UK Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

strehl

Junior Member
Registered Member
Is the design of the Type 26 getting bigger or is that just a perspective from the picture (carrier group)? Hosting a Merlin sized helicopter in the hanger takes a lot of space. It's interesting to see a multi purpose payload bay similar to the LCS. I would imagine they are planning on going the ROV route as well.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Is the design of the Type 26 getting bigger or is that just a perspective from the picture (carrier group)? Hosting a Merlin sized helicopter in the hanger takes a lot of space. It's interesting to see a multi purpose payload bay similar to the LCS. I would imagine they are planning on going the ROV route as well.
No, I think the Type 026 has grown to be a 8,000 tons full displacement vessel.

The Type 45 Darings are 8,500 ton full displacement...so there is not a lot of difference in terms of displacement.

The Type 45 is 500 ft long and has a 70 ft beam.

The Type 26 is planned to be about 490 ft long and have a 68 ft beam.

In reality, IMHO, the Type 26 is a DDG.
 

Scratch

Captain
No, I think the Type 026 has grown to be a 8,000 tons full displacement vessel.

[...]

In reality, IMHO, the Type 26 is a DDG.
Though I hope they are not inflating the design with size and capabilities in a way that will lead to a reduction in numbers down the road. There are already fewer Darings than planned.
A good multi-purpose FFG in numbers perhaps even in different variatons should do the job just fine. Even a 5.000t vessel should have ample space.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Big news...and we have talked about this possibility before, our own Popeye being the chief proponent:

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QE-Carrier.jpg

US Naval Institute said:
LONDON — The U.S. Marine Corps will deploy its Lockheed Martin F-35B Lightning II strike fighters on combat sorties from Britain’s new Queen Elizabeth-class aircraft carriers, a senior U.K. Royal Navy officer has confirmed.

Rear Adm. Keith Blount, who is responsible for delivering the two 65,000 ton ships, said that using Marine aircraft and pilots to bolster the U.K.’s nascent carrier strike capability would be a natural extension of coalition doctrine.

“We are forever operating with allies and within coalitions. It’s the way wars are fought”, the Assistant Chief of Naval Staff (Aviation, Amphibious Capability and Carriers) and Rear Adm. Fleet Air Arm told an audience at the DSEI defence exhibition in London on Wednesday.

“In order to get the best out of [the U.K. carrier program] we have to be able to situate it in a coalition context. That could mean that we operate with an American ship as one of the protecting escorts”, Blount said.

“But … given the fact that the U.S. Marine Corps are buying and will operate the same type of aircraft as we are buying and operating, it would make no sense whatsoever if we were to close down the opportunity and potential of the U.S. Marine Corps working from this flight deck.
“So yes, I expect the U.S. Marine Corps to operate and work from the deck of the Queen Elizabeth-class aircraft carrier. We are going to get the most bang for the buck we can for the U.K. taxpayer, and that’s one of the ways in which we’ll achieve it.”

While Blount painted the co-operative arrangement in positive terms, it will disappoint critics who believe the U.K. government should provide the R.N. and Royal Air Force (RAF) with sufficient resources, in both aircraft and manpower, to regenerate the country’s carrier air wings independently.

Each of the 284 m-long carriers, fitted with a ‘ski jump’ bow ramp instead of the catapults and arrester wires once planned, will accommodate up to 40 aircraft: short takeoff/vertical landing F-35B strike fighters, helicopters, or a blend of fixed-wing and rotary tailored to the mission in hand.

Britain took delivery of its first Lightning II aircraft in 2012 and currently has three; the fourth is due to roll off Lockheed Martin’s Fort Worth production line in January 2016.

“We have people in America now flying these jets”, said Blount, who disclosed that the RN had recently recruited its first ab initio F-35B pilots.
“The first frontline jet they will ever fly in will be the F-35 … that’s how close we are getting to this.
“When I was at Edwards Air Force Base quite recently I met 140 sailors and an equal number of RAF personnel that are in the testing and evaluation squadron to bring this aircraft online. This is genuinely exciting stuff, and this aircraft is a world beater for what it is designed to do – an exceptional platform.”

Britain’s F-35Bs are scheduled to arrive at Marham Air Base in eastern England in mid-2018, achieving initial operating capability by the end of that year. A deployable U.K. carrier strike capability should be ready by late 2020.

Blount said he was also “very excited” about the opportunities presented through Joint Helicopter Command to operate Apache, Chinook, Merlin and other helicopters from the Queen Elizabeth class.

“Getting rid of the cats and traps actually makes this a far simpler proposition, and one of the reasons why this capability is so versatile and useful to us,” he added.

The UK intends to use US Marine aircraft to conduct combat sorties off of the QEs...which means the QEs will have an earlier combat capability using US aircraft if they desire or need to.
 
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navyreco

Senior Member
DSEi 2015: Lockheed Martin Eager to See its LRASM On Board Royal Navy's Type 26 Frigates
During DSEI 2015 which took place in London from 15-18 September, Navy Recognition met with Frank St. John, vice president at Lockheed Martin Missiles and Fire Control. We discussed Long Range Anti-Ship Missile (LRASM) program update as well as the possibility to see Lockheed Martin's next generation anti-ship missile fitted one day on board the Royal Navy's future Type 26 Frigates.
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navyreco

Senior Member
Since the Sea Herc gets barelly any coverage I decided to focus on that one at DSEI...

