Should term limit for China's presidency remain the same, be extended, or eliminated?

I had more time to think about this and here is my take.

My very first thought is identical to many on this board that this is a huge step back, during the long and epic of Chinese history, it had its good share of 1. Incompetent emperor that lived for too long, 2. Tyrant emperor that lived for too long 3. Good emperor that grow tired and later became incompetent that lived for too long, that Xi might seek to became one of them.

The further more I think about this the more I discover there are several logical error with this train of thought.

1. Emperor means someone who have absolute power, and Xi does not, he is still part of the 1/7 member of the PSC and 1/32 members of the politburo that makes the decision for China. So this change alone make it far from Xi being the unchallenged person in China, if he decides to do something so obviously stupid like Mao's GLP, I'm pretty sure the rest of the politburo member is going to stop him.
2. Xi actually wants to became an emperor/dictatorship with absolute power. From what I see about Xi's first 5 year so far, I just don't see Xi with this kinda of narcissistic personality to want absolute power, he looks to be the opposite of Trump, not boastful, no delusion of grandeur. What really makes him standout from past leaders is that he is a pretty hardcore member member of the CCP, he really do believe in the party's power and it would guide China to its rejuvenation. One of the ways of his reform is emphasis on the rule of law and institutionalizes the decision within the government, and this literally goes up against Emperorhood.

Lastly Xi knows by doing this he will take on a lot of heat from everyone, but yet he still made the decision to do this so why? I think we can discount the reason of him being ignorant of the outcome. So that means he still made the decision in spite of this bad press for a reason.

My theory is that he was indeed sending out a message, but the primary recipient was not the ordinary people but his own fellow CCP bureaucrats. He spend all of his effort during his first term on reform but I have a feeling his end goal of what he wants to achieve is lagging far behind his own schedule, and at the rate he won't finish it in 5 years or even if he can it would be so weak that the next leader would undo all of what he have done would be for nothing, just like what Trump is doing to Obama's legacy. Or his fellow party members would easily just wait him out another 5 more years until he steps down and business as usual.

I think Xi foresaw this and he wants to make a permanent change is nothing short of a complete overhaul of the CCP once and for all and this needs time. He is sending out a message to rest of the party members that you can't wait me out, I'm here, get on with the program or get out. I think this is the primary reason for why is he doing this.

So for now, I don't think Xi have imperial ambition, however I do not discount with the possibility that as time goes on Xi might develop imperial ambition, because power itself changes a person so there is a chance he might grow custom to it and not waiting to let go, and if this happens it would be the real tragedy for China, and this would be the worst case scenario

The best case scenario outcome is that in his 3rd or 4th term he would have completely overhaul the party into a very competent organization with deep respect for law and institution, very responsive to the needs of the people and at same time well adopted to the changes for the future, and by then it would go without a saying that an emperor/dictatorship role would have no place in its design and Xi would step down on his own like the way he planned it.

There are 2 things to watch for disprove my theory.
1. Xi wants to make structural changes to the government structure like disband the politburo, or start to mass purge his fellow politburo members and replace everyone with his own yes man.
2. Xi start to grew more defensive/paranoid in personality. Stops his reform on the emphasis of law and clean government, if this is the case, he won't last long pass 3rd term anyway.

Orthan said:

What do you thinkl of this SCMP article about the end of presidential terms? It says that the title of president is the least important of the 3 titles that xi has, and also other things.

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Well, china had also deng as a paramount leader before and they did manage to transmit his power to others. I dont see why they cant do the same for xi. Eventually xi will get to old to rule. Then, his power will get transmited to others. At least, thats the way i see it. But i could be wrong. In fact, we all could be wrong about this issue, no matter how do we see it, because no one here can see behind the walls of power in china, let alone see the future. But this is something that china (and the world ) will have to live with.

Click to expand...

sanblvd said:

I had more time to think about this and here is my take.

