Modern Carrier Battle Group..Strategies and Tactics

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

I agree with this viewpoint. It is almost impossible to single handily sink an aircraft carrier like back in WWII with the kamikaze style attack. With AAW surrounding the carrier and CAP constantly on the lookout, it is almost impossible to penetrate the defense nowadays with one hit attack with "conventional" non-stealth aircraft. The successful strategy would rely on a war of attrition - constant barrage of AShMs (either land based, sea launched or air launched) to slowly degrade the defence, and to completely empty the enemy AA munitions. The J-20 *could* serve as first strike weapon to deliver AShMs in early stage, as it can get much closer to the target, thus greatly increase the penetration and destruction of the target. It can also serve as CAP for the follow on bombers to intercept enemy CAPs.

Or... you could just launch a barrage of stand off anti ship missiles from ships, land, submarines, air. Or you can use the much vaunted anti ship ballistic missile. Or you could use quiet small diesel subs lying in wait to take down ships with torpedos... Any of those are better than wasting J-20s to directly attack CVBGs in any way, even if it's part of a concerted attack -- unless the defenses are already down, in which case aircraft like flankers or JH-7 can do the job just as well.

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Really, it's interesting there's red sword on one end saying J-20s won't be used for strike because that'd be a waste of it's air to air capabilities, then anton's saying J-20 wont only be used for strike, but also to strike CVBGs, and that it's not got a lot of capability in air superiority...
-sigh- I'm sure the truth is somewhere between the two.
 

Asymptote

Banned Idiot
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

So you're proposing risking J-20s to "degrade" the defenses of a CVBG, with unpowered munitions (like LS-6, FT series bombs -- only those can fit into the internal weapons bay at the moment)?

Wouldn't it be easier just to directly use relatively cheap anti ship missiles instead of expensive J-20s?

Anti-ship Missiles (AShM) are non-stealth flying objects. Thus it is easier to be detected than stealth fighters like J-20. The reason being you don't want to put your stealth technologies on missiles that can malfunction and not detonate - thus compromising ALL of your stealth technologies if fallen into enemy hand. This happen to many American 'conventional' cruise missiles during Balkan war and Iraq War with several of them that didn't explode on command and eventually acquired by China. The AGM-129 "Advanced Cruise Missile" is the ONLY american cruise missile with stealth technologies. And its only tipped with nuclear warhead (with no conventional warhead variants) - meaning it is only use as the last resort with total certainty of mutual annihlation (when used with other nuclear weapons), thus no possibility of stealth technology can be compromised.

So, like I have said in the previous post, the best plan would probably be using J-20 to deliver air-launch AShMs to penetrate the enemy air defenses at closest possible distance, giving enemy little time to react. Using J-20 as launching platform for AShM also has the advantage of decreasing the fuel payload of AShM (compare to land based/sea based version), thus increase the explosive payload of the missile and greatly increase the destruction of the target.
 
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Asymptote

Banned Idiot
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

Or... you could just launch a barrage of stand off anti ship missiles from ships, land, submarines, air. Or you can use the much vaunted anti ship ballistic missile. Or you could use quiet small diesel subs lying in wait to take down ships with torpedos... Any of those are better than wasting J-20s to directly attack CVBGs in any way, even if it's part of a concerted attack -- unless the defenses are already down, in which case aircraft like flankers or JH-7 can do the job just as well.

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Really, it's interesting there's red sword on one end saying J-20s won't be used for strike because that'd be a waste of it's air to air capabilities, then anton's saying J-20 wont only be used for strike, but also to strike CVBGs, and that it's not got a lot of capability in air superiority...
-sigh- I'm sure the truth is somewhere between the two.

While the ASBM project is a great success for the PLA, I don't think they can use it as abundantly as conventional missiles. Balllistic missile by nature, are very expensive to produce. Separation of stages must be carefully machined and calibrated, and the solid fuel rockets are notorious for being expensive and prone to failures. I am almost certain PLA can only field limited amount of ASBM (less than ~100 - since the very similar DF-21 in the inventory are around 60-80 so far only) only as deterrent, not as offensive weapon. So the tactics of using ASBMs sparingly to saturate the target would not be possible. It is impossible to break the american fleet air defense since each CVBG (or CSG - carrier strike group) would have 1-2 Aegis guided missile cruisers (CG) (each equipped with standard missiles SM-2 or SM-3 which are designed to intercept ballistic missiles), of the Ticonderoga class (68 SM-2 each); 2-3 guided missile destroyers (DDG), of the Arleigh Burke class (96 SM-3 each), that's a total of (68+92+92) 260 SM missiles MINIMUM to overcome, or (68+68+92+92+92) 424 at the upper range of the count. With less than 100 ASBMs to utilize, it simply cannot be a threat to the american CSG fleet if you only use ASBM.