And frankly if everything I was told is true, then it doesn't look that bad at all as an MPA solution;

Lockheed Sees its SC-130J Sea Herc as The Affordable Solution to Answer UK Future MPA Needs
t6MnAOH.jpg

During DSEI 2015 which took place in London from 15-18 September, Lockheed Martin was showcasing a scale model of the SC-130J Sea Herc Maritime Patrol and Reconnaissance Aircraft (MPRA). Keith Muir, Business Development Manager at Lockheed Martin UK, told Navy Recognition that "the SC-130J Sea Herc is a very cost effective and truly UK solution" to the future MPA need.
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On a sidenote, Saab told me they would pitch the Swordfish but they really are waiting for the official requirement before disclosing any details;
 
Though I hope they are not inflating the design with size and capabilities in a way that will lead to a reduction in numbers down the road. ...

the hope is to sell some, at least according to the blog post I finished reading a moment ago:
A critical moment for the Type 26 Frigate programme
Speaking at the Defence and Security Equipment International (DSEI) Exhibition last week, the First Sea Lord Admiral Zambellas said:

“the Type 26 [Frigate] will form the backbone of the Royal Navy, with a design that has the potential to meet the operational needs of a number of major navies around the world.”

This was a subtle and timely reminder to ministers that there is a rare opportunity for British warship designers and builders. The UK has failed to export any major new warships or successfully participate in multi-national warship projects since the 1970s, but this could be about to change. Germany, Canada, Australia, Brazil, India and Turkey all require new frigates and are known to have an interest in the Type 26 design. If the UK government was to make a long-term commitment to a full programme of ships this would provide considerable reassurance to potential export customers.

BAE Systems has the global strength and resources for success in the naval export market but needs UK government support. Although it is unlikely many complete ships for export would be built in the UK, the design could be licensed to foreign yards helping to recover some of the design cost. Many of the key components would be manufactured in the UK, notably the excellent Rolls Royce engines, the Sea Ceptor missile system and the Artisan radar. Sea Ceptor has already gained export orders to Brazil and New Zealand and is likely to win more.

The Type 26 has a broad appeal. Built for the Royal Navy, an acknowledged world leader in anti-submarine warfare, it will undoubtedly be a superb submarine-hunting platform and a worthy successor to the proven Type 23. Furthermore the spacious hull with large mission bay gives it a general purpose capability, able to operate in a wide variety of roles that could be tailored to the needs of individual nations. There is also plenty of room to fit alternative equipment that export customers may prefer.

Even modest export success for the Type 26 could help reduce the unit cost of vessels and their equipment while producing a ‘halo effect’ besides the obvious economic and employment benefits. It would enhance inter-operability and partnerships with other allied nations but most importantly it could be the catalyst for other naval exports. Britain could regain a foothold in the export market where it has so long trailed behind other European nations. This in turn may help reinvigorate the UK’s weak warship building sector, with all the strategic benefits and opportunities that would give the RN in the long-term.

Credibility
The 2015 defence review (SDSR) is currently in full swing in Whitehall and a key decision for the Royal Navy will be the number of Type 26 Frigates to be ordered. The size of this order will be a real indicator of whether the Treasury or ministers drive defence policy. Having firmly committed to building both aircraft carriers, it would be the height of folly and a potential political embarrassment not to provide them with sufficient aircraft and escorts.

After enduring considerable criticism that it was over-reaching in its procurement of these large carriers, perhaps the RN’s long-term plan will start to reap some rewards. Senior government figures have been on something of a journey of enlightenment. When they came to power in 2010 they wanted to “axe the damn things” but discovered they were locked into unbreakable commercial contracts. Over time they have come to realise the
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of these mighty vessels and both the Prime Minister and George Osborne personally endorsed the project, attending HMS Queen Elizabeth’s naming ceremony in July 2014. By October the Prime Minister was proudly announcing the reversal of the decision to mothball the second carrier HMS Prince of Wales and the RN can now look forward to maintaining a continuous carrier capability. With the future of the aircraft carriers looking secure, the RN now has a very strong case to argue that appropriate escort and support ships be provided.

Considerable funds have already gone into the design of the Type 26 but presently only the long lead items for 3 vessels have been paid for, with no actual ships ordered or any indication of the final number of hulls. The Royal Navy needs at the absolute minimum of 13 Type 26 Frigates just to maintain its existing meagre force levels. With its frigates deployed around the globe in a wide variety of roles, finding spare escorts to form a carrier battle group will be a stretch and of course, more than 13 frigates would be desirable.

Admiral Zambellas highlighted the need for the Type 26 again:

“The judgement that the spectre of state-based conflict had gone from Europe has evaporated. So our future capabilities must match or outpace the threat. And areas such as anti-submarine warfare and maritime ISTAR now have heightened significance. It’s another pressing reminder of the need to replace our respected but ageing Type 23 frigates. There is an opportunity as well as a necessity here – recognised at the highest levels of Government, in the Chancellor’s support for the National Shipbuilding Strategy”
So far the
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has been a vague and disappointing promise of 1 ship every 2 years. That would actually reduce the surface fleet and see some of the existing Type 23s go out of service before replaced by new ships. The Type 26 programme is already running much later than ideal but needs to deliver at least 1 ship every year between 2020 and 2033 just to replace the Type 23s before they fall apart.

Some frigate orders will be undoubtedly be forthcoming this year but just how many remains to be seen. The defence review ‘mood music’ is more positive now than it has ever been in the previous few years with the Defence Secretary recently stating:

“the Strategic Defence and Security Review will not lead to the kind of cuts seen in 2010”
Nevertheless, despite sexed-up government claims to be spending 2% of GDP on defence, funding will be tight and a generous order for frigates might only come at the expense of cuts elsewhere.

Decision makers in Westminster should be aware that now is the time for an enthusiastic and fully funded commitment to the Type 26. This would not only build the credibility of the RN, but could reap long-term financial benefits of export success.
source:
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