Russia may purchase Mistral class LHD from France


Ambivalent

Junior Member
The VMF never built a modern amphibious assault ship. The closest they got were the three Ivan Rogov's, whice are really just jumbo LST's. The docking well is tiny, they must beach to do their work. The VMF lacks big utility landing craft as well. Their amphibious lift was purely tactical, available to be used in theater, but there was no strategic sealift or the ability to stage a big amphibious assault far from the USSR's or Russia's borders.
The Mistral class would give a very much improved capability to the Russians. The Mistrals are, however, built to commercial standards to save on cost, they are not built to military standards. This was a deliberate choice of the French. They will not have the same level of damage control or water tight compartmentation as a true warship.
Btw, I thought the Russians wanted to build their own Mistrals with French help???
 

Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
Yeah they want to buy one and then build another three as I recall.
One for the Black Sea Fleet, one for the Baltic, one for the Far East, one for the Northern Fleet? Or more likely, two for the Black Sea or Far East Fleet and none for the Northern Fleet?
 

Jeff Head

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Yeah they want to buy one and then build another three as I recall.
Buying one, and then getting all of the engineering and manufacturing data from the French to enable them to license-build two or three more would be a huge boost to the Russians from many fronts. Shipbuilding capability wise, employment wise, and amphibious assault capability wise.

Are the French talking about selling a future built Mistral? and then allowing them to license build? It would seem very short sighted for the French to end up with only one Mistral. I would think two would be a minimum for them.
 

Lion

Senior Member
Buying one, and then getting all of the engineering and manufacturing data from the French to enable them to license-build two or three more would be a huge boost to the Russians from many fronts. Shipbuilding capability wise, employment wise, and amphibious assault capability wise.

Are the French talking about selling a future built Mistral? and then allowing them to license build? It would seem very short sighted for the French to end up with only one Mistral. I would think two would be a minimum for them.
Short sighted? Finance, Manpower will be the key for French whether they can afford a 2 or 1.
 

Vlad Plasmius

Junior Member
One for the Black Sea Fleet, one for the Baltic, one for the Far East, one for the Northern Fleet? Or more likely, two for the Black Sea or Far East Fleet and none for the Northern Fleet?
Actually, they may put more of them in the Northern Fleet. I do not think their bases in the Black Sea or Far East are as sufficient. They're looking to change that I'm sure but right now that's where the Kuznetsov is serving.

Buying one, and then getting all of the engineering and manufacturing data from the French to enable them to license-build two or three more would be a huge boost to the Russians from many fronts. Shipbuilding capability wise, employment wise, and amphibious assault capability wise.

Are the French talking about selling a future built Mistral? and then allowing them to license build? It would seem very short sighted for the French to end up with only one Mistral. I would think two would be a minimum for them.
Honestly, they're probably looking to export what they can. The Rafale has not had many bites compared to the Eurofighter, JSF, and PAK FA is automatically with India as well as Russia.

It would be a very big sale for them.
 

Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
Actually, they may put more of them in the Northern Fleet. I do not think their bases in the Black Sea or Far East are as sufficient. They're looking to change that I'm sure but right now that's where the Kuznetsov is serving.
I don't know about basing arrangements, but from a strategic standpoint, I don't see that much use for a large amphibious assault capability based out of Murmansk. The days when the VMF had plans to land in Iceland are long gone, and as we saw in the Ossetia War, they have shown interest in using amphibious operations in the Black Sea theater. I was also under the impression that the Russian Navy had some pretty substantial facilities at Vladivostok.
 

Vlad Plasmius

Junior Member
I don't know about basing arrangements, but from a strategic standpoint, I don't see that much use for a large amphibious assault capability based out of Murmansk. The days when the VMF had plans to land in Iceland are long gone, and as we saw in the Ossetia War, they have shown interest in using amphibious operations in the Black Sea theater. I was also under the impression that the Russian Navy had some pretty substantial facilities at Vladivostok.
They have most of their current amphibious ships based in the Black Sea Fleet, but those are at most one fifth the tonnage of the Mistral. The heaviest ship in that fleet is half the tonnage of Mistral. Since Mistral is a helicopter carrier it seems likely that there will be more in the Northern Fleet than anywhere else. The Pacific Fleet is another possible place. That is where Russia's carriers have been stationed. It's possible they will make the Black Sea more accommodating, but it is still a smaller sea and it does not have direct access to a major ocean like the Northern Fleet. I can see one being based there.

Russia's effort to develop bases in the Mediterranean mean they will likely put more equipment in the Black Sea.
 

Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
They have most of their current amphibious ships based in the Black Sea Fleet, but those are at most one fifth the tonnage of the Mistral. The heaviest ship in that fleet is half the tonnage of Mistral. Since Mistral is a helicopter carrier it seems likely that there will be more in the Northern Fleet than anywhere else. The Pacific Fleet is another possible place. That is where Russia's carriers have been stationed. It's possible they will make the Black Sea more accommodating, but it is still a smaller sea and it does not have direct access to a major ocean like the Northern Fleet. I can see one being based there.

Russia's effort to develop bases in the Mediterranean mean they will likely put more equipment in the Black Sea.
I think it really depends on how they intend to use the ship. They could use it as a true amphib assault ship, or they could use it as more of "mini aircraft carrier" for carrying helicopters in order to augment the fleets ASW coverage. If the latter, then yes the Northern Fleet probably will get 2. Or at least thats how I see it.
 

rhino123

Pencil Pusher
VIP Professional
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Are the French talking about selling a future built Mistral? and then allowing them to license build? It would seem very short sighted for the French to end up with only one Mistral. I would think two would be a minimum for them.
Actually I believe that is a way of marketing their product. The French often have this type of strategy, I remember the time when Singapore bought frigates from the French, they also spec, 1 frigate to be build in France and the other five will be built in Singapore. I believe in term of licensing the build and collection of royalties is enough business for the French and also they would not need to spare their own resources for the sales.
 

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