The Russians had this "mass missile swarming" strategy to overcome american CSG back in the cold war days, and the Americans knew about this and already had strategies to counter this. I don't think replaying the same strategy in this day and age 20 years after cold war ended this is very smart.

On the other hand, I think Americans for whatever the reason have not anticipated other countries to acquire stealth technologies. I have NEVER heard of talk of such in any of the defence circles and they seem to think they can keep stealth tech to themselves forever. So I think they are totally not prepared for stealth based offensive weapons. All of their current OP plans and naval strategies and physical assets are based around the cold war era of assuming the other side have only conventional / ballistic weapons and no stealth weapons.


Ask BD Popeye or Jeff Head. I am sure they have never heard of any contingency plan to counter enemy stealth offensive on CSG. I think this has only become a topic now after the unveiling of J-20 beginning of this year.

That made me think this "public unveiling" of J-20 is kinda premature. Had China not publicly unveil the J-20, Americans would probably never even imagine a stealth offensive from counter force and they would continue the same strategies and OP plans well into the future.
 
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IronsightSniper

Junior Member
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

While the ASBM project is a great success for the PLA, I don't think they can use it as abundantly as conventional missiles. Balllistic missile by nature, are very expensive to produce. Separation of stages must be carefully machined and calibrated, and the solid fuel rockets are notorious for being expensive and prone to failures. I am almost certain PLA can only field limited amount of ASBM (less than ~100 - since the very similar DF-21 in the inventory are around 60-80 so far only) only as deterrent, not as offensive weapon. So the tactics of using ASBMs sparingly to saturate the target would not be possible. It is impossible to break the american fleet air defense since each CVBG (or CSG - carrier strike group) would have 1-2 Aegis guided missile cruisers (CG) (each equipped with standard missiles SM-2 or SM-3 which are designed to intercept ballistic missiles), of the Ticonderoga class (68 SM-2 each); 2-3 guided missile destroyers (DDG), of the Arleigh Burke class (96 SM-3 each), that's a total of (68+92+92) 260 SM missiles MINIMUM to overcome, or (68+68+92+92+92) 424 at the upper range of the count. With less than 100 ASBMs to utilize, it simply cannot be a threat to the american CSG fleet if you only use ASBM.

The Russians had this "mass missile swarming" strategy to overcome american CSG back in the cold war days, and the Americans knew about this and already had strategies to counter this. I don't think replaying the same strategy in this day and age 20 years after cold war ended this is very smart.

On the other hand, I think Americans for whatever the reason have not anticipated other countries to acquire stealth technologies. I have NEVER heard of talk of such in any of the defence circles and they seem to think they can keep stealth tech to themselves forever. So I think they are totally not prepared for stealth based offensive weapons. All of their current OP plans and naval strategies and physical assets are based around the cold war era of assuming the other side have only conventional / ballistic weapons and no stealth weapons.


Ask BD Popeye or Jeff Head. I am sure they have never heard of any contingency plan to counter enemy stealth offensive on CSG. I think this has only become a topic now after the unveiling of J-20 beginning of this year.

That made me think this "public unveiling" of J-20 is kinda premature. Had China not publicly unveil the J-20, Americans would probably never even imagine a stealth offensive from counter force and they would continue the same strategies and OP plans well into the future.

Just some things I'd like to add.

1. Even though I'm not sure how the DF-21D AShBM got into this, a U.S.N. CBG does have at least 2 Ticonderoga Class missile cruisers and 2 Arleigh Burke class Destroyers, HOWEVER, they do not carry a standard load of ABMs. Their VLS are modular, in that they allow multiple missiles of different classes to be carried (i.e. one Ticonderoga class can carry some Tomahawk missiles, some Harpoon missiles, some SM-2 missiles, etc). So that 260 missile number is actually the Maximum number of missiles for the DF-21 AShBM to overcome.

