vesicles
Colonel
Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
WOW, this is a first. A "I-know-where-you-live" threat...
WOW, this is a first. A "I-know-where-you-live" threat...
PLAN Anti-Piracy Deployments
- Thread starter UCSDAE
- Start date
vesicles
Colonel
Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
Another thread actually listed what has been accomplished by the PLA task force: 054 Series Frigate Thread 2 post # 440.
briefly, it says in total, the Chinese task force successfully rescued 7 ships captured by the pirates while escorting a total of 508 ships, as of 08-16-09.
The incident at hand is still on-going, I don't understand why people already put it in the "failure" basket... Plus, one incident does not prove any point as everyone, including the US, screws up. I think some one mentioned Mogadishu, where American soldiers, including Spec Ops, were actually captured. Yes, that particular time, the US was "humiliated", but it does NOT mean the US forces were/are incapable.
As people of this forum have pointed out, military reasons are not the only thing being considered here. As we all know, military is a political tool. Those who solely consider the military in a strict military sense are bound to fail. In this sense, rescuing hostages has to be done in a way that will not endanger the lives of those hostages, AND also will not negatively impact China's strategic goals.
Another thing, if the PLA navy was in the middle of an escort mission somewhere else, be it 1000nm, or 700 nm, should they abandon what they do and rush to the aid of the captured Chinese ship? They are there not to protect only Chinese ships, but ALL ships. It's supposed to be a community service type of thing. Imagine if you are a firefighter on duty and your own house is on fire. Should you abandon your post and run back home? Well, I would imagine you would be fired immediately if you do that. This would be considered unprofessional. The same could also be said here. The duty of the Chinese task force is to protect ships. They CAN NOT abandon their post while in the middle of a mission.
Another thread actually listed what has been accomplished by the PLA task force: 054 Series Frigate Thread 2 post # 440.
briefly, it says in total, the Chinese task force successfully rescued 7 ships captured by the pirates while escorting a total of 508 ships, as of 08-16-09.
The incident at hand is still on-going, I don't understand why people already put it in the "failure" basket... Plus, one incident does not prove any point as everyone, including the US, screws up. I think some one mentioned Mogadishu, where American soldiers, including Spec Ops, were actually captured. Yes, that particular time, the US was "humiliated", but it does NOT mean the US forces were/are incapable.
As people of this forum have pointed out, military reasons are not the only thing being considered here. As we all know, military is a political tool. Those who solely consider the military in a strict military sense are bound to fail. In this sense, rescuing hostages has to be done in a way that will not endanger the lives of those hostages, AND also will not negatively impact China's strategic goals.
Another thing, if the PLA navy was in the middle of an escort mission somewhere else, be it 1000nm, or 700 nm, should they abandon what they do and rush to the aid of the captured Chinese ship? They are there not to protect only Chinese ships, but ALL ships. It's supposed to be a community service type of thing. Imagine if you are a firefighter on duty and your own house is on fire. Should you abandon your post and run back home? Well, I would imagine you would be fired immediately if you do that. This would be considered unprofessional. The same could also be said here. The duty of the Chinese task force is to protect ships. They CAN NOT abandon their post while in the middle of a mission.
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bladerunner
Banned Idiot
Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
And then there was the embarassing attempt to try and free the embassy staff in Iran.
And then there was the embarassing attempt to try and free the embassy staff in Iran.
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Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
by the time they catch up to the ship they'd be out of gas lol. and there are somany practical operational concerns on top of these obvious ones that we do not know about, funny how so many people immediately jumps at the issue without even getting all the facts straight.
by the time they catch up to the ship they'd be out of gas lol. and there are somany practical operational concerns on top of these obvious ones that we do not know about, funny how so many people immediately jumps at the issue without even getting all the facts straight.
vesicles
Colonel
Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
The original post quoted some kind of news report with a list that they rescued 7 ships from the pirates.
The original post quoted some kind of news report with a list that they rescued 7 ships from the pirates.
Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
those were prolly just repelling the pirates that were attacking the ship. not rescuing a hijacked ship. otherwise it'd be all over the news.
those were prolly just repelling the pirates that were attacking the ship. not rescuing a hijacked ship. otherwise it'd be all over the news.
vesicles
Colonel
hyalitemarine
Banned Idiot
Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
As I have stated in previous posts, the US Navy TOOK COMMAND of the situation and set up the pirates. I will not go through the whole rigmarole yet again. If anyone here is actually serious about discussing this situation, lets cover it is a part at a time, not some ridiculous, long winded manifesto.
ff :nono:Oh, and by the way, my reference to Invision Tech Solutions in Phoenix, AZ was reference to fact that if this web site continues to only be a pro-China forum and to single out and bash Americans and other nationalities, then I am sure that the ownership of the Invision Tech Solutions, who are American, will take special note of it and action to correct the situation.
