Miscellaneous News

windsclouds2030

Senior Member
Registered Member
Why wasn’t India an option for technological leadership?
India may lead in narrower field of "technology" such as managerial tech (they have several CEOs in the Five-Eyes countries), PR tech (they're excellent in talking skills), cow utilization tech, VR soft tech (they are great in making alternate realities), and perhaps few others... but hardly in any hard technology!
 

Petrolicious88

Senior Member
Registered Member
Again French operators within the Plant is warning of imminent Radiological Threat. Whatever that means.

Why did the French first notify the US, which held National Security Council meetings over it.

And why are the French co-operating a nuclear power plant in China
 

voyager1

Captain
Registered Member
Thanks for the link.

Btw, since the load in this thread is very high, it's really not easy to keep track among the so many posts... :p :D

So a request as well as a suggestion, perhaps next time it's better to repost or requote briefly the said previous article link/info if it's not too hard the task, so later or latecomer reader may still keep track what's the previous item meant :) ha ha ha

This suggestion applies to all posters whereas relevant... merely due to the sheer volume of the posts here :) LMAO
Yep you are right

Here is the link of TheDiplomat's previous clown article:
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And here is my post dismantling it piece by piece:
 

crash8pilot

Junior Member
Registered Member

windsclouds2030

Senior Member
Registered Member
Again French operators within the Plant is warning of imminent Radiological Threat. Whatever that means.

Why did the French first notify the US, which held National Security Council meetings over it.

And why are the French co-operating a nuclear power plant in China
If you read back in less than 10 pages you'll spot the answers to your questions... I read there but can't memorize exactly but understand several posters have posted the related info in separate, spread over posts.
 

windsclouds2030

Senior Member
Registered Member
Phryne Astynome @PAstynome

Hey @pretentiouswhat, do you have any comments on this story from CNN?
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By David Fishman @pretentiouswhat - 14 June 2021

A few thoughts:

1) Taishan is a Chinese plant built with French technology with a large French equity stake and Framatome is a French MNC offering technical services everywhere around the world (including the USA).

2) Taishan is owned by CGN (China General Nuclear Power Group), which is on the US Entity List. Thus it would normally be forbidden to transfer US-derived technical information or data to CGN. A waiver may be obtained, however, for reasons of "operational safety", which is what Framatome is applying for.

3) They're likely applying because either A. the information they are preparing to transfer originated in the US, or B. they don't want to impact their business in the US by doing work with CGN without full transparency. Probably both actually.

4) So doesn't sound like Framatome reached out for *help* per se. Rather, they reached out for approval to conduct work to fix/mitigate the problem.

If there's no safety threat, as this paragraph starts, then the rest is just silly, superfluous, and alarmist:
unknown excerpt.png

5) IMO, the technocratically-inclined nuclear specialists in the US DOE and NRC (Nuclear Regulatory Commission) are way unlikely to take concern troll political cheap shots (unlike, e.g. the State Dept).

If they say that it's not an issue, then CNN et al. are left scrambling for innuendo to gin up concern...

6) As for why ambient dose around the plant is exceeding the approved levels, that could be due to any number of things. One or several cracked fuel rods in the core might do it. Cracked fuel rods are pretty common, usually due to manufacturing defects.

7) You wouldn't normally shut down a reactor and refuel for cracked fuel rods though. You keep operating, and do a bunch of physics calculations to restribute power in the core, and also redo environmental dose calculations. This work is *possibly* what Framatome is applying for.

8) The article doesn't cite any figures for the original allowable dose level or the doubled dose level. So it's pretty hard to tell if its anything to be concerned about. These allowable limits are usually set super low by several orders of magnitude, though.

9) To illustrate that point: Compare normal plant worker dose per annum versus the dose level likely to cause an increase in cancer risk:

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Update: AFP has a quote from EDF (Électricité de France S.A.) (the 30% owner of the plant) saying there is an issue with noble gas buildup, which supports the theory of failed (cracked) fuel rods IMO.

Detection of radiation from Xe-133 or Xe-135 is one of the main methods for detecting this.

FYI about fuel failure for the curious.

Yep, it's a undesirable but fairly common phenomenon. It's also called "fuel failure".

Here's an older, but very authoritative summary if you're feeling nerdy:

Fuel failure in water reactors: Causes and mitigation
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Strangelove

Colonel
Registered Member
60% of Western Australia's economy depends on China trade...

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West Australian Premier Mark McGowan wishes the federal government would stop its combative rhetoric with China, which he says goes against the interests of the nation.

Mr McGowan met on Wednesday afternoon with Prime Minister Scott Morrison during the latter’s visit to Perth, where the Premier made it clear he had a different view as to how Australia should approach its relationship with the Asian superpower.

Prime Minister Scott Morrison and WA Premier Mark McGowan are not seeing eye to eye when it comes to the Australia-China relationship.

Prime Minister Scott Morrison and WA Premier Mark McGowan are not seeing eye to eye when it comes to the Australia-China relationship.Credit:WAtoday

Mr Morrison was in the city to give a foreign policy speech on getting agreement from liberal democracies to toughen institutions such as the World Trade Organisation before flying to the United Kingdom for a ‘G7 plus’ summit.

The Premier has long been a vocal critic of the federal government’s recent approach with China which has seen the trading relationship between the two deteriorate – with restrictions on barley, rock lobster, and other products – since calls by Australia for a probe into the origins of COVID-19.

An exasperated Mr McGowan did not pull any punches on Thursday, following his meeting with Mr Morrison, when he said he had a “very different” view on the relationship between the two nations.

“We are acting against our own interests,” he said.
“The Prime Minister has a view he needs to attack [China] on trade.