My very first thought is identical to many on this board that this is a huge step back, during the long and epic of Chinese history, it had its good share of 1. Incompetent emperor that lived for too long, 2. Tyrant emperor that lived for too long 3. Good emperor that grow tired and later became incompetent that lived for too long, that Xi might seek to became one of them.

The further more I think about this the more I discover there are several logical error with this train of thought.

1. Emperor means someone who have absolute power, and Xi does not, he is still part of the 1/7 member of the PSC and 1/32 members of the politburo that makes the decision for China. So this change alone make it far from Xi being the unchallenged person in China, if he decides to do something so obviously stupid like Mao's GLP, I'm pretty sure the rest of the politburo member is going to stop him.
2. Xi actually wants to became an emperor/dictatorship with absolute power. From what I see about Xi's first 5 year so far, I just don't see Xi with this kinda of narcissistic personality to want absolute power, he looks to be the opposite of Trump, not boastful, no delusion of grandeur. What really makes him standout from past leaders is that he is a pretty hardcore member member of the CCP, he really do believe in the party's power and it would guide China to its rejuvenation. One of the ways of his reform is emphasis on the rule of law and institutionalizes the decision within the government, and this literally goes up against Emperorhood.

Lastly Xi knows by doing this he will take on a lot of heat from everyone, but yet he still made the decision to do this so why? I think we can discount the reason of him being ignorant of the outcome. So that means he still made the decision in spite of this bad press for a reason.

My theory is that he was indeed sending out a message, but the primary recipient was not the ordinary people but his own fellow CCP bureaucrats. He spend all of his effort during his first term on reform but I have a feeling his end goal of what he wants to achieve is lagging far behind his own schedule, and at the rate he won't finish it in 5 years or even if he can it would be so weak that the next leader would undo all of what he have done would be for nothing, just like what Trump is doing to Obama's legacy. Or his fellow party members would easily just wait him out another 5 more years until he steps down and business as usual.

I think Xi foresaw this and he wants to make a permanent change is nothing short of a complete overhaul of the CCP once and for all and this needs time. He is sending out a message to rest of the party members that you can't wait me out, I'm here, get on with the program or get out. I think this is the primary reason for why is he doing this.

So for now, I don't think Xi have imperial ambition, however I do not discount with the possibility that as time goes on Xi might develop imperial ambition, because power itself changes a person so there is a chance he might grow custom to it and not waiting to let go, and if this happens it would be the real tragedy for China, and this would be the worst case scenario

The best case scenario outcome is that in his 3rd or 4th term he would have completely overhaul the party into a very competent organization with deep respect for law and institution, very responsive to the needs of the people and at same time well adopted to the changes for the future, and by then it would go without a saying that an emperor/dictatorship role would have no place in its design and Xi would step down on his own like the way he planned it.

There are 2 things to watch for disprove my theory.
1. Xi wants to make structural changes to the government structure like disband the politburo, or start to mass purge his fellow politburo members and replace everyone with his own yes man.
2. Xi start to grew more defensive/paranoid in personality. Stops his reform on the emphasis of law and clean government, if this is the case, he won't last long pass 3rd term anyway.

Click to expand...

In China the CCP General Secretary and CMC Chairman posts are more important than the Presidency, though term limits on the Presidency serve as an important time check on the one "paramount leader" who tends to hold all three posts concurrently.

Xi is faced with moving China forward overall, navigating a particularly tricky period both internally and externally in China's development, hopefully make systemic improvements including political ones, and also hopefully knowing when to step back like Deng.

Given that is a full plate and the Presidency's term limit may seem like a small or even necessary price, however the downside risks not only come from Xi himself or even just his inner circle but how others adjust to both perceived and actual more centralized power.

When the centralized power is strong and long it may well stymie the grooming of future leaders and the innate desire of capable people to pursue such a career path to begin with, guaranteeing a next generation of mediocre leaders or worse.

Cults of personality can develop from the bottom up and tend to run amok or be deliberately used by others for ulterior motives other than to serve the agenda of the idolized. Time checks on "paramount leaders" serve as an important conceptual brake on any such tendencies.

