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00CuriousObserver

Senior Member
Registered Member
@Blitzo What's your take on the whole political side of PLA that has been cumulating during the past years

On one hand, there is so much rumour and speculation. While we are no strangers to rumours, in this case a lot are not even verifiable.

On the other hand, there is clearly something major going on and goes beyond "it's just corruption and graft". It's not illogical to conclude that there is a serious impact on PLA's combat readiness.
 

Blitzo

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
@Blitzo What's your take on the whole political side of PLA that has been cumulating during the past years

On one hand, there is so much rumour and speculation. While we are no strangers to rumours, in this case a lot are not even verifiable.

On the other hand, there is clearly something major going on and goes beyond "it's just corruption and graft". It's not illogical to conclude that there is a serious impact on PLA's combat readiness.

I believe thinking about it in reverse is a useful way of going about it.
We see the actions taken (investigations and dismissals of various senior military individuals), and we are aware of context (Xi's ongoing efforts to develop a more systematized military and civilian bureaucracy as well as ongoing anti-corruption efforts to whatever standard that he and his allies aspire the CPC to be at, as well as major PLA exclusive reforms in organizational and operational aspects).

And because of these actions, we do know there is of course going to be short term effects on aspects of military readiness (though perhaps not on the wholesale strategic level nor in every single permutation of conflict or tension that may arise, but certainly some of them could be true).

If the question is whether the driver for these actions are due to concerns of PLA combat readiness... I suppose my question is, relative to what, and what are the primary drivers?

E.g.; if we're comparing the PLA's absolute degree of combat readiness today compared to say, 2012, or 2006, I would say today (and in recent years) many times greater than what they possessed over a decade ago or two decades ago.
But if we're comparing the PLA's degree of combat readiness today, to where the CPC would like the PLA to be today, and for the future, then it is possible they are not there yet. (I would also add that where the "CPC would like the PLA to be" can be different to "combat readiness sufficient to fight and win a conflict over Taiwan or fight and win a westpac conflict under most conditions".)



If we entertain the idea that there is a gap between "where the CPC would like the PLA to be" and what its actual state is today (keeping in mind even where it is today, as mentioned should be much greater than where the PLA was at before) -- the question is what is the cause of it.
This could be innumerable, but personally I don't see how "generic graft/corruption" -- even if it is historical -- could not impact combat readiness (e.g.: procurement methods having impropriety, senior officers retaining indirect stakes in XYZ economic interests).
Furthermore, would not warrant serious consequences especially in keeping with Xi's overall focus/obsession on having a new baseline of bureaucratic cleanliness, and I could also see senior officers trying to minimize or not be outwardly open about past impropriety may be viewed as severe lacking in obeying party discipline as well as not following civilian instructions, if such impropriety is discovered after the fact.

All of which is to say, who knows.

Anything in theory is possible. In many cases one's assessment of these kind of actions are a referendum on their opinions about the direction of Xi and the CPC overall in the last decade or so.
 

siegecrossbow

Field Marshall
Staff member
Super Moderator
I don’t understand the fixation on this. If you guys recall several years back there were high level scandals in the semiconductor industry as well with high profile arrests. Did that mean Chinese semiconductor industry lacked readiness and was unable to perform? I don’t much think so. Head of Olympics Gou Wenzhong was convicted and imprisoned as well. Did that stop China for winning gold medals? Did the arrest of the God Father of Chinese HSR stop it from becoming the longest and most technologically sophisticated HSR of its kind?

The fact that they pulled off a cold start near the tail end of 2025 with basically no warning at all and the coordination of assets/across branches shows that with or without “purges” things are improving at a rapid pace. Winologists from across the strait are in for a big surprise if they think that they are spared because of this.
 

Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
Registered Member
I am not sure wsj is still consider credible but they are reporting Zhang leaked nuclear secrets to the US

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I could never understand how a military man steeped in the long history of China's military failure- from ancient times to the present - like Zhang, could have fought and almost died for the motherland, only to be accused of a monumental charge of leaking nuclear secrets to the very enemy trying to undermine the country's strength and sovereignty!!
 

latenlazy

Brigadier
I could never understand how a military man steeped in the long history of China's military failure- from ancient times to the present - like Zhang, could have fought and almost died for the motherland, only to be accused of a monumental charge of leaking nuclear secrets to the very enemy trying to undermine the country's strength and sovereignty!!
It’s very easy to repackage various different rumors into one story that makes it sound like they all have the same level of authenticity. WSJ learned from the best when they covered (for) how mortgage backed securities got repackaged into collateralized debt obligations.
 