“I’m more pragmatic, I’m more attuned to the interests of Western Australia and West Australian jobs.
“I have a view that they are our biggest customer; we sell them literally 20 times as much as we buy from them, why do we want to undermine that?

“I have been very clear with the Commonwealth. I’m a Premier of the state that actually carries the nation’s economy.”
Mr McGowan said recent language from politicians and other senior government officials talking about potential wars with China was “insane”.

“It is absolutely off the planet and I don’t get it and I wish they would stop because it is not in our national interest in any way shape or form,” he said.

“WA continues to trade through COVID with countries who buy our products, particularly when iron ore is over $200 a tonne, that’s what’s supporting the national economy and yet we have politicians who want to destroy that.

“All I’d say to the Commonwealth government is they need to rethink this language. If we lose our trading relationship with China, the economic consequences for Australia will be absolutely catastrophic.”

Mr Morrison told Radio 6PR’s Mornings program in Perth on Thursday morning that trade issues had to be called out.
“I spoke with the Premier yesterday ... we often meet when I’m in town and we had a good chat about these issues yesterday. I mean, barley producers in Australia, wine growers in Australia, have been targeted with trade sanctions that we believe are completely unconscionable,” he said.

“And we are seeking to take those up in the World Trade Organisation to see them resolved there.
“You’ve got to call trade issues out if you believe in an open trading system. If you don’t have an open trading system backed by an international rule of law, well, it’s very hard to be a trading country in this world.”

Related Article​

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Mr Morrison said Australia could never trade away its values or its sovereign integrity.
But Mr McGowan said tempering language was not a trading off of values.
“We will continue to be a democracy, we will continue to be a free independent country that believes in equality and fairness and decency,” he said.
 

Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
Registered Member
Can we put an end to the 'monkey' and other dehumanising comments? It will only encourage the 'othering' of the Indians, Americans and West. While their predecessors treated Chinese etc. races like that in the past (and some still are today) doesn't mean we have to go along with the exhausting nonsense. They are still people one way or another. Indoctrinated or otherwise. People here are usually highly educated so presumably we can overcome this.
Am guilty as charge on using the word monkeys to describe western or American "behaviors" not describing their features as monkey like or even ape like, so that hardly counts as dehumanizing them in a manner or fashion that's been applied and used against Asians, Africans etc. This high road mantra you advocate for while commendable and even laudable isn't something I am going to follow because this take the high road b.s. has never shown to work at any time anywhere in the west regardless of how many times they (the west) say sorry while they're busy trying to kill us figuratively and literally.

I will only stop the word monkey when the context or topic of discussion must preclude the word from being used.

Also, last time I checked, none of us here at least based on my cursory readings of this forum has ever advocated of bombing or killing of America or Americans or any western countries for that matter. But try to go on any other forums or reddit, Twitter, Facebook, etc. Gaming platforms (consoles, P.C.) where call for violence/bombing/ sanctions etc.. against China isn't even mentioned casually like our lives don't mean jack s..t. So spare me the moral indignancy. Am sorry but we'll have to agree to disagree respectfully speaking.
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
Phryne Astynome @PAstynome

Hey @pretentiouswhat, do you have any comments on this story from CNN?
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


By David Fishman @pretentiouswhat - 14 June 2021

A few thoughts:

1) Taishan is a Chinese plant built with French technology with a large French equity stake and Framatome is a French MNC offering technical services everywhere around the world (including the USA).

2) Taishan is owned by CGN (China General Nuclear Power Group), which is on the US Entity List. Thus it would normally be forbidden to transfer US-derived technical information or data to CGN. A waiver may be obtained, however, for reasons of "operational safety", which is what Framatome is applying for.

3) They're likely applying because either A. the information they are preparing to transfer originated in the US, or B. they don't want to impact their business in the US by doing work with CGN without full transparency. Probably both actually.

4) So doesn't sound like Framatome reached out for *help* per se. Rather, they reached out for approval to conduct work to fix/mitigate the problem.

If there's no safety threat, as this paragraph starts, then the rest is just silly, superfluous, and alarmist:
View attachment 73388

5) IMO, the technocratically-inclined nuclear specialists in the US DOE and NRC (Nuclear Regulatory Commission) are way unlikely to take concern troll political cheap shots (unlike, e.g. the State Dept).

If they say that it's not an issue, then CNN et al. are left scrambling for innuendo to gin up concern...

6) As for why ambient dose around the plant is exceeding the approved levels, that could be due to any number of things. One or several cracked fuel rods in the core might do it. Cracked fuel rods are pretty common, usually due to manufacturing defects.

7) You wouldn't normally shut down a reactor and refuel for cracked fuel rods though. You keep operating, and do a bunch of physics calculations to restribute power in the core, and also redo environmental dose calculations. This work is *possibly* what Framatome is applying for.

8) The article doesn't cite any figures for the original allowable dose level or the doubled dose level. So it's pretty hard to tell if its anything to be concerned about. These allowable limits are usually set super low by several orders of magnitude, though.

9) To illustrate that point: Compare normal plant worker dose per annum versus the dose level likely to cause an increase in cancer risk:

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


Update: AFP has a quote from EDF (Électricité de France S.A.) (the 30% owner of the plant) saying there is an issue with noble gas buildup, which supports the theory of failed (cracked) fuel rods IMO.

Detection of radiation from Xe-133 or Xe-135 is one of the main methods for detecting this.

FYI about fuel failure for the curious.

Yep, it's a undesirable but fairly common phenomenon. It's also called "fuel failure".

Here's an older, but very authoritative summary if you're feeling nerdy:

Fuel failure in water reactors: Causes and mitigation
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

So the headline should read?

Framatone of France supplied cracked fuel rods to a French-designed nuclear power plant in China
US sanctions stopping Framatone from fixing the resulting radioactive gas leak
 
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