In addition to cults of personality the many layers of power in the heirarchy between top leadership directives and ground level implementation of policies have a much easier time hiding behind superficially centralized power, or actual centralized power as it decays, while either performing incompetently or serving their own ulterior agendas.

These are significant downside risks that not only have multiple repeated examples throughout history but also in recent Chinese history.

This is timely article on the subject I also believe since the domain of president is foreign policy . He want to stay on course for the next 10 years which is very critical since this is the only window of opportunity for any potential foe to try to disrupt or even retard China rise
It is signal to any foe that he will play the hardball and not to expect softer hand guiding China foreign policy
Sofar what he did is exceed my expectation He is the only one who has a spine and does not play this deferrential game .We see it in SCS, in India, Taiwan, and East China sea.
Unless it limited to 3rd or 4th term It could set a bad precedent for more ambitious young man who will succed him latter

As Xi Jinping Extends Power, China Braces for a New Cold War

By FEB. 27, 2018

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  , Mr. Xi had ordered the Chinese military to counter the Pentagon with its own modernization in air, sea, space and cyber weapons, the analysts said, partly in response to Mr. Trump’s plans to
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  .
  
  Rather than beginning a final term next month as a lame duck, Mr. Xi will govern with new authority to pursue his agenda of making China a global power even if it risks putting Beijing in conflict with Washington and triggering a new Cold War after 40 years of mutual engagement, the analysts said.
  
  “In the Asia-Pacific, the dominant role of the United States in a political and military sense will have to be readjusted,” said Cui Liru, former president of the China Institutes of Contemporary International Relations, a think tank under the Ministry of State Security that often reflects official thinking. “It doesn’t mean U.S. interests must be sacrificed. But if the U.S. insists on a dominant role forever, that’s a problem.”
  
  Asked if conflict was likely in the region, Mr. Cui said: “I don’t exclude that possibility. In this transitional period, it depends on how the two sides handle it.”
  
  
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  He added that it was “not normal for China to be under U.S. dominance forever. You can’t justify dominance forever.”
  
  Mr. Xi appears to share the view of many Chinese analysts and military officials that the United States is a superpower in decline — and that China must step into the vacuum it leaves behind.
  
  He has accelerated the military’s plans to build a blue-water navy, increased spending on weaponry in outer space, and established China’s
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  . He has promoted
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  to extend Beijing’s influence and ignored Western concerns about human rights, which have diminished under the Trump administration.
  
  The move in Beijing to scrap constitutional limits on presidential terms comes as former officials in Washington have expressed growing remorse about the longstanding bipartisan push for trade with China — which they now worry has allowed Beijing to prosper at America’s expense.
  
  Mr. Xi’s emergence as a strongman has driven home the disappointment among American policymakers that China has not become more open and democratic as it has become more wealthy. At the same time, Beijing has rejected pleas for fairer terms of trade, angering both Democrats and Republicans.
  
  President Trump himself has
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  . He congratulated Mr. Xi on his “extraordinary elevation” at a leadership congress in October and likened him to a “king.”
  
  Mr. Xi’s attitude toward China’s place in the world was echoed Tuesday in the state-run newspaper, Global Times, which
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  that “the country must seize the day, must seize the hour.”
  
  “Our country must not be disturbed by the outside world or lose our confidence as the West grows increasingly vigilant toward China,” it said.
  
  In some respects, Mr. Xi’s move to extend his rule in tandem with his drive to make China a dominant global power should not have surprised the United States, Chinese analysts said
• 
  
• “It is now clear Xi’s agenda to rebuild an Asian order with China at its center is here to stay,” said Hugh White, a scholar and former defense official in Australia who has argued that the United States must be prepared to share power with China in the Asia-Pacific region.
  
  “I think Xi is impatient,” Mr. White added. “He wants China to be the predominant power in the Western Pacific. He wants to do it himself and for it to go down in history as his achievement. That makes him formidable.”
  
