The yuan and the U.S. trade deficit

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
Just wondering what are these extremely large multinational organizations and their very large sums of money?

Over the last couple of years there has been a few hedge fund operators who have taken up short positions against Chinas property boom. Amongst these is Jim Chanos of Kynikos Associates who have a reported hedge fund somewhere around the 6 billion mark. From my past readings of his activities he has been shorting the building suppliers in glass, steel and cement. He's also been taking short positions in "HK Poly" and the Hong Kong Stock exchange and China Merchants bank due to their exposure to local government funding vehicles.
 

Red Moon

Junior Member
I read the following in the NY Times today:
Mr. Hu, of course, has the power, at least on paper, to reach across differing bureaucracies. Often, though, he cannot or will not. The debate over revaluing the renminbi, a constant thorn in the relationship with the United States, has not advanced much partly because of a fight between central bankers who want the currency to rise and ministers and party bosses who want to protect the vast industrial machine that depends on cheap exports for survival.

So far, the battle has made it impossible for China to act decisively - and it is struggling with inflation as a result. Mr. Obama’s aides now want to try a different tack: Rather than harp on currency, they are going to raise other economic issues and see if the pressure of rising inflation, and the fear that it could cause social unrest, will compel the Chinese to raise the value of their currency.
Never mind the references to battles and invented factional strife. This stuff is the central theme of the article, which is why I don't want to provide a link. It's just trash. But the part I put in boldface is a theme I have seen since the Bush days: the idea that NOT allowing the currency to rise will cause inflation. Here, the author expresses the converse: by taking such measures as will cause inflation in China, the US, in fact, is applying pressure on China to appreciate it's currency. This more or less supports the view Jantxv was putting forward.

In any case, my observation is that FROM THE POINT OF VIEW OF CURRENCY VALUATION inflation is the same as currency appreciation. In other words, overall, 10% inflation will make Chinese goods 10% more expensive on the world market, even if there's no appreciation. Conversely, 10% appreciation will do the same, even if there's no inflation.

My question is, why does the US demand revaluation, when inflation will do the job? Is there simply a preference for friction? Why the need to compel anything? In terms of the alleged benefits to American exports, the effect would be the same.

The Chinese govt. point of view, I think, is easier to understand. Currency appreciation not only wreaks havoc on contracts that are signed in dollars, especially for exporters of cheap stuff which run on ultra-thin profit margins, but it fans hot money flows. Inflation can be managed better by the exporters, because the wages they agree to, and the contracts with suppliers, can be coordinated with a controlled rise in export prices. And inflation does not encourage hot money flows.

The calculation is that a 3% yearly appreciation is not high enough to make it worthwhile to the speculators (unless you add in profits from real estate speculation), so the government wants to limit currency appreciation to that. Meanwhile, inflation hurts the masses and will become a bigger problem if inflationary expectations develop. Therefore, the government is willing to allow some inflation, and given the pressures due to loose money, a bit more than they would have accepted before.

This illogical American insistence on currency appreciation, is actually what makes me wonder if the "conspiracy theorists" are not correct after all: the US wants to "bust" China through hot money flows.
 

nameless

Junior Member
Over the last couple of years there has been a few hedge fund operators who have taken up short positions against Chinas property boom. Amongst these is Jim Chanos of Kynikos Associates who have a reported hedge fund somewhere around the 6 billion mark. From my past readings of his activities he has been shorting the building suppliers in glass, steel and cement. He's also been taking short positions in "HK Poly" and the Hong Kong Stock exchange and China Merchants bank due to their exposure to local government funding vehicles.

I am well aware of Chanos, but even he admitted his bet is only a small percentage of his business and would not be a problem even if he were to lose the bet.
 

Schumacher

Senior Member
I am well aware of Chanos, but even he admitted his bet is only a small percentage of his business and would not be a problem even if he were to lose the bet.

That's why it's important to watch carefully what these guys do with their own money rather than listen to their words which are often aimed to create fame for themselves rather than help you make money.
If you took his words literally like '1000s of Dubai' or 'treadmill to hell' in his prediction of doom for China and thought he shorted China aggressively and did the same yourself, you would have been bankrupt by now. :)
 

RedMercury

Junior Member
Inflation is always a good way to make the little guy pay the tab for the governments' mistakes. Sad sad. This time, the Chinese populace and American populace are being exploited together by QE.
 

nameless

Junior Member
Buy physical bullion gold as an inflationary hedge. Silver is also worth considering though its driven more by industrial demand than by the money vector.
 
Last edited:

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
That's why it's important to watch carefully what these guys do with their own money rather than listen to their words which are often aimed to create fame for themselves rather than help you make money.
If you took his words literally like '1000s of Dubai' or 'treadmill to hell' in his prediction of doom for China and thought he shorted China aggressively and did the same yourself, you would have been bankrupt by now. :)

Bad mouthing a company goes hand in hand with taking a short position on its share value.
Last week Business week carried a interesting article on shorting Chinese reversed merger stocks.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
 

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
That's why it's important to watch carefully what these guys do with their own money rather than listen to their words which are often aimed to create fame for themselves rather than help you make money.
If you took his words literally like '1000s of Dubai' or 'treadmill to hell' in his prediction of doom for China and thought he shorted China aggressively and did the same yourself, you would have been bankrupt by now. :)

Bad mouthing a company goes hand in hand with taking a short position on its share value.
Last week Business week carried a interesting article on shorting Chinese reversed merger stocks.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
 

nameless

Junior Member
Bad mouthing a company goes hand in hand with taking a short position on its share value.
Last week Business week carried a interesting article on shorting Chinese reversed merger stocks.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

The point is to do your own homework instead of blindly trusting these hedge funds or rumors, otherwise you are bound to lose money and miss opportunities.
 
Last edited:

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
The point is to do your own homework instead of blindly trusting these hedge funds or rumors, otherwise you are bound to lose money and miss opportunities.

I agree with you 100%. Halfway through last year I was seriously thinking to see if I could take a short position on BYD. but I think I may have left it a bit late.
 
Top