Should term limit for China's presidency remain the same, be extended, or eliminated?

siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Can't help but wonder if this is one of the catalysts.

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China expressed anger and dissatisfaction on Thursday after the United States Senate passed the Taiwan Travel Act and said some of the clauses violated the "One-China" principle, which they claim is the foundation of China-US relations.

The US Senate passed the Taiwan Travel Act by unanimous consent, as it had also passed the House of Representatives in January without any opposition.

The act states that the US should allow its officials at all levels to travel to Taiwan to meet with their Taiwanese counterparts as well as permit high-level Taiwanese officials to enter the United States "under respectful conditions" to meet their American counterparts. The bill also strongly encourages stronger economic and cultural ties and urges Taiwanese representatives to conduct business in the United States, as reported by Reuters.

Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Hua Chunying (華春瑩)
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the bill seriously violates the "One China" principle.

"China is strongly dissatisfied with this and resolutely opposes it, and has already lodged stern representations with the U.S. side," Hua said in a news briefing on Thursday.

She also mentioned that China urges the United States to cease all official ties with Taiwan and prudently and appropriately handle issues related to Taiwan to avoid seriously interfering with and damaging China-U.S. relations", as reported by
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.

Meanwhile Taiwan praised US and thanked the government for its constant support and increasingly friendly attitude towards Taiwan.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs said, "The Foreign Ministry will keep developing an even more substantive cooperative relationship with the United States, to promote both sides' joint values and mutually-beneficial interests."

The bill still awaits President Donald Trump's signature, and White House officials did not provide any immediate response when asked by US media if he planned to sign the legislation. Still, US media report it would be rather unusual for a president to veto a measure that was accepted by all and passed without any opposition.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
My relatives in the army and air force are saying support for Xi is extremely high in the military, and support for the extending ruling is just as high. And support for a leader with a military background like Xi is pretty much through the roof in the officer corps and soldiers alike.
Same here. My family members in the Chinese scientific circle say there is a lot of admiration and love for Xi among the Chinese scientific community because they believe that only he can clean out the rampant corruption and undeserved ranks held by most of the elite members of the Chinese Academy of Sciences. Under Xi, they are finally beginning to be scrutinized with more and more important projects not entrusted to these "elite rank holders". The rising and morally just scientists say it would be a disaster if Xi were gone in 2023 and replaced by someone who was less enthusiastic about seeing the anti-corruption drive through.
 
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taxiya

Brigadier
Registered Member
One thing I want to remind everyone is that "the term limit should NOT be an issue in the first place".

Remind everyone, the German Chancellor has no term limit. Merkel has just won her FOURTH election, and with 99% chance will enter her FOURTH term and rule Germany for another 4 years after ruling already for 12 years. Why it is not an issue? Why it is so much an issue for Chinese president?
 
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B.I.B.

Captain
One thing I want to remind everyone is that "the term limit should NOT be an issue in the first place".

Remind everyone, the German Chancellor has no term limit. Merkel has just won her FOURTH election, and with 99% chance will enter her FOURTH term and rule Germany for another 4 years after ruling already for 12 years. Why it is not an issue? Why it is so much an issue for Chinese president?

@taxiya. You are far too inteligent to not know how a person from the West wil answer.
 

supercat

Major
...

I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about. Whether or not Xi is upholding Chinese law comes down to one simple question: Did he do anything illegal? If he did, point it out. If not, if making changes to the constitution is not illegal, then you've got no case; he's factually upholding the law.

I don't think you understand what a constitution is. It's a piece of paper with words on it. It is not unchangeable, sacred, or holy. If lawmakers feel that one if its rules is more of a liability than an asset, it can be eliminated or changed by legal process. And that is what is happening. You are acting like people are scribbling over the 10 holy commandments of God here (I'm not religious and don't believe that) when its actually just people in a room who are changing a set of rules that other people in the same room made up years ago. Constitution = made by people, can be changed/ unmade by people. Nothing taboo about it.

