QBZ-191 service rifle family

Norinco_81

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Registered Member
Really hope one day (yes, one day in the distant future far far away) I can live to purchase a 5.56 (or 6.8) version of this thing in my sweet Cali home...
Not with California's gun law, that is.

Also, such the day came when Norinco set up subsidiary to make "firearms" for local consumption, my hunch is the US no longer the top dog.

Since Canada also going after firearms that "look offensive/AR-ish", to experience QBZ-191 anywhere in N.America would be "most unlikely". You've better luck to make yourself a prominent gun blogger/tuber, and get invitation from Norinco(?) to experience QBZ-191 in China - y'know, hands-on shooting, field-striping, tour of the manufacturing facility, etc.
Biggest reason why I escaped from CA! I

I've had this conversation with other Chinese friends in the gun industry. If Norinco wasn't banned in 1994 and continued to import firearms, they would've dominated the US market. I have multiple Chinese clones of US weapons that were (before the import ban) cheaper and even better quality than US ones. I've seen so much poorly made garbage that says "MADE IN USA" in the past 10 years.

One of my good friends lives in BC and tells me all about Canada's stupid gun laws. No import bans and no SBR laws is good, but everything else no thank you!

I love all my Chinese made weapons, AKs, SKSs, 1911s, Hawk 982 (better quality 870 clone). Except for the Hawk, everything else is old, made prior to 1994. I would love to have a semi auto Type 81, QBZ-03 and of course QBZ-191 in 556 since I know China won't ever export 5.8x42mm. As much as I hate bulpups, I'd still buy a QBZ-97 as well.
 

Norinco_81

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Completely agree with your experience of the folding stocks. Having used a few guns with folding stocks I can say that the only advantage they offer is in compact storage for transportation. You really can't fire a folded rifle accurately and make consistent follow up shots even if you use the "pushing the sling forward" technique, so folders are not that practical in CQB or firing from vehicles.

Even still, a lot of the guns are not that easily transported when folded, especially for side folders. Yes the overall length of the gun is reduced when you fold it, but its thickness can be doubled when you fold it to the side. Unless you have a wire style folding stock like MP7, AKMS or similar, I'm not sure folding a gun necessarily saves all that much space unless your gun case is designed for it to be folded. (some of my gun cases are not wide enough to allow for the storage of folded G36 and UMP, but a folded VZ58 is okay)

With regards to the charging handle I also really agree with your point after a recent trip to the range with a friend. He has a SKS that jammed up real bad, a unfired round will not fully load into the chamber and will not extract. My friend cut up his hand real bad trying to use a knife to get it out and it didn't work. I got it out by re-inserting the bolt and let it catch the round, and smack the living f**k out of the gun onto the ground trying to pull the charging handle back. After a few hard smacks the round finally flew out. If a AR-15, QBZ95 or guns without pronounced charging handles are stuck like that, you need some serious tools to be able to clear that jam.

So the simplistic design of the charging handle (like a AK style) for QBZ191 offers the advantage of allowing the users to smack the f**k out of it (or mortaring, the more civilized way to call it) when a round is really jammed up in there. (you can probably use your foot to kick the charging handle down, that should work as well, as long as you make sure to not put your face in front of the barrel)



Glad you point it out too, AK100s, and the new generation of AKs shoot real smooth, at least from the videos I have seen! I AK103 as well, and it shoots 7.62x39 like it is a 556!
I guess buffer tube isn't everything, the overall design of the gun and how recoil impulses travel down the gun matters as well.

As a terrible example of gun design, I have a UMP-9 at home. I don't know if it is the blowback system or its bolt being so heavy, that thing feels like it recoils harder than a 556, even though it is only a 9mm...

From the videos I have seen of the QBZ191 firing (which is not a lot), it does look like it has a bit more recoil than a M4. But then again, when I think about it, all 5.8mm guns seem like they have a bit more recoil than 556 guns. So I don't know what is a realistic expectation to have about QBZ191's recoil, and how low is reasonably low.
Yes, in my experience the only folders that are truly compact are AK underfolders. My old Norinco 56-1 underfolder folds up in a very compact package. My SAM7SF is already very long because of the stupid extended rear trunnion that Arsenal Bulgaria decided to do instead of folding rear trunnion built into the receiver like the AK-100 series. Even folded its still too long for my discreet carrying cases.

