal collapse happening, that will not help you. I mean, it will protect you from lone opportunists, but as soon as the first gang shows up you are toast. There are no superhero 1v10s in real life.

The better strategy by far is to simply relocate somewhere insigificant enough to be (mostly) unaffected. Ireland, for example.
Maybe not 1v10, but certainly 1vmore-than-1. It's better than not being prepared at all. Also, I'm preparing a property in a not-too-far rural location for escape if needed with similar preparations, and a well. Been looking at California well permits and digging costs; it's pretty pricey...
 
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