  At the same time, analysts said, Mr. Trump has shown little interest in global institutions and
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  that included more than a dozen Asia-Pacific nations as one of his first acts in office.
  
  “Xi is exploiting the space that America voluntarily abandoned,” said Shi Yinhong, a professor of international relations at Renmin University. In contrast, he said, “China speaks again and again of globalization as a good thing.”
  
  Most worrying for the United States, analysts said, was the strategic competition emerging in Asia, where China is seeking to challenge American military dominance that has been the status quo since World War II.
  
  “China’s military objective is to break through the first chain of islands,” said Mr. Cui, referring to the waters beyond Japan and Taiwan where the Chinese military wants to establish a presence.
  
  Chinese military experts have also emphasized the importance of dominating nuclear, space and cyber technologies, said Phillip C. Saunders, a China expert at the National Defense University in Washington.
  
  Their views mirror those of American strategists who also see these fields as critical to success in modern war, he said.
  
  The Trump administration announced this month a new nuclear policy calling for revitalization of the nation’s nuclear arsenal to counter Russia and to a lesser degree China — an approach that has upset Beijing.
  
  “Trump is obsessed with strategic forces,” Mr. Shi said. “He is determined to maintain American military predominance in face of China’s strategic buildup. That will make the relationship more profoundly confrontational.”
  
  The United States has also tried to build
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  with Australia, India and Japan as a counterweight to China’s rise. The four democracies would increase military cooperation and invest in infrastructure to compete with Chinese projects in the region.
  
  But Chinese analysts said that Beijing did not believe the effort would amount to much because the United States was unwilling to spend money on the projects.
  
  “In the short term,” Mr. Shi said, “China does not care about it because the ability to form a real coalition is limited.”

PanAsian said:

In China the CCP General Secretary and CMC Chairman posts are more important than the Presidency, though term limits on the Presidency serve as an important time check on the one "paramount leader" who tends to hold all three posts concurrently.

Xi is faced with moving China forward overall, navigating a particularly tricky period both internally and externally in China's development, hopefully make systemic improvements including political ones, and also hopefully knowing when to step back like Deng.

Given that is a full plate and the Presidency's term limit may seem like a small or even necessary price, however the downside risks not only come from Xi himself or even just his inner circle but how others adjust to both perceived and actual more centralized power.

When the centralized power is strong and long it may well stymie the grooming of future leaders and the innate desire of capable people to pursue such a career path to begin with, guaranteeing a next generation of mediocre leaders or worse.

Cults of personality can develop from the bottom up and tend to run amok or be deliberately used by others for ulterior motives other than to serve the agenda of the idolized. Time checks on "paramount leaders" serve as an important conceptual brake on any such tendencies.

In addition to cults of personality the many layers of power in the heirarchy between top leadership directives and ground level implementation of policies have a much easier time hiding behind superficially centralized power, or actual centralized power as it decays, while either performing incompetently or serving their own ulterior agendas.

These are significant downside risks that not only have multiple repeated examples throughout history but also in recent Chinese history.

Click to expand...

The problem is how do we know if he is going to play Cinncinatus?

In my view, arbitrary rigidity tend not to work well in reality. Talented leaders don’t come along once every 10 years like clockwork.

So the question is, would it be better for a proven, capable leader to carry on for another 5-10 years, or make a weaker candidate leader for nothing more than the sake of having someone different in charge?

It is hard to make a clear assessment on whether this is a good or bad thing because there are critical factors we as people outside the core inner circle of the CCP standing committee cannot possible know.

If there simply are no candidates of the same caliber to succeed Xi, then it is a good thing he has the moral strength and courage to risk being accused of wanting to be Emperor to stay on to make sure China’s critical transitional phase of surpassing the US goes smoothly and according to Chinese plans.

I don’t really believe in arbitrary rigid structures and prefer a more fluid and merit based approach to things. So long as Xi continues to do a good job, I am happy for him to stay on. It’s better for him to stay on than potentially have another Jian or Hu take charge for the next critical 10 years.

siegecrossbow said:

The problem is how do we know if he is going to play Cinncinatus?

