Littoral Combat Ships (LCS)


dtulsa

Junior Member
well all this is connected to the CONOPS of the USN LCSs, which is unclear to me (and I probably read most of the available articles about LCSs LOL), and I would've hoped it had been clear to the USN itself ... specifically I could imagine the Independence subclass ships being tasked with ASuW (the internal space is huge, did you notice their beam is large as of many battleships :) ?) but with this proposal Yesterday at 9:21 PM ... OK I won't repeat myself
What I find interesting is the very same arguments claims etc. Have been used since these ships have been in service or even in the drawing boards indeed it's the very topic I joined SDF in the first place you would tend to think the navy would be having the very same arguments behind closed doors and absolutely I would say in order to get VLS in the LCS I would sacrifice some space for the helicopter I read the concept to say it has room for a H60 plus a MQ8 drone that,would absolutely be fine with most frigates and destroyers does the Burke' s have that much help. room
 

dtulsa

Junior Member
Just reported in Naval today the Saudis have agreed to purchase 4 of the Freedom class with VLS ESSM (532) harpoon launchers combats 21 system and related hardware etc. I thought they had backed out of this deal a while ago
 

dtulsa

Junior Member
A question A lot has been made of the navy down select to one type of ship for the frigate my question is the losing shipyard stating they would have to close but why could they not just build some of the frigates too from what I've read they could number up to 24 ships that could keep both yards operating for some time mind you it's just a question
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Intellectual property and contract rights. Realistically though I doubt either would close. Austal has other USN contracts in the form of the Spearhead class and Lockheed Martin has export sales. It would however mean termination of that particular line.
 

dtulsa

Junior Member
Intellectual property and contract rights. Realistically though I doubt either would close. Austal has other USN contracts in the form of the Spearhead class and Lockheed Martin has export sales. It would however mean termination of that particular line.
It would also seem the repair work could keep them busy also along with The supposed modifications and such just speculating of course
 
Just reported in Naval today the Saudis have agreed to purchase 4 of the Freedom class with VLS ESSM (532) harpoon launchers combats 21 system and related hardware etc. I thought they had backed out of this deal a while ago
now this is just to post the original article for dtulsa who's told me is experiencing difficulties when linking (?)
Saudi Arabia buying Lockheed’s LCS under $6 billion deal: report
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Saudi Arabia and Lockheed Martin have reached a $6 billion deal for the acquisition of four littoral combat ships, according to a
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
report.


The report said that the signed letter of agreement included a better-armed version of the Freedom-variant LCS Lockheed Martin’s industry team is building for the U.S. Navy.

The export variant of the U.S. Navy LCS is referred to as the Multi-Mission Surface Combatant (MMSC) by Lockheed Martin.

An official announcement on the agreement or any confirmation of it could be expected to come as early as Saturday, Bloomberg wrote citing persons familiar with the deal.

The acquisition of littoral combat ships is part of the Saudi Arabian government’s naval modernization program and the sale of the four ships had already been approved by the US State Department in 2015.

The approved possible arms sale to the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia included four MMSC ships that would include COMBATSS-21 combat management systems with five TRS-4D radars. Also included were eight MK-41 Vertical Launch Systems (VLS) (two eight-cell assemblies per ship for 16 cells per hull) and 532 tactical RIM-162 Evolved Sea Sparrow Missiles (ESSM).

Saudi Arabia also requested a possible sale of Harpoon launchers, MK-15 Mod 31 SeaRAM CIWS and MK-75 76mm OTO Melara Gun Systems.
 

dtulsa

Junior Member
now this is just to post the original article for dtulsa who's told me is experiencing difficulties when linking (?)
Saudi Arabia buying Lockheed’s LCS under $6 billion deal: report
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
I
now this is just to post the original article for dtulsa who's told me is experiencing difficulties when linking (?)
Saudi Arabia buying Lockheed’s LCS under $6 billion deal: report
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
I still say there is a good chance we end up with something along these lines which would not be all that bad the Saudis foot the design cost we build and just keep building till we get enough of them to meet our requirement also,sounds like a total win win for all involved to me
 
the original is
Saudis to Make $6 Billion Deal for Lockheed's Littoral Ships
  • Pentagon says $110 billion in arms purchases are in the works
  • General Dynamics tanks also said to be part of arms package
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

The U.S. has reached a $6 billion deal for Saudi Arabia to buy four Littoral Combat Ships made by
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
in a package of major arms purchases as President Donald Trump travels to the kingdom, people familiar with the transaction said.

The U.S. and the Saudi Ministry of Defense “designed and negotiated a package totaling approximate $110 billion,” Vice Admiral Joe Rixey, head of the Pentagon’s Defense Security Cooperation Agency, said Friday on a conference call with analysts from Saudi Arabia, according to a White House transcript. “When completed, it will be the largest single arms deal in American history.”

While the package includes deals that were begun under President Barack Obama’s administration -- and initial steps toward others that may take years to complete -- the final letter of agreement on the Littoral Combat Ships is the highest-profile element.

It includes a better-armed version of the ships, support equipment, munitions and electronic-warfare systems, according to the people, who asked not to be identified in advance of an announcement that may come as early as Saturday morning Washington time. That’s when Trump is scheduled to arrive in Riyadh on the first leg of an eight-day trip that will take him across the Middle East and to Europe.

