Hong-Kong Protests

manqiangrexue

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
SinoSoldier said:
I've noticed a pattern of thought among a select few members who seem to be constantly posting pro-regime opinions on this thread:
- Constantly posting cherry-picked videos of rioters engaging in delinquent behavior
- Premising that most of HK's protesters operate in the same fashion as those rioters
- Claiming that HK protests were caused by "foreign powers"
- Assuming that HK police could do no wrong and that the CCP is always justified in whatever bill it passes
- Assuming that the "real" underlying impetus for these riots is an imagined hatred of mainlanders on behalf of HK folks
- Branding anyone who chooses other than to kiss Xi Jinping's feet as "traitors" or "criminals"
Click to expand...
And it's gonna get more and more in that direction as the riots continue. You don't know how much hatred and patriotism they are building in Mainland China. People who used to complain that the CCP censors too much are now complaining that these cockroaches are allowed to commit criminal activity in broad daylight when they should be killed. People are putting National Day banners and Chinese flags on our WeChat profile pics to show our patriotism because of them. People are rejecting foreign goods for Chinese goods because of them (and the trade war). Chinese people who thought, "Maybe democracy could work in China like in Western countries" now look at democracy as the face of evil because of them. In Chinese people's minds, democracy used to be represented by an American flag; now it's represented by punks in black wearing gas masks and yellow helmets beating up an old woman 10 vs 1. The unifying hatred that these criminals are spreading in Mainland China is probably another reason why the CCP has so far declined to intervene.
SinoSoldier said:
It is ironic that such folks, who claim to be advocates of law-&-order and peaceful demonstrations, suggest that a possible "solution" to the HK protest is to call in the PLA and indiscriminately massacre these people. Not unlike what the PLA actually did to students in 1989.
Click to expand...
I don't see the irony. Engage in en-mass criminal behavior, get en-mass enforcement of the law. As long as they uphold the law and obey police orders, they should be fine. But when they don't, it will just escalate and escalate until they get killed. Just like in any law-governed country. If you steal a candy bar, the police are summoned and tell you to give it back. You refuse, they arrest you. You resist arrest, they beat you. You fight back, they shoot you. You weren't killed for a candy bar; you were killed for assaulting a police officer, just like the rioters in Hong Kong are doing.
SinoSoldier said:
Now, don't get me wrong; destruction of property, physical violence, and impeding the daily lives of other Hongkongers should be punished accordingly. Those who use the protests as a pretext to engage in criminal behavior (something that is common to all major protests, not just this one) should be caught and punished. However, the above neither represents nor defines the motives behind the HK riots.
Click to expand...
Well, they're defined by them now. If they all sat down in a designated protest zone and didn't bother anyone, that's one thing. Now, they are defined by violent crime.
SinoSoldier said:
Now, IT and social media companies are reporting that the CCP is recruiting online trolls and fake social media accounts en masse in order to sway public opinion on the HK protests.
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


Have some of those trolls & paid propagandists made it here?
Click to expand...
Yeah, they probably think people like us are recruited online trolls because we don't go by the US government position. Are we? LOL Have we joined this forum for years in advance getting furlough pay until something breaks out and we collect 50 cents a comment? LOL You know, we totally are. Your media wouldn't lie to you; people who love their home country over the US, democracy or false freedoms are always, 100% trolls. That's a fact; wiki it. LOLOL
 
Last edited:
vincent

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
SinoSoldier said:
I've noticed a pattern of thought among a select few members who seem to be constantly posting pro-regime opinions on this thread:
Have some of those trolls & paid propagandists made it here?
Click to expand...

Ya, accusing people who oppose your views as trolls/50 cents really help your cause, democracy fighter. You don't even freaking understand the basis of democracy. Pathetic
 
L

lgnxz

Junior Member
Registered Member
SinoSoldier said:
Constantly posting cherry-picked videos of rioters engaging in delinquent behavior
- Premising that most of HK's protesters operate in the same fashion as those rioters
Click to expand...
How do you want to interpret many clips showing usually a single unarmed man getting lynched by the mobs? Is there multiple logical conclusions that can justify these actions? Well you can say that a lot of HK protesters are not doing the beating themselves, but they are surely not condemning it. It's eerily similar to for example how hardline muslims making apologetic opinions instead of condemning al-qaeda and other terrorists using their religion. HK protesters are no different, just look at every HK dissidents social media showing the violence done by the rioters, they're cheering for them; if some neutral foreigners criticizing them, these apologists would say something illogical like 'sorry for the disturbance but it's actually china's fault for pushing us into acting violently. Please stay supporting us, we're very peaceful'. Complete nonsense.

SinoSoldier said:
Claiming that HK protests were caused by "foreign powers"
Click to expand...
This is not even a debate at this point. NED is openly funding and supporting CHRF, the organizer that organize those record breaking attendance. The fact that some pro-protest politicians spotted meeting with american diplomat in the consulate and finally peak in their meeting with congress in america. How many more evidences do you need to say that foreign powers are involved in the movement?

SinoSoldier said:
Assuming that HK police could do no wrong and that the CCP is always justified in whatever bill it passes
Click to expand...
Of the two, yes you can objectively say that HK police is the better ones; ofc ground execution can be muddy, especially if people like you don't want the police who is already outnumbered 10 to 1 every single time to get any sort of help. Compare that to the france's yellow vest protest where the police matches the number of protesters but act more violently, yes absolutely HK police is very restraint.