Another thing to add, is that you really don't need 260 missiles to shoot one DF-21 down. High-speed maneuvers do not make a missile easy to destroy but the thing about that DF-21D, i.e. what makes it so different, is that it's a Ballistic missile, and thus, out range many conventional AShM designs but also in that because it's Ballistic, it's trajectory allows a high-speed dive, Mach 10 I believe, or 3.4 km per second, which means that defense systems have less time to detect and destroy the Missile. The problem with the DF-21D also comes from the fact that it's a Ballistic missile. For one, high-speed sea skimmers like the Russian 3M54 Klub are had to detect by virtue of it's cruise height, some say as low as 3 meters above sea level. The DF-21D however, will end up at a relatively high altitude, which will allow almost every sensor in that CBG to detect it, and thus, engage and destroy it. Finally, the DF-21D is fast, but it's not beyond current ABM technologies. I am unsure of the maximum engage speed of the SM-3, but an inferior ABM system, the S-400 SAM from Russia, can engage missiles with speeds up to 4.8 km per second (almost Mach 14). So, the DF-21D is certainly an interesting AShM, but it won't clear the seas so to say. Now going back on topic.

Uh, I'm not sure about that conjecture regarding American defense circles, but many countries outside the U.S. has studied and experimented and sometimes, produced, Stealth-based technologies and prototypes. In a way, the U.S. is prepared for "Stealth offensive weapons", as the only anti-stealth, so to say, missile out there relies on Infrared seeking (Heat Seekers) technology, the simplest way to defeat that is of course, a flare. And yes, I can confirm that the F-22 does indeed emit a rather large heat signature, despite the reductions.

Uhm, I do believe you are confused. The Current U.S. operational plans revolve around Asymmetrical warfare, that's to say, we don't plan on engaging a competent opponent like Russia or China, but rather, folks like Pre-war Iraq, crap Army, non existent navy, and propaganda-pumped airforces. In a way, again, we are prepared for Anti-stealth warfare. The simplest way to counter Stealth is again, Infrared. Recent developments in the field of QWIP (Quantum Well Infrared Photodetector) by us, Europe, and Russia, has further advanced IR sighting technologies. Hell, we already have an IR ball equipped with QWIPs, something I haven't seen from Europe or Russia yet (check FLIR's website).

That made me think this "public unveiling" of J-20 is kinda premature. Had China not publicly unveil the J-20, Americans would probably never even imagine a stealth offensive from counter force and they would continue the same strategies and OP plans well into the future.

Measure and Countermeasure. This also gives a peak maybe, at China's plans. Unlike some warmongering folks I have read on other forums who have thought this same thought, perhaps China is not preparing for a total war with NATO. And they have perfectly fair reasons for not wanting a war. For one, nukes. For two, the economy. For three, is Taiwan or Tibet worth all those lives? Hell, this "public" revealing, and I put quotes on public as it's not like they pulled out the red carpet for the J-20, doesn't prove as much as some may think. Guys in the defense circle has already known for one, that U.S. stealth has been sold to China, for two, that China is a competent developer in Stealth techs, and for three, it's still a ways off, 4 years at best for production.
 

Asymptote

Banned Idiot
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

Just some things I'd like to add.

1. Even though I'm not sure how the DF-21D AShBM got into this, a U.S.N. CBG does have at least 2 Ticonderoga Class missile cruisers and 2 Arleigh Burke class Destroyers, HOWEVER, they do not carry a standard load of ABMs. Their VLS are modular, in that they allow multiple missiles of different classes to be carried (i.e. one Ticonderoga class can carry some Tomahawk missiles, some Harpoon missiles, some SM-2 missiles, etc). So that 260 missile number is actually the Maximum number of missiles for the DF-21 AShBM to overcome.


I was just replying to Bltizo's post because he brought up the topic of ASBM being cheaper option than using J-20 with AShM.

I agree, maybe my calculation is wrong, as I am assuming the maximum load - for every VLS launchers to be ABM SM missiles which is unrealistic scenario.