Lets keep the post professional and on topic. Lets not call other members names, attack ANY nationality, and be respectful to each other as per the forum rules or I will be forced to contact the principals in order to enforce these rules. Any Questions?
No it doesn't. As you have pointed out, it was a movie -- a fiction. It was not a documentary on Soviet navy nor was it a documentary on the Chinese navy.
It is perfectly okay for you to personally have doubts on the ability of Chinese task force in the Gulf of Aden. Honestly, I do not care. However, when you are making statements as if they are facts, then I like to start seeing some evidences.
My bold. Nice try dropping it out.
And you are wrong in that it is definitely some 1000 nm away from the task force:
Draw a line from the ship to the closest point on the shore -- that would what be meant by 700 nm from the eastern coast of Somalia. A line from the ship to the mouth of the gulf is actually longer than this distance, and the Chinese task force was further in the gulf performing escort duties at the time.
If you disagree, then prove how the distance between the ship and the closest point on the shore is co-equal distance with the distance between the ship and the Chinese task force.
And what does this has to do with the latest hijacking of a Chinese vessel? Maersk Alabama was within reach of multiple US naval vessels, the pirates were stranded on a life boat, totally exhausted, their numbers can be counted with one hand, and they have to rely on food and water from US vessels. Furthermore, the US Navy didn't have to board the ship to free the crew -- the crew freed themselves. It is in no way close to being similar to the current situation of the Chinese vessel.
As I have stated in previous posts, the US Navy TOOK COMMAND of the situation and set up the pirates. I will not go through the whole rigmarole yet again. If anyone here is actually serious about discussing this situation, lets cover it is a part at a time, not some ridiculous, long winded manifesto.
ff :nono:Oh, and by the way, my reference to Invision Tech Solutions in Phoenix, AZ was reference to fact that if this web site continues to only be a pro-China forum and to single out and bash Americans and other nationalities, then I am sure that the ownership of the Invision Tech Solutions, who are American, will take special note of it and action to correct the situation. Lets keep the post professional and on topic. Lets not call other members names, attack ANY nationality, and be respectful to each other as per the forum rules or I will be forced to contact the principals in order to enforce these rules. Any Questions?
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vesicles
Colonel
Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
Wow, and you call yourself a supporter of free speech? As far as I know, this site is very objective since its members are from virtually every corner of the globe. Even if it is pro-China, what's wrong with Americans being pro-China? Your statement above sounds like Americans should not like China and Americans should not bash our great nation. I thought what makes this nation great and different from others is that we are allowed to criticize the govn't. And last time I heard, it is still legal to be an American and be friendly to China. There is nothing that anyone can and should do about it.
I went back and looked at all the posts in this particular thread and found no bashing of Americans as well as any other nationalities. Mostly simply stating the facts. If you have, please enlighten us. A number of posters, including me, have a little bit of problem with your position because, IMHO, your argument is based on illogical assumptions, fictional situations and lack of general knowledge of things. This is to me a normal process of arguing a point. If you feel that your position is absolutely the truth and shall not be challenged, then what is the point of arguing it?
Lets keep the post professional and on topic. Lets not call other members names, attack ANY nationality, and be respectful to each other as per the forum rules or I will be forced to contact the principals in order to enforce these rules. Any Questions?
Wow, and you call yourself a supporter of free speech? As far as I know, this site is very objective since its members are from virtually every corner of the globe. Even if it is pro-China, what's wrong with Americans being pro-China? Your statement above sounds like Americans should not like China and Americans should not bash our great nation. I thought what makes this nation great and different from others is that we are allowed to criticize the govn't. And last time I heard, it is still legal to be an American and be friendly to China. There is nothing that anyone can and should do about it.
I went back and looked at all the posts in this particular thread and found no bashing of Americans as well as any other nationalities. Mostly simply stating the facts. If you have, please enlighten us. A number of posters, including me, have a little bit of problem with your position because, IMHO, your argument is based on illogical assumptions, fictional situations and lack of general knowledge of things. This is to me a normal process of arguing a point. If you feel that your position is absolutely the truth and shall not be challenged, then what is the point of arguing it?
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bladerunner
Banned Idiot
Re: Somali pirates and Chinese navy
Its been repeated ad nauseum, that the opportunity for a rambo type of rescue mission was never there or had passed. Now thanks to the Amercians, in shooting the pirates while good faith negotiations/ (doublecross?) were under way,thus resulting in it being extremely hazardous to make contact in person with doubly wary pirates. Perhaps not so clever after all?.
Its been repeated ad nauseum, that the opportunity for a rambo type of rescue mission was never there or had passed. Now thanks to the Amercians, in shooting the pirates while good faith negotiations/ (doublecross?) were under way,thus resulting in it being extremely hazardous to make contact in person with doubly wary pirates. Perhaps not so clever after all?.
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