Z-10 thread
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antiterror13
Brigadier
do you know what improvements compared to the previous one ? simpler and lighter?
antiterror13
Brigadier
true ... any news regarding WZ16 engine ?
New engine would be more like a mid-term or even long-term overhaul because it would also mostlikely includes all kinds of changes.
Doing something against the IR signature would be more a short-term thing.
Even that will have to wait for the new engines. Because IR suppression could cost up to 15% to 20% of the engines output. This is something the Z-10 at the moment can ill afford.
It's not that I don't believe you, because it sounds somewhat logical, but can you share a source as to why IR suppression would result in reduced engine output? From what I understand, IR suppression on helicopters generally is done via mixing cool air with hot air -- this would add some weight to the helicopter's take off weight, but I don't see why it would decrease the actual turboshaft's output.
IR suppression is meant to reduce the temperature of the gases produced by the engine, as I understand it... theoretically that should not influence the actual shaft power already generated (in the case of turboshafts).
If you're talking about generated backpressure from IR suppression reducing engine power then that is another matter, but then that isn't necessarily related to the engine's output itself... and I've seen nothing about 15-20% reduced engine output. One design does state a 3% in engine output due to backpressure though, here:
I believe that means different IR suppression methods would have differing degrees of backpressure and thus differing degrees of reduced engine output penalties, but a quick search turns up no 15-25% reduction in output.
This article below is an informative one (from a Chinese author at beihang university no less!) that discusses various methods of IR suppression on helicopters... and even after a search on other sites, nowhere have I seen any IR suppression method which reduces engine output.
So I'd be very interested as to where you're pulling the 15-20% figure from.
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So you're saying the F119 engine's nozzle shape will reduce the engine's thrust by 15-20%? Again, any sources or studies (or even forum posts from other websites) to back it up?
Because I feel like that number is being pulled out of thin air.
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Just a stab in the dark. The prototypes has the exhausts pointed upward. My guess is to use the downdraft to disperse the hot air. Based on my understanding, that will increase the difficulty for exhausts gas to exit. With cars, modders use non-legal mufflers that have much bigger exit pipes to increase engine power. In this case it is the reverse.
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