SinoSoldier said:
Assuming that the "real" underlying impetus for these riots is an imagined hatred of mainlanders on behalf of HK folks
Click to expand...
Well they're desecrating the national flag, writing racist graffiti (guess you can't read it, neither do the western journalists), beating anyone just because of speaking mandarin (even taiwanese and overseas chinese reporters are getting into trouble because of this), but ofc these people don't hate us.. :rolleyes:
The original reason of protest is about killing the extradition bill, now that is already achieved they show no sign of tuning down the violence, instead escalating it further. The demands are extremely ridiculous as well such as dropping all the charges against the caught offenders with no chance of that ever happening. So what's the 'real' impetus now? Protesting for the sake of protesting violently since it's a stalemate already?

SinoSoldier said:
Branding anyone who chooses other than to kiss Xi Jinping's feet as "traitors" or "criminals"
Click to expand...
lol now it's just a red herring at this point on..
 
J

jimmyjames30x30

Junior Member
Registered Member
Both sides are stupid. After months of observation. All I see is that this protest is a nothing but a huge deception that shifts the focus of the general populace from around the world from the real conflicts and struggles in the world. The only victims are Hong Kong residents, but even for them, the damages are nothing unbearable. The reasons are simple:

1. The Hong Kong government is not backing off.
2. HK Law enforcement are functioning fine. They can handle the situation without PAP intervening.
3. The majority of powerful HK law makers are still neutral or Pro-Beijing/Pro-stability.

Because of the above 3 point, the situation in Hong Kong does not strategically benefit or damage any sides (China, or the West), in any meaningful sense. As long as the above 3 points hold (I don't see how it can not hold), the whole thing is a waste of time. In terms of propaganda, it also give materials to both side:

On China's side, they have more than enough media materials on these silly protester, to use as fuel for strengthening nationalism in mainland.

On the side of the West, they also has more than enough media material on the protests, to use as fuel for Western Values and anti-authoritarianism (anti-China) fuel.

Realistically speaking, as long as things goes on like it is, it's going nowhere. I don't see any chinks-in-the-armor on HK government's side. And I also don't see any creative change in strategy on the protester's side. Once such protests/riots become a new norm, it will become insignificant to geopolitics.
 
J

jimmyjames30x30

Junior Member
Registered Member
I have said again and again, the protesters are pathetic, because they don't have a strategic vision. I myself is a proud and nationalistic Chinese. But since I partly grew up in the West, I am chill with both sides. And after months of these stagnant protests, I find it harder and harder to suppress my itch of wanting to play the devil's advocate and put myself in the protest/riot organizer's shoes. Perhaps also partly because I am a Daoist, and I believe in Chaos as an agents that drives evolution/improvements and strengths. This is why I want China to take as much challenge and hardship as it can handle, because they will improve and strengthen China.

I have posted similar post before, and my devil's suggestions have not changed:

1. Stop targeting HK government and public services. If serious damages to public services are inflicted, to the point of damaging regular HKers' daily life and work, they will lose support of the general populace. Instead, grow a pair and target PLA Hong Kong garrison installations.

2. Stop putting stupid banners asking US and UK to take-over, these are idiotic because even the most hawkish and delusional military planners in the US and UK will NOT entertain the idea of invading/retaking HK. Because it holds no militarily strategic value in itself. (Taking HK will drag them into a full nuclear war with China, which means that they might as well declare war with China. And if they decide to fight China, they would not waste their assets invading HK, since there are much much more militarily valuable locations they need to focus their forces on.) AND, it also does nothing but become perfect propaganda material for nationalistic propaganda in the Mainland. Instead of trashing downtown streets in the HK, and internalize that conflict. They should instead form a mass protest/march towards the HK/Shenzhen border. They should put-up banners like "Freeing all of China" and clash with PAP border troops. I bet the West would love to see this.

Of course, I don't think the protester are smart enough, nor have the correct strategic vision to implement these.
 
manqiangrexue

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
jimmyjames30x30 said:
I have said again and again, the protesters are pathetic, because they don't have a strategic vision. I myself is a proud and nationalistic Chinese. But since I partly grew up in the West, I am chill with both sides. And after months of these stagnant protests, I find it harder and harder to suppress my itch of wanting to play the devil's advocate and put myself in the protest/riot organizer's shoes. Perhaps also partly because I am a Daoist, and I believe in Chaos as an agents that drives evolution/improvements and strengths. This is why I want China to take as much challenge and hardship as it can handle, because they will improve and strengthen China.

I have posted similar post before, and my devil's suggestions have not changed:

1. Stop targeting HK government and public services. If serious damages to public services are inflicted, to the point of damaging regular HKers' daily life and work, they will lose support of the general populace. Instead, grow a pair and target PLA Hong Kong garrison installations.

2. Stop putting stupid banners asking US and UK to take-over, these are idiotic because even the most hawkish and delusional military planners in the US and UK will NOT entertain the idea of invading/retaking HK. Because it holds no militarily strategic value in itself. (Taking HK will drag them into a full nuclear war with China, which means that they might as well declare war with China. And if they decide to fight China, they would not waste their assets invading HK, since there are much much more militarily valuable locations they need to focus their forces on.) AND, it also does nothing but become perfect propaganda material for nationalistic propaganda in the Mainland. Instead of trashing downtown streets in the HK, and internalize that conflict. They should instead form a mass protest/march towards the HK/Shenzhen border. They should put-up banners like "Freeing all of China" and clash with PAP border troops. I bet the West would love to see this.

Of course, I don't think the protester are smart enough, nor have the correct strategic vision to implement these.
Click to expand...
Border troops can let them through. If they go into Shenzhen, they die in Shenzhen, by military force or by civilian reaction. I don't see that as smart at all, of course, nearly anything can be an upgrade from their current level...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top