What SKS was it? Did he use factory ammo or dented ammo picked off the ground? I just had a stuck case on my Norinco Paratrooper SKS (cut down to 16" barrel). Fortunately it did lock back, as riding over the case rim is actually bad for the extractor, and for most stuck casings, the rim is already too fucked up for the extractor claw to grab on to it anyway.
Since the cleaning rod on this variant of SKS is also shortened it was actually too short to reach the casing lol. Fortunately I had my newly purchased pre-Norinco standard SKS with me with its full length cleaning rod and I was able to knock that casing out with a rock lol. Happened to be an over-pressued round as the primer wanted to pop out too. I normally don't advocate shooting dented rounds picked up off the ground but with insane ammo prices here I am willing to take the risks. I've shot alot of range ammo and rarely had an issue.

How much did the UMP-9 cost you? HK weapons are way too expensive here, especially MP5s and UMPs. It also doesn't help with our bullshit SBR laws which adds on to the cost for people who want a semi auto clone of a a MP5 or UMP without using a pistol brace or having a stupid looking 16" barrel sticking out. Yes, the straight blowback and heavier bolt is the main reason why you will feel the recoil more. Same thing with the Scorpion EVO as it uses the same system. If you shoot the MP5 with its roller delayed blowback it is so much softer shooting.

I wouldn't worry about the recoil of 5.8x42mm. If the round does have superior performance over 556 then increased recoil should be expected. It will still be much less than 7.62x39. I can shoot my AKs all day but yes you will feel it if you don't hold it tight into the pocket of your shoulder!
If you've seen the video of the PLA soldier doing a full auto mag dump one handed unsupported with a drum in his QBZ-95, it looks very controllable! Hopefully he will do the same with the new rifle as well.
 

by78

General
View attachment 73099

Another good new pic of the QBU-191

A closer look at that optic.

51236133207_d3f5035afc_o.png
 

MwRYum

Major
AK's complete rod and trap door cleaning kit was a much much better system than the rarely used butt stock door thing on the end of the M16.

I'm actually pretty surprised how easy my ARs are to clean these days.

Back to topic.................................

Supposedly 191 has a high quality barrel. I assume that means it is cold hammer forged. Any idea what the sustained MOA is on the carbine and DMR?
Most common firearms are not hard to clean/maintain, unless you're a total idiot which you should never qualified to carry a piece, even in Texas.

As for the MOA quality of QBZ-191, thus far it's not known. Given the way that China is about this thing, the only possibility to glean into such when some foreign country adopt 5.8mm and QBZ-191 series wholesale. If not even Cambodia does that (theirs 5.56mm Type 97 and other stuff last I checked, 5.8mm still China exclusive) that possibility is even slimmer.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
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Registered Member
@Bltizo
I noticed that the MLok handguard also has retaining pin like the polymer one. Now I'm worried whether the MLok handguard actually free floated.

View attachment 73172
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View attachment 73171

?tag

I'm not a firearms guy.

In any case, I'm not sure whether that's a retaining pin and whether that's associated with the handguard (FF or not) in the first place.

To me it looks more associated with the iron sight, and the pictures of the QBU/QBV's hanguard doesn't have the same two "layers" as the standard rifle handguards that is a distinctive feature of why it was ultimately concluded it wasn't FF
 

Kejora

Junior Member
Registered Member
?tag

I'm not a firearms guy.

In any case, I'm not sure whether that's a retaining pin and whether that's associated with the handguard (FF or not) in the first place.

To me it looks more associated with the iron sight, and the pictures of the QBU/QBV's hanguard doesn't have the same two "layers" as the standard rifle handguards that is a distinctive feature of why it was ultimately concluded it wasn't FF
It's on 6:08
 

Aniah

Senior Member
Registered Member
Found this online. Someone made a 3d digital model of a 191 with a new handguard. Looks different from the sniper barrel but haves the gas port at the far end compared to the standard and carbine.

Type 191 58.jpg

Type 191 59.jpg

Type 191 60.jpg
Type 191 61.jpg
Type 191 62.jpg
Type 191 63.jpg
 
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