Another thing to add, is that you really don't need 260 missiles to shoot one DF-21 down. High-speed maneuvers do not make a missile easy to destroy but the thing about that DF-21D, i.e. what makes it so different, is that it's a Ballistic missile, and thus, out range many conventional AShM designs but also in that because it's Ballistic, it's trajectory allows a high-speed dive, Mach 10 I believe, or 3.4 km per second, which means that defense systems have less time to detect and destroy the Missile. The problem with the DF-21D also comes from the fact that it's a Ballistic missile. For one, high-speed sea skimmers like the Russian 3M54 Klub are had to detect by virtue of it's cruise height, some say as low as 3 meters above sea level. The DF-21D however, will end up at a relatively high altitude, which will allow almost every sensor in that CBG to detect it, and thus, engage and destroy it. Finally, the DF-21D is fast, but it's not beyond current ABM technologies. I am unsure of the maximum engage speed of the SM-3, but an inferior ABM system, the S-400 SAM from Russia, can engage missiles with speeds up to 4.8 km per second (almost Mach 14). So, the DF-21D is certainly an interesting AShM, but it won't clear the seas so to say. Now going back on topic.


I think you misunderstood me. I didn't say a single DF-21D ASBM will take the entire 260 SM missiles to destroy. What I mean is that, It requires at worst 261 DF-21D ASBMs to overcome the american CSG AAW screen (assuming 1:1 interception - 1 SM-3 to 1 DF-21D). And I have no doubt about SM's capabilities either, as I have mention, SM missiles were designed to intercept ballistic missiles of speed upward 7-8 km/s, so DF-21D is well within SM's interception capabilities.

Ofcourse, let's not forget DF-21D is a ballistic missile, it can also carry penetration aids such chaffs and decoys, so it will complicate the defenses as it will probably requires upward 3-4 SM missiles to intercept a single DF-21D effectively.

But still, I think with an inventory of mere 100 DF-21D ASBM I highly doubt it will be effective strategy to overwhelm/swarm the american CBG/CSG with DF-21D alone. It will require 10 times that to be a credible threat to a USN CBG fleet.



Uh, I'm not sure about that conjecture regarding American defense circles, but many countries outside the U.S. has studied and experimented and sometimes, produced, Stealth-based technologies and prototypes. In a way, the U.S. is prepared for "Stealth offensive weapons", as the only anti-stealth, so to say, missile out there relies on Infrared seeking (Heat Seekers) technology, the simplest way to defeat that is of course, a flare. And yes, I can confirm that the F-22 does indeed emit a rather large heat signature, despite the reductions.


Yes, experimented, and most of them allies to US, so it has never really dawn on American to change their doctrine I think to counter the stealth offensive weapons. Or else their entire strategy and physical assets will be quite different today.


Uhm, I do believe you are confused. The Current U.S. operational plans revolve around Asymmetrical warfare, that's to say, we don't plan on engaging a competent opponent like Russia or China, but rather, folks like Pre-war Iraq, crap Army, non existent navy, and propaganda-pumped airforces. In a way, again, we are prepared for Anti-stealth warfare. The simplest way to counter Stealth is again, Infrared. Recent developments in the field of QWIP (Quantum Well Infrared Photodetector) by us, Europe, and Russia, has further advanced IR sighting technologies. Hell, we already have an IR ball equipped with QWIPs, something I haven't seen from Europe or Russia yet (check FLIR's website).


If I am not mistaken, QWIPs are reportedly to have a range of 70 nm (129.64 km)
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Let's assume that the QWIP tech advances and improve, to have over 200 km effective detection range, even for LO aircrafts, how much time do you think a AShM that's launched from J-20 from a distance of 201 km will reach its target?
Just for the fun of it, let's assume P-270 Moskit (I know I know, Moskit only has a range of 120 km max, but let's assume China has an air launch variant in the future that has range over 200 km) - with a speed of 2800 km/hr, and launching from a distance of 210 km (just outside the QWIP detection range), it would reach its target in 4 minutes 30 seconds - plenty of time for USN to intercept and have a coffee break in-between. So, I guess you are right, with QWIP in the game, its will be hard for China even with J-20 to penetrate the defence, and will require a war of attrition to wear down the CBG until it literally runs out of ammos.