Click to expand...

It all comes down to whether or not you trust Xi. If you don't trust him, it seems like a dictator seizing power ready to enslave China and create his own dynasty. If you trust him, this means that China is guaranteed a highly competent, beloved and incorruptible leader for the foreseeable future. There are times when you set rules to keep everyone in line so no one can screw you and there are times that you take a trust fall. Rigid rules can reduce the chance of disaster but they also limit the ability of great leaders to set things into motion effectively. If you trust that Xi will wholeheartedly serve the nation and would never abuse this power to cause harm to China, then those rules become chains that bind China's development. If people didn't trust Xi, he could never have gotten this far in extending his own rule. To those in the CCP to support the notion to extend Xi's power directly with their votes, and to the many people who welcome this change, they trust Xi with their lives and with China's future and they want those chains cut. I am with them.

Suppose the term limit is really scrapped. What will this do to China’s future? Nothing good I'm afraid:

- It will compromise the political stability of the Chinese government. One of the existential political problems that an authoritarian government such as China must solve is how to find a workable and stable way for government succession. The removal of the term limit for China’s presidency now is no ordinary constitutional change, because it dismantles the functioning succession mechanism established through the effort of a generation’s Chinese, and put China’s future governmental transition in the limbo. It lends credence to the typical anti-China drivel that “Chinese elites will never figure out a peaceful way for power transfer, so it’s just a matter of time that the Chinese government will collapse due to infighting for power.”

- It exposes Chinese government’s lack of confidence on its own legal and political institutions. Forget about that China’s governing system is a meritocracy. It seems that Xi and his crop have no illusion that the Chinese system can produce a proper leader after him, or China’s own method of choosing a leader will work, despite China's 1.38 billion population – so he himself has to take over for the next 30 years? This will not only negatively affect domestic Chinese’ confidence on their leader and government, it will also diminish the confidence of overseas Chinese and foreigners – so much for attracting overseas talents.

- It sets a very bad precedent not only for China’s future presidents, but also for middle and lower level officials. If China’s president can display such blatant disregard to China’s constitution, what will prevent his subordinates from doing similar things? Does this mean that from now on every provincial governor and city major can also twist the laws according to their own wish and stays in power forever?

- It will increase corruption in China. Even if Xi were a saint, some of his underlings would still inevitably go rogue. If Xi has to leave after two terms, these Princelings will lose cover, and be cleaned out relatively easily by the new government. However, if Xi stays in power forever, he will provide cover, knowingly or unknowingly, for these Princelings forever.

- It will undermine China’s international reputation and credibility. If China wants to play a more active role in the international arena and successfully implement the Belt and Road Initiative, she needs positive reputation and good credibility. The fact that Xi cannot uphold the Chinese constitution does not inspire confidence that China will uphold international law and fulfill her promises and contracts. In fact, Xi may become a laughingstock, known as Mao Light internationally and Yuan Shikai II in China.

At first glance, it might look bad for China when Xi abolished the term limit. However, if you think a little deeper, you will find that there must be more than meets the eye.

Yes, Xi has consolidated his power base during the past few years. However, that doesn’t mean he now has the absolute power. With deeply entrenched opposing factions within the CCP, it’s impossible to obtain absolute power. Let’s face it, even Mao fell out of power multiple times during his time, even at the height of his power. If you are familiar with modern Chinese history, you will know that Mao had many challengers. And Mao had to employ desperate measures to gain his power back. And that was when Mao had the complete loyalty of the military. Although Xi has the control of the military, he can never command the loyalty of the military like Mao did. That’s simply because Xi has never led the military in wars.

