Should term limit for China's presidency remain the same, be extended, or eliminated?

voyager1

Captain
Registered Member
I dont know man. Xi is an incredible political fighter. This guy eats up his political opponents like its nothing.

He got stronger after passing the trade war with the US, and especially now with the Covid handling he is extremely strong politically.
I dont know much about China's internal politics but I really doubt that this person can mount a challenge versus Xi.

Anyway, I dont think it matters too much as I believe that Xi will go for his third term on 2022, then another(?) one on 2027.

The debate is if he will get another term on 2027 and then stay all the way to 2032 where he will ultimately step down or on 2027 another will take his place but Xi would stay on the background "guiding" China ala Deng Xiaoping.

I am also interested on hearing what other more knowledgable members think about it
 
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D

Deleted member 15887

Guest
I dont know man. Xi is an incredible political fighter. This guy eats up his political opponents like its nothing.

He got stronger after passing the trade war with the US, and especially now with the Covid handling he is extremely strong politically.
I dont know much about China's internal politics but I really doubt that this person can mount a challenge versus Xi.

Anyway, I dont think it matters too much as I believe that Xi will go for his third term on 2022, then another(?) one on 2027.

The debate is if he will get another term on 2027 and then stay all the way to 2032 where he will ultimately step down or on 2027 another will take his place but Xi would stay on the backgroumd "guiding" China ala Deng Xiaoping.

I am also interested on what other more knowledgable members think about it
I think everyone, even many of his critics, can admit this. Some people accuse Xi of having the education level of a primary school student.... neglecting the fact that he has outmaneuvered his political opponents every step of the way. At the very least, everyone ought to recognize his political craft was decent enough for him to be designated as paramount leader and get term limits removed, whether you support it or not.
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
I think everyone, even many of his critics, can admit this. Some people accuse Xi of having the education level of a primary school student.... neglecting the fact that he has outmaneuvered his political opponents every step of the way. At the very least, everyone ought to recognize his political craft was decent enough for him to be designated as paramount leader and get term limits removed, whether you support it or not.
@lcompocida yup he learn from experience (cultural revolution) and from his father XI ZHONGXUN. Being a princeling also help cause his father had influence within the party and less we forget his impeccable records and achievement. I think Hu even if he is the weakest among the Chinese supremo had trusted and strongly vouch for him with the support of other faction against Jiang and his Shanghai clique. With full authority and support to cleanse the party given the title of both the Presidency and Party general secretariat effectively a strongman. And that trust had been rewarded handsomely so we had to give thanks to his predecessor and now his job is to look for his successor and guided him.
 

crash8pilot

Junior Member
Registered Member
FWIW, I stumbled upon this article last year regarding Xi's succession process (paywalled though, if anyone with an AT subscription is kind enough to paste the full article in the thread, greatly appreciated):
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Hu Chunhua not only belongs in the Hu-Wen Tuanpai Youth League faction (not exactly a Xi loyalist anyway), recent news uncovered massive corruption in Inner Mongolia during his time as Party Secretary of the Autonomous Region. Not only does he face massive headwinds to ascend to one of the top jobs, there might even be a case where investigations into these corruptions leads to his purging from leadership... and perhaps even the party.

Looking back at this thread and the term limits change 3 years later, have any of your calculations or judgements changed or been validated or rejected regarding the implications for the removal of Xi's term limits? Expectations for future moves? Would be interesting to hear from older forum members, esp @Bltizo, @siegecrossbow, or @Deino if you have any perspectives.
The handling of the pandemic as well as Xi's portfolio of accomplishments both on the domestic and foreign front have proven that he's here to stay. I legit see the possibility of Xi bringing back and occupying the position of Chairman of the CCP, a post Mao occupied and was abolished in 1982. It'd allow Xi to hold onto the party leadership (either as Chairman of the party and designating a successor to occupy the position of General Secretary, or just keeping the status quo as General Secretary), Presidency of the country (state), and leadership of the CMC (military) as he guides the country through a crucial period whilst allowing leaders from the 6th generation that he's groomed to occupy key positions in the Politburo... Sorta like Deng did when he held onto the First Ranked Vice Premier position and led the country as Paramount Leader while his proteges Hu Yaobang and Zhao Ziyang ran things on the ground as General Secretary and Premier.