Measure and Countermeasure. This also gives a peak maybe, at China's plans. Unlike some warmongering folks I have read on other forums who have thought this same thought, perhaps China is not preparing for a total war with NATO. And they have perfectly fair reasons for not wanting a war. For one, nukes. For two, the economy. For three, is Taiwan or Tibet worth all those lives? Hell, this "public" revealing, and I put quotes on public as it's not like they pulled out the red carpet for the J-20, doesn't prove as much as some may think. Guys in the defense circle has already known for one, that U.S. stealth has been sold to China, for two, that China is a competent developer in Stealth techs, and for three, it's still a ways off, 4 years at best for production.

Ofcourse, I am sure neither China nor America wants to risk a war with each other. But both actively planned for "what-ifs" well before the "what-ifs" really happen.
 
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Asymptote

Banned Idiot
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

This thread, from the time I know that ppl at this forum have some non-Bull-Sh*t level of discuss on it (the next gen fighter), I have take a read of the thread throughly.

It took me more than 2 months to read ALL the posts, from #1, till so far, to even start to post my opinion.

What I saw, the anticipation (distant rumor of "BS level" of credibility that "this stff is real!") of people down here at 2006, shifts, changes, shocks... to today's (2011) overall opinion (that China built something ass-kicking!)

I saw nay-sayers, I saw racialist, I saw tech-geeks, I may even saw Intel Collectors.
I saw nay-sayers (bitterfully) change minds; I saw racialists dealt by hardworking mods; I saw tech-geeks "tought" others with his aspects while himself benificially learnt from others; I may even saw Intel Collectors "get the message", sent intentionly by those who try to "leak".

What I want to say here, is, guys, look into the issue humbly, for we all could laughably-wrong (side-tracked), for what we looking at, is a nation's (especially, "another nation"-to many of you guys) (subtle) wisdom - instead of one piece of machine.


The above, is only my EMOTIONAL EXPRESS, please don't take any side-meanings.

Just a friendly correction to your English (please don't take it the wrong way.. ) ;) No such word as racialist. Its racist.

EDIT : I just found out...actually, there is! :p LOL.
But it is uncommon to use the word "racialist". Its more common to use the word "racist".
 
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Anton Gregori

New Member
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

So you're proposing risking J-20s to "degrade" the defenses of a CVBG, with unpowered munitions (like LS-6, FT series bombs -- only those can fit into the internal weapons bay at the moment)?

Ah, are you sure about that? I'm pretty sure there's room in there for a few missiles - just not as big or as long range as one might want for actually sinking a capital ship.

Wouldn't it be easier just to directly use relatively cheap anti ship missiles instead of expensive J-20s?

Well, yes, but you need to get your cheap anti-ship missiles within range and give them targeting info.

Support infrastructure as in airbases... Not carriers and its battle group -- F-22s don't operate from carriers, as I'm sure you know.

Are there U.S. airbases within F-22 range or J-20 range? If so, then yes, they could hit airbases. But I was actually assuming F-22s would operate from Guam with tanker support to extend their range and a carrier group providing cover for the tanker. But that's just my idea - lots of scenarios are possible, the details don't affect the overall approach, as near as I can tell. And of course everything I say about the F-22 could just as well apply to F-35s. It's just cumbersome to write "F-22 and/or F-35" everywhere.

And that leads to the question on how much heavier the J-20 is to the F-22... And from pictures we can see it's no more than half a meter longer if anything.

I'm just going by other people's analysis - granted I don't really know. But in any case it's not the length itself, but rather what the length is used for. If it's just empty space then it doesn't have much affect. If it's filled with fuel then that's pretty heavy.

One of the S requriements of the "4s" for J-20 was supermanouverability, which again, doesn't necessarily mean you have to be super light nor a high T/W ratio. I think the F-22's T/W ratio is slightly lower than the F-15's, but the former is obviously considered mroe manouverable.

I don't think the Chinese designers care about the "4s" requirements. They build the best fighter they can for the mission they're given.

Can you say again what you mean by engaging the enemy "early"? Do you mean attacking the enemy's base of operations or attacking them as they take off or before they get within 500 km of the chinese coast or what?

