JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

[duncanidaho]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

A question to the forum. Is it possible for the JF-17 with an improved WS-13, to have supercruise capability like JAS-39 Gripen?

 

[tphuang]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

A question to the forum. Is it possible for the JF-17 with an improved WS-13, to have supercruise capability like JAS-39 Gripen?

I really doubt it. It not only needs a more powerful engine, but also a redesign of the airframe.

btw, this is from an interview by kanwa with PAF:
- JF-17 has fired off C-802A and hit a target more than 90 kms away (it has range of 180+ km)
- It launches two types of LS-6 SGBs. The 500 kg one has a range of 60 km with cep of 15 m. The 250 kg one has a range of 65 km with cep of 5.3 to 7.5 m
- The main medium range aam is SD-10A
- KLJ-7 has a range of 130 km vs fighter size target, can track 16 targets and engage 2 concurrently. These seem to be higher than the ones we see in air shows. Will have to see which modes these range and tracking numbers come from.
- block 1 of JF-17 did not have data link, which is really surprising for me
- all of the JF-17s are using Martin Baker seats

 

[asif iqbal]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

I really doubt it. It not only needs a more powerful engine, but also a redesign of the airframe.

btw, this is from an interview by kanwa with PAF:
- JF-17 has fired off C-802A and hit a target more than 90 kms away (it has range of 180+ km)
- It launches two types of LS-6 SGBs. The 500 kg one has a range of 60 km with cep of 15 m. The 250 kg one has a range of 65 km with cep of 5.3 to 7.5 m
- The main medium range aam is SD-10A
- KLJ-7 has a range of 130 km vs fighter size target, can track 16 targets and engage 2 concurrently. These seem to be higher than the ones we see in air shows. Will have to see which modes these range and tracking numbers come from.
- block 1 of JF-17 did not have data link, which is really surprising for me
- all of the JF-17s are using Martin Baker seats

datalink and ejection seats is very old news, JF17 has no datalink that is for block 2 always has been as well as mid-air refueling

LS-6 precision weapons was presented at Farnborough airshow and PAF pilots talked on length about them as well as the KLJ-7 radar and self protection and jamming pods

however what is news if true is the firing of C802A, we have been waiting for this, range 90km, that is disapppointing but i guess with more launches we can see some long range targets getting hit

 

[Chaminuka]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

KLJ-7 has a range of 130 km vs fighter size target,

Thank tphuang. Just to credit where it is due and appreciate a mind that can sift through chuff here is what one, Feng, here

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said in Sept 2007

So it's quite possible that the exported radar for JF-17 is better than the 75 km vs 3m^2, but less than the 130 km that it should be if using the same family of radar as J-10 (the 149x series)

 

[duncanidaho]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

I really doubt it. It not only needs a more powerful engine, but also a redesign of the airframe.

Why? Doesn't supercruise mean to fly more than mach 1.xx without afterburner? The JF-17 has a max-speed of 1.6 mach, if it can reach this speed with AB, its airframe should be able to withstand this speed, or? Do I misinterpret something?

 

[Blitzo]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Thank tphuang. Just to credit where it is due and appreciate a mind that can sift through chuff here is what one, Fen, here

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said in Sept 2007

Lol feng and tphuang are the same person...

 

[Chaminuka]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Lol feng and tphuang are the same person...

I know ... ... I was just reminding him that he came to the 130km figure over 4 years ago!

 

[plawolf]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Why? Doesn't supercruise mean to fly more than mach 1.xx without afterburner? The JF-17 has a max-speed of 1.6 mach, if it can reach this speed with AB, its airframe should be able to withstand this speed, or? Do I misinterpret something?

Afterburners can add around 50-75% more thrust than max dry thrust. You are just not going to be able to achieve anywhere close to that kind of dry thrust improvement with a new 5th gen engine without move up to a different engine class.

Unless you can achieve that kind of brute power increase, you can only achieve supercruise if the airframe was also designed to optimize drag for supersonic flight.

In addition, having supercruise potential really isn't all that useful unless you have internal, or at the very least, recessed weapons storage. Otherwise, even if you can supercruise clean, as soon as you strap a useful warload on the plane, it isn't going to be supercruising any more.

For a small fighter like the JF17, it really isn't practical to try to make it supercruise.

 

[duncanidaho]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Oh I understand, thank you for the information.

 

[Indianfighter]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

F22 and F35 are single seat only.

A twin seater is only essential when you are training pilots who are just learning to fly.

Established fighter types tend to have twin seat trainers to help speed up induction, and also because at that point, you will have pilots joining squadrons/regiments fresh from basic flight school, so they would benefit from a little more hands-on teaching.

However, when you are inducting a brand new airframe into an air force for the first time, the pilots first to train on the type will tend to be some of the most experienced and capable pilots that air force has. And pilots of such caliber can be trusted to safely fly a new plane with the right pre-flight ground based familiarization and training without needing a babysitter.

I don't quite agree. F-22 and F-35 seem to be modern exceptions against the norm. The JF-17 is supposed to be a frontline fighter of the PAF that is fast retiring its old J7s and Mirages. Most of its pilots (including fresh ones passing out every year) will fly it. A trainer ought to have been readied along with its induction.

Was pilot error the reason of the JF-17 crash ?