Many say Xi wants to become an emperor or someone with the status of an emperor. That is impossible in the modern world. Even in ancient times when most people were uneducated and had no idea of democracy and human rights, emperors needed divine help to prove their legitimacy as ultimate rulers. That was why the emperors called themselves “son of heaven”, as in “I was born to rule the world and I have the support of all the gods”. Even that was usually not enough. Such concept would be impossible for the modern Chinese, who grow up playing video games and have been heavily influenced by western values, to accept. If if you want to do some heavy brainwashing, it would take decades. Xi, who is 64 now, doesn’t have decades. So although it looks like this is what Xi wants, it is virtually impossible to do. Xi knows this. Even if he is delusional enough to ignore it, those opposing factions within the CCP would not have allowed.

Then how did he manage to do this? The Chinese CCP must be planning something big. And they need someone with a steady hand to guide them through the change.

This has happened before. Deng Xiaoping stayed in absolute power for decades from late 1970’s to mid 1990’s. Although he didn’t have any formal positions, everyone in the world knew Deng was the one in absolute power. Deng had to do it to guide China through all the economic and political reforms, which were literally 180 deg turn from their old ways. It was a very tumultuous time and they needed someone with a steady hand to keep everything at balance and in check.

I believe China is entering another similar period now. And this is the only possible cause that has united all the opposing factions within the CCP in agreeing to let Xi stay in power for longer. As to what the cause is, who knows... World domination? Political reform? Maybe both? Maybe neither?

supercat said:

Suppose the term limit is really scrapped. What will this do to China’s future? Nothing good I'm afraid:

Click to expand...

Really? NOTHING good? When you say something like this, it shows that you've not read the arguments in support of the change and that your understanding of the dilemma is so shallow that you don't even acknowledge that there are counter points. You think that everyone who supports this has got to be literally insane and mentally retarded because that many people are advocating for a stance that has NO benefits at all. If you want to debate intelligently, you need to at least understand that there are pros and cons to this change before you decide which side you believe outweighs the other.

supercat said:

- It will compromise the political stability of the Chinese government. One of the existential political problems that an authoritarian government such as China must solve is how to find a workable and stable way for government succession. The removal of the term limit for China’s presidency now is no ordinary constitutional change, because it dismantles the functioning succession mechanism established through the effort of a generation’s Chinese, and put China’s future governmental transition in the limbo. It lends credence to the typical anti-China drivel that “Chinese elites will never figure out a peaceful way for power transfer, so it’s just a matter of time that the Chinese government will collapse due to infighting for power.”

Click to expand...

The disadvantage is that transitions can be rough. They must work out good specifics to prevent that from becoming chaos, I agree. Yet just because they haven't laid out every detail before us for judgement does not mean that they don't have a plan or haven't thought about it and China's going back to the feudal age. They will have time to work out the transition mechanism while prolonged rule by a single very capable leader leads to greater stability during his reign. The scope of projects can be longer/larger without fear of being abandoned by the next premier. Allies will trust you more for long-term commitments unafraid that 3 years later, your successor will revoke the deal. There is less effort/resource devoted to successors undoing the deeds of their predecessors. In general, the administration can be more consistent. These are all stabilizers.

Don't worry about "anti-China drivel." They'll always find something; China's economy could be growing at 12% and they'll still find a way to say China's going to collapse. It literally has nothing to do with how China is doing LOL. The last thing you want to do is take them seriously and allow them to influence your decisions or worse, to spend resources trying to placate them. The correct thing to do is let them talk all the shit they want about you and make thier hearts rot out as they watch your economy and military soar above theirs all the while doing everything they told you was wrong.

supercat said:

- It exposes Chinese government’s lack of confidence on its own legal and political institutions. Forget about that China’s governing system is a meritocracy. It seems that Xi and his crop have no illusion that the Chinese system can produce a proper leader after him, or China’s own method of choosing a leader will work, despite China's 1.38 billion population – so he himself has to take over for the next 30 years? This will not only negatively affect domestic Chinese’ confidence on their leader and government, it will also diminish the confidence of overseas Chinese and foreigners – so much for attracting overseas talents.

Click to expand...