I mean that there's a sort of bubble around a carrier where it can establish air superiority and operate at will. Basically the area within the combat range of its fighters. If a carrier gets close enough to a Chinese airbase that the airbase falls within that bubble, then the airbase is in trouble. Or at least it comes down to whoever has the most capable air-superiority fighters.

If the carrier is far enough away that neither side can reach the other, then there's no battle. You can send a few missiles, but you can't sustain enough of a barrage know the other side is out of commission.

But if the Chinese fighters have greater range, then there's a time where the Chinese can operate freely from their base - nobody can hit them - yet the carrier is in range. That's the time when the J-20 having greater range is a strategic advantage. Let them get too close and then your greater range doesn't really help (except that you can loiter for longer, as you mentioned).

As I said earlier, the fact that the F-22 doesn't actually fly off a carrier doesn't matter so much - the carrier group can provide cover for tankers, thus extending the effective range of the F-22. And of course they can launch their own F-35s.
 
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Asymptote

Banned Idiot
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

Let's assume that the QWIP tech advances and improve, to have over 200 km effective detection range, even for LO aircrafts, how much time do you think a AShM that's launched from J-20 from a distance of 201 km will reach its target?

Just for the fun of it, let's assume P-270 Moskit (I know I know, Moskit only has a range of 120 km max, but let's assume China has an air launch variant in the future that has range over 200 km) - with a speed of 2800 km/hr, and launching from a distance of 210 km (just outside the QWIP detection range), it would reach its target in 4 minutes 30 seconds - plenty of time for USN to intercept and have a coffee break in-between. So, I guess you are right, with QWIP in the game, its will be hard for China even with J-20 to penetrate the defence, and will require a war of attrition to wear down the CBG until it literally runs out of ammos.


Actually, this is interesting kind of thought experiment. If a Moskit with a maximum speed of 2800 km/hr can't penetrate the USN AAW screen at a distance of 200 km (as it will require 4 minutes 30 seconds to reach its target), the logical conclusion would be to launch the ASBM from J-20 (I know this sounds outrageous, but bear with me).

For the DF-21D with a maximum speed of Mach 10 (12,300 km/hr), launching from the distance of 200 km, it will reach its target in 58 seconds. Still plenty of time for USN's to intercept. Currently, only the NASA X-43 can reach this speed. So it is not far fetch to think in the future China might have this tech.

The problem is that even flying at Mach 10, it is not enough to penetrate the USN air defence screen. So basically J-20 has to be twice stealthier so it can get into a range of 100 km undetected, and the hypersonic AShM has to be twice faster too, flying at Mach 20 (24600 km/hr) so it reaches the target in 14.6 seconds from 100 km range, which is probably not enough time for Aegis Combat System to react and launch the SM-3 to counter effectively.
 
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Asymptote

Banned Idiot
Re: J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

I mean that there's a sort of bubble around a carrier where it can establish air superiority and operate at will. Basically the area within the combat range of its fighters. If a carrier gets close enough to a Chinese airbase that the airbase falls within that bubble, then the airbase is in trouble. Or at least it comes down to whoever has the most capable air-superiority fighters.

This is what I am curious about. I know its a bit off-topic, but isn't it down to which side has the most missile to hit the other side? Since China is a HUGE LAND MASS and DF-21D is TEL based so it can be dispersed ANYWHERE and almost impossible to find. Its really down to how many DF-21D China can produce. So let's say China go panicky with encroaching USN CBGs (let's say an unprecedented 5 CBG groups), that would be around 1300 (260 x 5) SM-3 missiles capable of intercepting the DF-21D ASBM. But ofcourse, a CBG can only bring limited munition onboard, so for a Chinese air base it would require 1500 DF-21D to defend 5 CGS groups. (I am assuming each CSG requires 40 DF-21D to sink every single ships in the group after ALL of their SM missiles are spent to defend itself eg. the 1300 DF-21D used on exhausting the CSG SM-3 munition onboard - note, I am also assuming the best case scenario of 1:1 interception ratio for the SM-3)

Of course, this is all hypothetical, assuming QWIP stealth detection is on every USN CBGs, it would nullify J-20's advantage as a "bomb truck" to deliver any sort of payload to sink CBG as my previous post demonstrated. J-20 would need to be 2x stealthier and equipped with hypersonic AShM twice faster than DF-21D to be able to successfully penetrate the USN AAW screen.
 
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