Jono

Junior Member
Registered Member
Allow me to play the devil's advocate here.
“攘外必先安内” to deal with an external threat, one must first achieve internal stability and unity.
Can one argue that President Xi is contemplating imminent AR across the strait? Maybe he is unifying consensus within the CMC towards this ultimate goal?
Maybe President Xi is galvanizing morale and support among the middle and junior officers towards AR, seeing that he means business by removing his powerful long-time friend and ally Zhang from his lofty position? Perhaps Zhang was having second thoughts and expressing dissent openly to challenge Xi's authority on this AR issue? Let's not forget that Zhang rose through the ranks by merits (he had fought brilliantly in the Sino-Vietnamese border skirmishes as a regimental commander) and had earned immense respect in the PLA.
Zhang and the faction that looked up to him as leader could pose a serious challenge to the authority of Xi as the Chairman of the CMC if he expressed dissenting views openly, and would sow confusion among the junior (and senior too) ranks as to which direction to take.
So much was taking place behind the scenes, and we keyboard warriors simply had no way to know the full picture.
We could only speculate, but I am pretty sure more information will come to light in the days ahead because the removal of Zhang is simply too significant and carries immense implications and possibly adverse complications if not handled properly.
Just my humble 2 cents.
 

drowingfish

Senior Member
Registered Member
Allow me to play the devil's advocate here.
“攘外必先安内” to deal with an external threat, one must first achieve internal stability and unity.
Can one argue that President Xi is contemplating imminent AR across the strait? Maybe he is unifying consensus within the CMC towards this ultimate goal?
Maybe President Xi is galvanizing morale and support among the middle and junior officers towards AR, seeing that he means business by removing his powerful long-time friend and ally Zhang from his lofty position? Perhaps Zhang was having second thoughts and expressing dissent openly to challenge Xi's authority on this AR issue? Let's not forget that Zhang rose through the ranks by merits (he had fought brilliantly in the Sino-Vietnamese border skirmishes as a regimental commander) and had earned immense respect in the PLA.
Zhang and the faction that looked up to him as leader could pose a serious challenge to the authority of Xi as the Chairman of the CMC if he expressed dissenting views openly, and would sow confusion among the junior (and senior too) ranks as to which direction to take.
So much was taking place behind the scenes, and we keyboard warriors simply had no way to know the full picture.
We could only speculate, but I am pretty sure more information will come to light in the days ahead because the removal of Zhang is simply too significant and carries immense implications and possibly adverse complications if not handled properly.
Just my humble 2 cents.
it's not about getting consensus, consensus is already there, PLA won't say no to a fight, why would they turn down such an opportunity?

Xi's concern lies with how a war, especially a protracted one, could potentially alter the balance of power within the CMC. uniformed elements of the CMC would be bolstered either by a swift victory or a protracted war in case the US intervenes. To preempt this, my guess is Xi wanted certain reform of the CMC that would have resulted in the weakening of the uniformed leaders. This proposal naturally would not have been supported by Zhang and Liu, resulting in their removal.
 

Blitzo

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Allow me to play the devil's advocate here.
“攘外必先安内” to deal with an external threat, one must first achieve internal stability and unity.
Can one argue that President Xi is contemplating imminent AR across the strait? Maybe he is unifying consensus within the CMC towards this ultimate goal?
Maybe President Xi is galvanizing morale and support among the middle and junior officers towards AR, seeing that he means business by removing his powerful long-time friend and ally Zhang from his lofty position? Perhaps Zhang was having second thoughts and expressing dissent openly to challenge Xi's authority on this AR issue? Let's not forget that Zhang rose through the ranks by merits (he had fought brilliantly in the Sino-Vietnamese border skirmishes as a regimental commander) and had earned immense respect in the PLA.
Zhang and the faction that looked up to him as leader could pose a serious challenge to the authority of Xi as the Chairman of the CMC if he expressed dissenting views openly, and would sow confusion among the junior (and senior too) ranks as to which direction to take.
So much was taking place behind the scenes, and we keyboard warriors simply had no way to know the full picture.
We could only speculate, but I am pretty sure more information will come to light in the days ahead because the removal of Zhang is simply too significant and carries immense implications and possibly adverse complications if not handled properly.
Just my humble 2 cents.

I don't think any hypothesis requires planning for a Taiwan contingency as some sort of component, especially given PRC policy hasn't particularly changed in that regard.

Xi and his allies being a true believer of bureaucratic reform in the PLA (and CPC, PRC overall) and pursuit of contemporary standards for corruption and graft would be more than enough of a basis to make these sort of changes, and is probably the most simple answer rather than anything more exotic.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
that extractly why china can't afford any big enough Corruption specially in military like US/west+their allied .
no ability to help themselves to cover thing up , no one help , more than half of the world basically make money improve their life out of any china mistake .
you can easily guess how big bad consequence china gonna get if they let Corruption fked them up in any serious confict
What is this logic? China can't afford corruption because the corruption will be exposed, fixed, and cause the West to underestimate China by failing the "know thy enemy" aspect while America can afford corruption because it will be hidden so it can rot and fester uncontrolled?
 

Jono

Junior Member
Registered Member
@ Blitzo. That's why I added the disclaimer that there is so much happening behind the scenes that we could never know the true and full picture.
But still, I based my speculation partly on the official allegations against Zhang that he was trying to put into question the authority of Xi as the Chairman of the CMC.
Or maybe I have missed the mark somewhat??
 
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