What is the definition of a proper leader? Sure, I have great confidence that China can produce leader after leader whom are all quite "proper" and internationally competitive with the leaders of rival countries but that doesn't mean they will be better than Xi. Even among a group of the best, there are still rare stand-outs that should be selected for to rule for longer than their peers. With this vote, China is betting that Xi is that standout.

Diminish the confidence of overseas talent? Ha, that's a stretch. I don't know about you but when I decide where to go, I look at how dynamic the economy is, how beautiful the streets (women) are, and the standard of living. I don't look for who the leader is, and how long he will be in power/how much power he has. The only people concerned with that are people who want to know how much bad shit they can do before they get arrested/killed. Your suggestion parrots western propaganda of how other countries are unbearably "unfree."

supercat said:

- It sets a very bad precedent not only for China’s future presidents, but also for middle and lower level officials. If China’s president can display such blatant disregard to China’s constitution, what will prevent his subordinates from doing similar things? Does this mean that from now on every provincial governor and city major can also twist the laws according to their own wish and stays in power forever?

Click to expand...

The precedence it sets is that you must follow the law. If you want to do something that is currently not allowed, you must debate your case before the CCP members, get approval and a formal party vote to change the law before you proceed. If you cannot complete the formal process, then you cannot do it. This shows that even the premier cannot break the law. Those who can achieve this have followed the proper path in maintaining a strict yet adaptable set of laws.

supercat said:

- It will increase corruption in China. Even if Xi were a saint, some of his underlings would still inevitably go rogue. If Xi has to leave after two terms, these Princelings will lose cover, and be cleaned out relatively easily by the new government. However, if Xi stays in power forever, he will provide cover, knowingly or unknowingly, for these Princelings forever.

Click to expand...

No, it will decrease the corruption. All those dirt-bags waiting for 2023 when Xi will leave so they can try to group-bribe the next premier (not saying it's certain if he will be a man of moral) can all go hang themselves to avoid life in jail. Those who serve under Xi will know that this anti-corruption drive is serious and lasting so they'd better stay clean. Will there still be corruption? Forever, in every country, the answer is yes, but the real question is how much? Is it a cesspool where all politicians have to be corrupt to play the game, or is the a few rogues that sneak around like cockroaches? The latter is always better than the former. With the new changes, Xi's extended anti-corruption drive will have the chance to create a new culture of anti-corruption that can only be nurtured with time.

supercat said:

- It will undermine China’s international reputation and credibility. If China wants to play a more active role in the international arena and successfully implement the Belt and Road Initiative, she needs positive reputation and good credibility. The fact that Xi cannot uphold the Chinese constitution does not inspire confidence that China will uphold international law and fulfill her promises and contracts. In fact, Xi may become a laughingstock, known as Mao Light internationally and Yuan Shikai II in China.

Click to expand...

Laughingstock? LOL There are cold sweats in the West as they stare men like Xi and Putin in the eyes. They can only manage a sigh of relief as they think about the departure of such a skilled and powerful opponent in 2023. After his limits are removed, they will all take him even more seriously because they will know that they cannot wait him out.

A country's reputation has nothing to do with term limits; it has everything to do with economic and military power. There are countries in this world, first world nations, that do not have term limits and their reputations are fine. China will be no exception. The Western media will try to make this look like an apocalypse come true for China as much as they can at first but count the days before it's back to business as usual.

Xi upholds the Chinese constitution by following it. He did not try to stage a military coupe to grab a third term when the laws prohibit it. He asked everyone in power whether they thought the laws needed to be changed and they will vote their decisions into law. This is exactly what we want politicians to do. We don't want them to break the laws, and we don't want them to be mindlessly confined by the laws. We need them make sure that all laws adapt to reflect current situation and opinion. If a law is outdated and no longer the general consensus, then it needs to be changed; be not afraid of this "taboo."

I think almost everybody in China is happy with Xi ... no doubt about it

And Xi doesn't put his son, daughter, son in law, etc in the government or as advisor .. so much less nepotism than .. you know who I meant