J-20... The New Generation Fighter

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Maggern

Junior Member
Re: New Generation Fighter

Indeed, and relying on other countries' sales means you are dependent on their will to share military technology. In most cases, this will mean you will never have cutting edge technology, while China pretty much decides this itself. And of course you are more vulnerable if the s*** hits the fan.
 

lilzz

Banned Idiot
Re: New Generation Fighter

Relying on foreign purchase means you won't have enough big quantity due to cost factor. I doubt India can afford to purchase 200 SU-30MKI while China can produce 200 J-11B if it wants to.

Also,you control your production, it can affect geopolitics, like China ready to supply its own J-10s in large number for Pak.
 

Lion

Senior Member
Re: New Generation Fighter

Unlike china, india can import almost whatever conventional military equipment it wants, western or russian. Theres not much of an incentive to develop independent domestic industries.

I don't think so. India is in fact quite keen to have a strong military defence production and development like China. Bad management is the root of the problem for preventing from achieving this target.

Even US military development is equally horrible, cost overrun. lavish spending and selfish individual gain cripple many problem potential project and cost future US project to be skyhigh price tag.
 

Engineer

Major
Re: New Generation Fighter

The only exception would be India, which is also in the middle of an economic development. However, if India decides to pump money into defense and ignore the much needed development in their infrastructure, they can't go too far either.
Isn't India pumping money into defense and ignore much needed development of their infrastructure right now?

India, however, is growing. Plus its geopolitical position, India has a bright future.
lol...
An unchecked population growth means India is having an ever growing illiterate population, an ever growing social injustice problem, an ever increasing wealth-poverty gap, and an ever growing environmental problem. Far from a bright future, the unchecked population growth is a time-bomb waiting to detonate.

The problem is that India is not moving fast enough.
The problem with India is that it has problems in every single area.

Look at it this way, people are paranoid about China because it is a giant with huge power.
I would say that people are paranoid about China because China is a truly free country, which is characterized by its independent politics and strategic objectives. This means that China is not a subordinate of anyone. The only other two countries that hold this same status are Russia and the US. Those who want to oppress others would naturally see China's freedom being a bad thing.

Not to mention, CHina has surrounded by advanced economies like Japan, SK, Taiwan, Singapore in its immedaite neighborhood while surrounding India are all poor countries. It will have an effect even thought it's a globalization world nowadays.
I think India affects its neighbors more than the neighbors affects it.
 

Quickie

Colonel
Re: New Generation Fighter

Which is probably why many believe that India can't catch China. I think the fact that China can't get help from most of the Western nations is a good fortune in disguise. It forces China to be innovative and be independent. In the end, China will have a well-developed defense industry.

Having access to advanced technology shouldn't stop a nation from being innovative and doing further development to the technology. This is exactly what's happening among a number of western nations who learn from each other, and at the same time make further efforts in new development by themselves. (Otoh, unfortunately, China do not have the same kind of access with other nations.)

Funding becomes less of a problem when you can find customers for your products in some countries who seem content with only importing them, thereby spreading out your development cost and even make a profit. This was certainly true for Russia, who at one time had China as their biggest customer. Russia would want this trade to continue indefinitely, but it seems China has better ideas.
 
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pla101prc

Senior Member
Re: New Generation Fighter

Unlike china, india can import almost whatever conventional military equipment it wants, western or russian. Theres not much of an incentive to develop independent domestic industries.

there is in fact a LOT of incentive for india to develop its domestic industries, they are actually paying the price for not doing it right now. part of the issue is infrastructure, i guess another problem is that india's socialist policies isnt doing them a favour.
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Re: New Generation Fighter

I love how one can spin anything. The pro-Raptor crowd said the US needed more in order to deal with new threats (i.e. China) on the horizon. So unless you get Raptors, it doesn't really matter how much access you have to others' advanced technology. Plus US Defence industries don't give out free weapons for altruistic purposes. There's a reason why the US is the most profitable international arms dealer in the world. If the roles were reversed, you know no one would be saying the great advantage China has being dependent on other countries for technology.
 

challenge

Banned Idiot
Re: New Generation Fighter

  平可夫指出,目前第五代战机所需要的15000公斤级加力推力、采用矢量推进技术的发动机,即使是俄罗斯也只是刚刚投入试飞,中国连第四代的「太行」 发动机都尚未真正装备在部队,中国第五个j10a战机飞行团仍然使用俄式al31fn发动机,可以看出中国的航空发动机工业距离世界的差距还有相当的距 离。


  他又说,第五代战机所需要的有源相控阵雷达系统,目前也只有美国、日本投入量产,欧洲、俄罗斯的同类系统尚在最后的研制阶段,其中r/t的部件组装需要大量的投入和经验。


  平可夫认为,中国目前没有能力生产战机使用的有源相控阵雷达,即使是无源相控阵雷达,中国现在也无法生产。


  他又说,根据中国近期在国际上公开的机械扫瞄雷达的性能和外观来判断,其模组化、数位化的程度甚至远远低於欧洲的同类雷达;即使是巴基斯坦空军装备的jf17战机也在寻求西欧雷达、巴基斯坦希望进口的歼10战机,也不会装备中国制造的雷达。


  至於隐性复合材料技术,必须体现低可探测性的功能,目前真正具备生产第五代复合隐形材料的国家只有美国。


  平可夫又说,依照目前中国航空工业实力和过去的发展经验,估计中国即使自己研制第五代战机,首飞时间至少在10年后,完成部队装备的时间最乐观也在 15年以后。目前估计中俄两国正在洽谈有关四代战机(俄称第五代战机)发动机的合作和交易,金额规模和合作方式,汉和还未获得相关信息。
 

Hyperwarp

Captain
Re: New Generation Fighter

  平可夫指出,目前第五代战机所需要的15000公斤级加力推力、采用矢量推进技术的发动机,即使是俄罗斯也只是刚刚投入试飞,中国连第四代的「太行」 发动机都尚未真正装备在部队,中国第五个j10a战机飞行团仍然使用俄式al31fn发动机,可以看出中国的航空发动机工业距离世界的差距还有相当的距 离。


  他又说,第五代战机所需要的有源相控阵雷达系统,目前也只有美国、日本投入量产,欧洲、俄罗斯的同类系统尚在最后的研制阶段,其中r/t的部件组装需要大量的投入和经验。


  平可夫认为,中国目前没有能力生产战机使用的有源相控阵雷达,即使是无源相控阵雷达,中国现在也无法生产。


  他又说,根据中国近期在国际上公开的机械扫瞄雷达的性能和外观来判断,其模组化、数位化的程度甚至远远低於欧洲的同类雷达;即使是巴基斯坦空军装备的jf17战机也在寻求西欧雷达、巴基斯坦希望进口的歼10战机,也不会装备中国制造的雷达。


  至於隐性复合材料技术,必须体现低可探测性的功能,目前真正具备生产第五代复合隐形材料的国家只有美国。


  平可夫又说,依照目前中国航空工业实力和过去的发展经验,估计中国即使自己研制第五代战机,首飞时间至少在10年后,完成部队装备的时间最乐观也在 15年以后。目前估计中俄两国正在洽谈有关四代战机(俄称第五代战机)发动机的合作和交易,金额规模和合作方式,汉和还未获得相关信息。

A summery for us non-Chinese speakers would be nice
 
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