The Trump administration is promising to improve relations with the Saudis that were strained under Obama. For its part, Saudi Arabia has pledged to buy billions of dollars of U.S. military equipment in the next decade and invest about $40 billion from its sovereign wealth fund in American companies.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


The littoral ships, designed for shallow coastal waters, are part of a package of agreements on weapons sales that already had been approved in late 2015 by the U.S. State Department, which oversees the Foreign Military Sales program. Congress also approved the sale, but it wasn’t completed under Obama. From 2009 to 2016, the Obama administration approved $115 billion in potential sales to the Saudis.

Lockheed rose 1.7 percent to $271.84 at 12:53 p.m. in New York, after rising 7 percent this year through Thursday.

Saudi Embassy spokesman Nail Al-Jubeir didn’t return an email and phone call seeking comment. Lockheed spokesman John Torrisi said in an email that “Foreign Military Sales are government-to-government decisions, and the status of any potential discussions can be best addressed by the U.S. Government.”

M1A2 Tanks
The announcements will include a letter of agreement completing a sale approved in August 2016 for about 115 M1A2 tanks made by
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
, as well as munitions, and heavy equipment recovery systems, according to two of the people. A formal agreement is expected for Lockheed to sell more Pac-3 Patriot hit-to-kill missiles, which already have been approved by Congress.

In addition, announcements are expected on intentions to proceed with a number of deals. They include an almost $18 billion program to upgrade Saudi Arabia’s military command-and-control structure and the sale of about 60 UH-60 helicopters from Lockheed for about $5 billion, according to one of the people.

Also anticipated is an announcement of the Saudi intention to buy Lockheed’s Thaad anti-missile system, which intercepts incoming missiles at higher altitudes than the Patriot. Thaad already has been sold to the United Arab Emirates, the first international customer, and its deployment by the U.S. to South Korea has created tension with China.

The contracts for all the transactions in the package will be managed by the U.S. government with the companies, which is standard under Foreign Military Sales contracts.

The modified Littoral Combat Ships, known as “
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
” would be the first international sale of the vessel, which includes munitions such as
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
’s Evolved Sea Sparrow air defense missile.

The Saudi-bound ships are better-armed -- and thus more expensive -- versions of the Littoral Combat Ship, which has drawn withering criticism from some lawmakers and Pentagon testing officials in recent years over its reliability and its capacity to survive in combat.

Missile Defense
“I have seen most of the same details, and they make sense,” John Cappello, a senior fellow for Middle East issues and missile defense issues, with the Foundation for Defense of Democracies, said of the planned deals in an email. “Missile defense is a Saudi priority, and we have been trying to get them to improve capability, especially naval capability, for some time,” he said.

Until recently, the Saudis were prepared to sign a letter of agreement for two vessels, but that’s been increased to four, said a U.S. official. The Saudi government will also announce its intention to buy four additional vessels later, one of the persons said.

Lockheed says on its website that the modified version includes over-the-horizon missiles, remotely fired 20mm guns, the capability to fire Sea Sparrow anti-aircraft missiles and a new torpedo defense system.

Parts of the package may draw congressional criticism. A resolution to block the tank sale was introduced in September by several U.S. senators, including Republican Rand Paul of Kentucky and Democrat Chris Murphy of Connecticut. They cited allegations that Saudi aircraft were killing civilians in Yemen with U.S.-supplied munitions in attacks on Iranian-backed Houthi rebels. That resolution was defeated in September 2016 on a 71-27 vote.

Acknowledging concern about “Saudi Arabia’s track record in Yemen,” Mike Miller, the State Department’s director of regional security and arms transfers, said on the conference call that “this package includes a large training case for the Saudi Royal Air Force, which includes training on the Law of Armed Conflict, as well as on methods to minimize the risk of civilian casualties.”
 
Last edited:

Jeff Head

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
after the criticism
Apr 11, 2017

Armaments include the SeaRAM system, Mk110 57mm gun, six .50cal machine guns, Nulka decoys, two 25/30mm cannon, Hellfire AGM-114 missiles, torpedo countermeasures, two Mk41 launchers and 16 over-the-horizon missiles for an anti-surface capability.
:
If they DO that for the uparmed LCS Frigate...then we will be getting what they should have done in the first place.

My guess is that they would have 8 x LRASM for anti-surface in the VLS, and eight quad packed ESSM AAW missiles for 32.

With SeaRAM and 32 ESSMs it could provide Frigate sized coverage to other vessels. And with the VDS and two anti-sub helos, it could perform ASW as well. The multi-mission frigate we have waited for.

...and Lockheed can do exactly the same thing to the Freedom class.


...and they need to do it in such a fashion so that most of it can be retrofitted back to these initial designs during a regular large maintenance overhaul.
 

dtulsa

Junior Member
If they DO that for the uparmed LCS Frigate...then we will be getting what they should have done in the first place.

My guess is that they would have 8 x LRASM for anti-surface in the VLS, and eight quad packed ESSM AAW missiles for 32.

With SeaRAM and 32 ESSMs it could provide Frigate sized coverage to other vessels. And with the VDS and two anti-sub helos, it could perform ASW as well. The multi-mission frigate we have waited for.

...and Lockheed can do exactly the same thing to the Freedom class.


...and they need to do it in such a fashion so that most of it can be retrofitted back to these initial designs during a regular large maintenance overhaul.
It's got my vote also of course anything that upgrades the current offensive and defensive systems I would welcome as would most on this forum
 

Top