Term limits were only removed for the Presidency and not the Premiership, so Li Keqiang (who belongs to the Hu-Wen faction) will almost certainly have to step down... or perhaps he's garnered enough favor from Xi to move to a lower ranked position (I think unlikely though). Based on my amateur research, I'd say these two candidates face the best chance at ascending to the Premiership next year:
  • Wang Yang
    • Current Standing Committee Member and Chairman of the CPPCC
    • Previously Vice Premier, so he'd have extensive experience and insight on how the State Council works... on top of that he previously governed Guangdong and Chongqing as Party Secretary, which are the CCP's spotlight jobs
    • Belongs in the Hu-Wen faction, but seemingly has a good working relationship with Xi
    • Factions aside, I think he's the most qualified for the job.
  • Liu He
    • Currently 4th ranked Vice Premier and already on the Politburo (although not a Standing Committee Member)
    • He is largely responsible for Xi's economic policy (in other words a massive ally and a guy Xi trusts), and was charged with leading trade talks with the US... so big ticks on the financial, economical, and foreign affairs front.
    • He'll be 70 next year, so he'll need waving of the party's informal retirement rules (七上八下 - in essence you get to stay if you're 67 when the Party Congress first comes into session, however you must retire if you're 68)
    • All hinges on whether Xi can sell it to the party members and elders to see past the informal rule... and I'm just not 100% sure if they'd allow it... however the potential rewards and leadership+insight Liu could provide if given the exception could be massive for China's future.
These names from the current Politburo get thrown around a lot in the press largely because they belong to Xi's faction and they also happen to occupy the party's 'spotlight' grooming positions:
  • Li Xi, Guangdong Party Secretary
  • Chin Min'er, Chongqing Party Secretary
  • Li Qiang, Shanghai Party Secretary
  • My thoughts:
    • Normal promotion pathway to Premier sees a candidate spend time as one of four Vice Premiers to prove he has the goods before promoting to Premier in the upcoming Party Congress... While these guys have loads of experience and accomplishments governing provinces, they lack experience in the State Council.... and well the Premier is in charge of the State Council.
    • I don't think they get promoted to General Secretary or Premier, but I still think they are highly likely to ascend to the Standing Committee and occupy the following positions:
      • Chairman of the either the NPC or the CPPCC (3rd and 4th ranked position in the country respectively) as a way to lead Xi's agenda through legislation
      • Secretary of the Central Commission of Discipline Inspection (CCDI) as a way to reinforce Xi's influence in the party
      • One of four Vice Premier positions
    • While it would seem the party is skipping this generation (6th generation), I do think they have a crucial role to play in China's future. Basically my long way of saying why I don't think these guys will become General Secretary or Premier next year.
I think Wang Huining, current Central Secretariat (basically Xi's highly effective chief of staff, the West thinks he's China's Kissenger) keeps his job... He's a great mind and highly efficient at his job, but its not like he has provincial governing experience or time spent at the State Council to be promoted to say Chairman of the NPC/CPPCC or Premier. Zhao Leji, a Xi ally and current CCDI Secretary, could either keep his job or promote to Chairman of the NPC or CPPCC.

These guys will hold down the fort for the 20th (and maybe the 21st Party Congress as well I think) while leaders from the 7th generation are groomed in key positions in the coming Party Congress.... and depending on the state of global affairs and where the country is at, they'll "rise to power" in the 21st (2027) or 22nd (2032) Party Congress. In other words if I had to make a bet, I think we should have a better idea of China's next paramount leader in 2027 when a new Central Secretariat is named and ascends to General Secretary + Paramount Leader in the 22nd Party Congress.
 

voyager1

Captain
Registered Member
Hu Chunhua not only belongs in the Hu-Wen Tuanpai Youth League faction (not exactly a Xi loyalist anyway), recent news uncovered massive corruption in Inner Mongolia during his time as Party Secretary of the Autonomous Region. Not only does he face massive headwinds to ascend to one of the top jobs, there might even be a case where investigations into these corruptions leads to his purging from leadership... and perhaps even the party.


The handling of the pandemic as well as Xi's portfolio of accomplishments both on the domestic and foreign front have proven that he's here to stay. I legit see the possibility of Xi bringing back and occupying the position of Chairman of the CCP, a post Mao occupied and was abolished in 1982. It'd allow Xi to hold onto the party leadership (either as Chairman of the party and designating a successor to occupy the position of General Secretary, or just keeping the status quo as General Secretary), Presidency of the country (state), and leadership of the CMC (military) as he guides the country through a crucial period whilst allowing leaders from the 6th generation that he's groomed to occupy key positions in the Politburo... Sorta like Deng did when he held onto the First Ranked Vice Premier position and led the country as Paramount Leader while his proteges Hu Yaobang and Zhao Ziyang ran things on the ground as General Secretary and Premier.