It's difficult to argue with someone about constitution who does not have a firm grasp of the concept of "rule of law". The constitution is the law of laws and must be respected. Its amendment must be conducted in an open and democratic manner, through public debate and real voting.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
It's difficult to argue with someone about constitution who does not have a firm grasp of the concept of "rule of law". The constitution is the law of laws and must be respected. Its amendment must be conducted in an open and democratic manner, through public debate and real voting.
This is at least the second time you've said that democracy is needed but through the past 40 years, China has proven that it is not. Your view is entirely Western and absolutely irrelevant to China. China's original constitution was never voted on directly by the people or made democratically; China does not claim itself to be a democratic nation; so by what odd logic does changing this non-democratically formed constitution suddenly require democratic "real" voting? (And by the way, even the US does not do this or Hillary would have won. Amendments to the US constitution are made similarly by a politician's vote just like the upcoming one in China; no "real" democratic voting needed.) Your suggestion of forcing a direct vote from the people not only lacks precedence, but is also truly against the Chinese constitution and political structure.

I have explained this enough times for everyone except you to understand. Xi is following the law by changing the constitution through full legal process rather than breaking it. If you still think he's not following the law but also can't point out what Chinese law he violated, that's because you're inventing laws in your head about the constitution being unchangeable until the end of time. Xi has followed all the real Chinese laws; the only laws he broke are the ones that exist solely in your imagination.
 
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supercat

Major
This is the second time you've said that democracy is needed but through the past 40 years, China has proven that it is not. Your view is entirely Western and absolutely irrelevant to China. China's original constitution was never voted on directly by the people or made democratically; China does not claim itself to be a democratic nation; so by what odd logic does changing this non-democratically formed constitution suddenly require democratic "real" voting? (And by the way, even the US does not do this or Hillary would have won.)

I mean the democratic process only applies to constitution amendment. I'm not asking for presidential election with universal suffrage and all that. How the constitution written originally is entirely a different matter at this point.

I have explained this enough times for everyone except you to understand. Xi is following the law by changing the constitution through full legal process rather than breaking it. If you still think he's not following the law but also can't point out what Chinese law he violated, that's because you're inventing laws in your head about the constitution being unchangeable until the end of time. Xi has followed all the real Chinese laws; the only laws he broke are the ones that exist solely in your imagination.

Although Xi did not violate the law overtly, he arrived at this stage through some black box operation/murky behind-scene political maneuvering. That's what worries me.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
I mean the democratic process only applies to constitution amendment. I'm not asking for presidential election with universal suffrage and all that. How the constitution written originally is entirely a different matter at this point.
The problem with that is you made it up. That's your personal idea, NOT the Chinese constitution. Let's be clear that Xi went against your personal opinion, NOT Chinese law.
Although Xi did not violate the law overtly, he arrived at this stage through some black box operation/murky behind-scene political maneuvering. That's what worries me.
Prove it. We can all sit here and take shots in the dark with our imaginations about how corrupt and dirty all the politicians in the world are but it means nothing if you've got no evidence of what he did.
 
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Can't help but wonder if this is one of the catalysts.

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It must be said that China isn't taking any chances with the US clearly choosing to be increasingly hostile since several years ago. There are multiple flashpoints including Taiwan that can flare up on its own or be pushed into flaring up as a major crisis. I can see how China's leadership would prefer to simplify top level politics to allow for more decisiveness in case of crisis.

Here's China's counter:
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Beijing makes it easier for Taiwanese to work and study in China, and Taipei is freaking out over it
By RALPH JENNINGS
MAR 01, 2018 | 3:00 AM
| TAIPEI, TAIWAN

Some Taiwanese have long feared that China would try to take back the island by force. This week China tried a far gentler approach: measures to make it easier for Taiwanese to invest, work and study on the mainland.

Still, the 31 measures unnerved the government in Taipei, which accused China of trying to lure away talent while undermining Taiwanese political identity.

Those reactions from Taipei come less than a week before China's legislature begins annual meetings that normally include a sweeping, high-level statement on the future of Beijing's ever thorny relations with Taiwan. They also follow nearly two years of diplomatic and economic pressure from Beijing against Taiwanese President Tsai Ing-wen.

China claims sovereignty over democratic and self-ruled Taiwan, viewing it as a rogue province. China insists on eventual unification, by force if needed, despite Taiwanese government polls showing that 70% to 80% of Taiwanese people prefer their autonomy.

China's Taiwan Affairs Office on Wednesday announced the measures aimed at attracting Taiwanese people to do business or study in China.

Twelve of the measures would give Taiwanese investors equal treatment with mainland counterparts. The office said the package overall would help Taiwanese factories cut manufacturing and operating costs and allow their goods to reach further into the massive Chinese market, a hallmark of the $11.2-trillion-plus Chinese economy that grows about 7% every year.

Nineteen measures make it easier to study, set up businesses and work in China.

