US Military News, Reports, Data, etc.


Michaelsinodef

Junior Member
Registered Member
Watching that forgotten weapons video, I think 6.8mm is a good compromise between 5.56 and 7.62. They just need to use the training round ammo as the regular round - although I wonder what the penetration capacity will be with the shorter barrel the M5 has.
I'm still kinda unsure about going to the 6.8mm although I do think the 5.56 definitely isn't 'good enough' if we think about something like near peer or peer war that they are talking about (the opponent infantry actually having good armor/equipment).
Having infantry train with one type of ammo and issuing them with a much more powerful one for combat....well that's not a good idea.
Agree, especially the fact that the training round is gonna have less recoil than the actual combat (and it seems like the difference isn't even that small).
 

Abominable

Captain
Registered Member
That’s about the norm. If you look at some of the best shooters and some military training programs they employ cheaper lighter rounds like .22lr to practice and build up memory, familiarity then transition to stronger rounds. Felt recoil in this case will be negligible.
5.56mm is very easy to control so there's less of a reason to acclimatise soldiers to it. Think back to the days of 7.62mm, but it'll be worse.

We've been over this before. We just have to see what happens when soldiers actually get deployed somewhere.
I'm still kinda unsure about going to the 6.8mm although I do think the 5.56 definitely isn't 'good enough' if we think about something like near peer or peer war that they are talking about (the opponent infantry actually having good armor/equipment).

Agree, especially the fact that the training round is gonna have less recoil than the actual combat (and it seems like the difference isn't even that small).
I think the ideal would be to keep the 5.56mm and use the kraut high barrel pressure magic on a new rifle. That way you don't sacrifice magazine capacity and would still get better penetration than standard.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
That’s about the norm. If you look at some of the best shooters and some military training programs they employ cheaper lighter rounds like .22lr to practice and build up memory, familiarity then transition to stronger rounds. Felt recoil in this case will be negligible.

5.56mm is very easy to control so there's less of a reason to acclimatise soldiers to it. Think back to the days of 7.62mm, but it'll be worse.

We've been over this before. We just have to see what happens when soldiers actually get deployed somewhere.

I think the ideal would be to keep the 5.56mm and use the kraut high barrel pressure magic on a new rifle. That way you don't sacrifice magazine capacity and would still get better penetration than standard.
Have some time on your hands?
The reader’s digest version to the important bit. 5.56mm has 7.5 fpe recoil force
6.8x51mm has 17 fpe
7.62x51mm has 18.3 fpe.
Clearly 5.56mm is softer but remember suppressors reduce recoil force by about 40% so factor that in the known energy of .277 fury is about 10.3 fpe. roughly the same energy of 6.5x39mm Grendel unsuppressed.

Worst case scenario full power AP is equivalent to 7.62x51mm which suppressed is 11 fpe.
 

Mohsin77

Senior Member
Registered Member
A number of individuals have pushed this as a flaw in the Army’s testing with the claim that had the Army gone into destructive testing Glock would have won. Yet that’s irrelevant.

We already saw how good those standards were. The reliability problems with the Sig surfaced soon as they were inducted. But clearly, you're just gonna keep blindly defending your point, like always.


Your logic is breathtaking

It's just regular logic. Deduction and Induction. Try it sometime.

The fact is M4 and 5.56x45mm are plenty......The M4A1 easily sits in the same role set as a PDW.

Yea, it's "plenty"... for a PDW, lolz. Totally agree.

No in this mud test just about all piston guns have this happen.

I've seen enough torture tests and battle reports of well built pistons like the 416 to not be concerned. And well built DIs aren't bad, but I wouldn't rate them at the same level. And neither would your own Army, since they had already been buying lots of foreign built pistons for your SOFs before they finally selected a domestic piston to replace the DIs for your infantry lolz. It's game over Terran. Let it go.
 
Last edited:

tphuang

Brigadier
VIP Professional
Registered Member
America's youth. Too fat, drug-addled and criminal to serve?

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Actually, interesting thing about this. A few years ago, I was chatting with a well known American general from Vietnam war. He was just telling how US military is now struggling with so many obese recruits. As a whole, the American society has just gotten so much fatter in the past 50 years. I would say that having worked with numerous people from west point. They tend to be some of the most fit people that I know in person. So, I guess once the army whips you into shape, you tend to stay in great shape.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


No s--t sherlock.

This is what what happens when your imported tech supply has dried up & your primary school failed people too busy doing party paints their idea of incompetence as revolutionary.
Well...here goes the revolutionary bulls--t .
Frank Kendall seems to have just been contradicting himself. I'd be curious to hear what people really think about him, because he does not sound as intelligent as some of air force generals I've listened to. Either way, it's kind of unrealistic for people to think that NGAD can achieve IOC by 2029 when it took 14 years for F-22 to go from start of EMD to IOC and 17 years for that to happen with F-35A. Assuming things do move faster with NGAD, I think we will start seeing early production squadron doing testing & evaluation by the end of this decade. I don't think we will see IOC until early to mid 2030s.
 

Maikeru

Senior Member
Registered Member
Actually, interesting thing about this. A few years ago, I was chatting with a well known American general from Vietnam war. He was just telling how US military is now struggling with so many obese recruits. As a whole, the American society has just gotten so much fatter in the past 50 years. I would say that having worked with numerous people from west point. They tend to be some of the most fit people that I know in person. So, I guess once the army whips you into shape, you tend to stay in great shape.
If you look at crowded beach or street photos from the 1970s US there's barely a fatty in sight, nowadays they are the majority. I blame corn syrup, which is put into basically all processed foodstuffs in the USA as I understand it.
 

Bellum_Romanum

Colonel
Registered Member
Fascinating article with implications for the PLA (and every major army) as well:

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Thomas E. Rick's article is pretty much the theme of the book he wrote a few years ago titled "The Generals" which he essentially discussed pretty much the same thing he did on this article but with expanded examples and ideas as to why, how such methods worked during the crucial period for the U.S. Military and the U.S. Army in particular.

9780143124092.jpeg.jpg

I just find his effusive praise for the supposed genius of Gen.Paetraus in Iraq (Al-Anbar awakening) surge troops advocacy and his penchant for politicking is one of the reasons the U.S. military generalship is in the condition it finds itself under. After all, the man, Petraeus (called derisively by some of his troops us General Betrayus) found himself under the big bossom of one Ms.Paula Broadwell, a then married histiographer and fuck buddy that the good general was quickly ushered out from his post as then CIA Director not before leaving some secret documents for his fling a ling to see.

American society is celebrity obsessed, and it permeates on every level of their society from business, politicians, scientific, and military.
 

Top