Term limits were only removed for the Presidency and not the Premiership, so Li Keqiang (who belongs to the Hu-Wen faction) will almost certainly have to step down... or perhaps he's garnered enough favor from Xi to move to a lower ranked position (I think unlikely though). Based on my amateur research, I'd say these two candidates face the best chance at ascending to the Premiership next year:
  • Wang Yang
    • Current Standing Committee Member and Chairman of the CPPCC
    • Previously Vice Premier, so he'd have extensive experience and insight on how the State Council works... on top of that he previously governed Guangdong and Chongqing as Party Secretary, which are the CCP's spotlight jobs
    • Belongs in the Hu-Wen faction, but seemingly has a good working relationship with Xi
    • Factions aside, I think he's the most qualified for the job.
  • Liu He
    • Currently 4th ranked Vice Premier and already on the Politburo (although not a Standing Committee Member)
    • He is largely responsible for Xi's economic policy (in other words a massive ally and a guy Xi trusts), and was charged with leading trade talks with the US... so big ticks on the financial, economical, and foreign affairs front.
    • He'll be 70 next year, so he'll need waving of the party's informal retirement rules (七上八下 - in essence you get to stay if you're 67 when the Party Congress first comes into session, however you must retire if you're 68)
    • All hinges on whether Xi can sell it to the party members and elders to see past the informal rule... and I'm just not 100% sure if they'd allow it... however the potential rewards and leadership+insight Liu could provide if given the exception could be massive for China's future.
These names from the current Politburo get thrown around a lot in the press largely because they belong to Xi's faction and they also happen to occupy the party's 'spotlight' grooming positions:
  • Li Xi, Guangdong Party Secretary
  • Chin Min'er, Chongqing Party Secretary
  • Li Qiang, Shanghai Party Secretary
  • My thoughts:
    • Normal promotion pathway to Premier sees a candidate spend time as one of four Vice Premiers to prove he has the goods before promoting to Premier in the upcoming Party Congress... While these guys have loads of experience and accomplishments governing provinces, they lack experience in the State Council.... and well the Premier is in charge of the State Council.
    • I don't think they get promoted to General Secretary or Premier, but I still think they are highly likely to ascend to the Standing Committee and occupy the following positions:
      • Chairman of the either the NPC or the CPPCC (3rd and 4th ranked position in the country respectively) as a way to lead Xi's agenda through legislation
      • Secretary of the Central Commission of Discipline Inspection (CCDI) as a way to reinforce Xi's influence in the party
      • One of four Vice Premier positions
    • While it would seem the party is skipping this generation (6th generation), I do think they have a crucial role to play in China's future. Basically my long way of saying why I don't think these guys will become General Secretary or Premier next year.
I think Wang Huining, current Central Secretariat (basically Xi's highly effective chief of staff, the West thinks he's China's Kissenger) keeps his job... He's a great mind and highly efficient at his job, but its not like he has provincial governing experience or time spent at the State Council to be promoted to say Chairman of the NPC/CPPCC or Premier. Zhao Leji, a Xi ally and current CCDI Secretary, could either keep his job or promote to Chairman of the NPC or CPPCC.

These guys will hold down the fort for the 20th (and maybe the 21st Party Congress as well I think) while leaders from the 7th generation are groomed in key positions in the coming Party Congress.... and depending on the state of global affairs and where the country is at, they'll "rise to power" in the 21st (2027) or 22nd (2032) Party Congress. In other words if I had to make a bet, I think we should have a better idea of China's next paramount leader in 2027 when a new Central Secretariat is named and ascends to General Secretary + Paramount Leader in the 22nd Party Congress.
Just saved this amazing post for future reference, thanks for the effort.

I also agree that there is a high possibility that Xi will bring back the position of Chairman

If Xi, brings back the position what role will he play? Can you have a different Chairman, President and Premier?

How will they differentiate their roles? Who will the foreign leaders meet (unlikely to be the Premier), what responsibilities will the president have and what will the chairman?
 
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voyager1

Captain
Registered Member
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Here's the article where you can read it in full.
If it is true that he was involved in Inner Mongolia then he is in big big trouble, like thrown in jail kind of trouble.

Read this:
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A campaign targeting corruption in the coal industry of Inner Mongolia has been expanded to cover all cadres and officials in the northern Chinese region, with investigations to go as far back as two decades.
[We] will go after these people – who use our national resources for bribery, trade power for money by taking advantage of their positions as Communist Party officials and public servants – at all costs and hold them responsible,” Xi said at the annual session of the legislature
“Now, we also won’t tolerate the old cases [pre-2012] once they have been uncovered. Our anti-corruption campaign will never end.”
He is in huge trouble. That was Xi basically targeting everyone who was involved in Inner Mongolia. There is no way he had such a senior position and was not involved in any kind of illegal activity.

Yep, there is no way this guy is gonna have a chance against Xi for the position of President
 

Oldschool

Junior Member
Registered Member
I dont know man. Xi is an incredible political fighter. This guy eats up his political opponents like its nothing.

He got stronger after passing the trade war with the US, and especially now with the Covid handling he is extremely strong politically.
I dont know much about China's internal politics but I really doubt that this person can mount a challenge versus Xi.

Anyway, I dont think it matters too much as I believe that Xi will go for his third term on 2022, then another(?) one on 2027.

The debate is if he will get another term on 2027 and then stay all the way to 2032 where he will ultimately step down or on 2027 another will take his place but Xi would stay on the background "guiding" China ala Deng Xiaoping.

I am also interested on hearing what other more knowledgable members think about it
Xi is given unlimited term specifically to solve the Taiwan situation.
 
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