"They are aimed at sharing the opportunities of the mainland's development with Taiwan compatriots," the Taiwan Affairs Office said on its website.

The Taiwanese government's Mainland Affairs Council dismissed the measures as an attempt by China to fulfill its goal of fusing the island and mainland together.

"Recently mainland China has tightened pressure on us, then it releases 'measures advantageous to Taiwan' to win over our public," the council said in a statement. "For mainland China to repeatedly launch numerous measures like that over the long term means it's accelerating its one-sided economic development goals by attracting Taiwanese resources as well as hoping [the measures] will help change Taiwan's political identity."

A day before China announced the measures, Taiwan's president appealed for foreign help in keeping her island autonomous. China has the world's third-strongest military, compared with Taiwan's at No. 19.

China and Taiwan have been separately ruled since the Chinese civil war of the 1940s, when Chiang Kai-shek's Nationalists lost the mainland to the Communists and moved their government to Taipei.

"Taiwan's stance of maintaining status quo will not change," Tsai said at a Foreign Ministry event Tuesday in Taipei, meaning no unification. "But I want to remind that this maintenance is not just one country's responsibility. Maintaining the status quo requires every country in the region to work hard together."

Beijing resents Tsai for declining to see both sides as parts of one country, a precondition for any dialogue. Tsai, who took office in 2016, is also backed by a political party with senior members who advocate more distance from China.

To pressure Tsai, a 61-year-old law scholar, China has flown military aircraft near the island and blocked Taiwan from joining United Nations organizations. The Taiwanese government said it canceled a February cultural event in the Indian Ocean nation of Mauritius after China forced a Taiwanese plane to turn back.

Beijing's 31 measures cut out any relations with the Taiwanese government, noted Alexander Huang, a strategic studies professor at Tamkang University in Taiwan.

"All these measures are targeting Taiwan people," Huang said. "They are communicating with the people. They bypass the government and say, 'We'll take care of you.' They're turning from de jure unification into a de facto one."

Tsai's plea Tuesday may bolster efforts in Tokyo and Washington to help Taiwan without jeopardizing their own relations with China, experts say. Both are staunch informal allies of Taiwan hoping to check China's influence in the Asia-Pacific region.

Japan might "tease" the idea of letting Taiwan join the Trans-Pacific Partnership trade agreement as leaders in Tokyo revive the 11-nation pact after U.S. withdrawal more than a year ago, said Sean King, vice president of the Park Strategies consulting firm in New York. China resents trade deals that cast Taiwan as a state rather than part of Chinese territory.

"Tokyo will continue to try to balance economic engagement with China while developing official and unofficial strategic partnerships in the region including …Taiwan," said Stephen Nagy, senior associate professor in politics and international studies at International Christian University in Tokyo.

Japan and Singapore sent experts to Taiwan after an earthquake in February killed 17 people in the eastern city of Hualien, Tsai noted Tuesday. Taiwan barred China from sending help.

Washington may be inspired to sell more advanced weaponry to Taiwan after the June 29 announcement of a $1.4-billion arms package, some analysts say. In January, the U.S. House of Representatives passed a bill calling for more high-level U.S.-Taiwan visits. The Senate passed the bill Wednesday.

Other countries also might "call for greater participation by Taiwan in the international community," said Bonnie Glaser, director of the China Power Project at the Washington-based Center for Strategic and International Studies.

But Chinese officials may believe it is pointless to pressure Tsai this year, said Lin Chong-pin, a retired strategic studies professor in Taiwan. Beijing's "soft prong" in a two-part approach to Taiwan will gain ground instead, he said. Beijing already made it easier last year for Taiwanese to work in China.

It might instead step up actions, such as the measures announced Wednesday, aimed at luring Taiwanese citizens to China, he said. Wednesday's measures also offer advantages to Taiwanese people in taxation, land use and healthcare, the Taiwan Affairs Office said.

Jennings is a special correspondent.
 
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supercat

Major
The problem with that is you made it up. That's your personal idea, NOT the Chinese constitution. Let's be clear that Xi went against your personal opinion, NOT Chinese law.

It's not my ideal. It's how things should be done in a country that is not a banana republic.

Prove it. We can all sit here and take shots in the dark with our imaginations about how corrupt and dirty all the politicians in the world are but it means nothing if you've got no evidence of what he did.

The proof is that everyone was surprised by the announcement that China was suddenly at the cusp of eliminating the term limit and the change was about to be rubber-stamped. No one would have been surprised if had there been public debate and due process about the matter.
 
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