… aka to determine for themselves when the West can photograph these latest toys and when not.
H-20 bomber (with H-X, JH-XX)
- Thread starter Deino
- Start date
… aka to determine for themselves when the West can photograph these latest toys and when not.
of course that's true. By the way, both soviets and americans knew when american/soviet spy satellite would fly overhead and plan accordingly. But today it could be that americans with its advanced satellites can keep 24/7 surveillance on key bases in the northern hemisphere. But I doubt that americans have achieved 24/7 surveillance on the chinese bases. Anyways, if the "window" was around tens of minutes in the cold war, today I am sure the "window" is much shorter. By the way, what's the logic behind hiding a bomber? to hide a bomber should be damn expensive and impractical, especially if you plan to produce the bomber in large quantities.
Given that USAF has shown so little of B-21 publicly, I'm not sure H-20 (when it does fly) will have photos coming out (like J-36 project). It might be several years before PLAAF decide they are okay to give us a real clear photo.
In a group chat, I once joked that the H-20 should be renamed H-30. Both to signify it was redesigned and because of the newer systems leaving the designation "20" behind. The KJ-3000, J-36, J-35, etc are the new systems. The H-20 just feels like an aircraft that enters service around 2020 to me. Not that this is important but I believe it becoming the H-30 would be appropriate.
Complete speculation: what if we no longer have H-20 but a heavy multi role combatant? Something large and strategic ranged, but capable of decent speed. The roles not limited to strike, but also commanding drones, launch AAM, carry self defense missiles, etc. Perhaps it will use its incredible electricity generation like an AWAC too? There will be a roomy interior to faciliate command of dozens of drones, many crews inside. The bombing bay itself may not be so large. Emphasize just fitting a few oversized strategic munitions, volume deemphsiazed. Strike volume will be decentralized to smaller drone swarms.
If J-36 is air cruiser then H-20 is a air mothership?
If J-36 is air cruiser then H-20 is a air mothership?
I have been talking about H-20 having such a role for a long time. H-20 could be like a stealthy AWACS that is also capable of launching ultra long range AAMs. It could also be supersonic to have even more relevance in Air battles. But even a subsonic H-20 with a very large powerful radar will be a significant capability boost compared to even the J-36.
The alternative role for H-20 is to be a much larger stealthy Bomber compared B-2 and have ranges similar to B-52/Tu-95 and therefore capable of hitting CONUS. This will not overlap with GJ-X, which is B-21 sized and likely do not have the range to hit CONUS.
Aerial battlecruiser, fast enough to keep up with J-36s and their drone escorts in interception, using dash not supercruise, large enough to carry hypersonics, and with enough range, fuel, and AEW&C and jamming capacity to hit the US with tanker support and full J-36 + UASF escort.
This is the only way the intercontinental mission makes sense, you punch through the US defense grid where it's weakest, while maintaining fuel for escorts so you have what comes out to an Aerial Strike Group making a beeline, buddy-tanking, for DC, San Diego, etc.
The supersonic helps with air defense roles; you might have a crappy dash range, but you just need to match the J-36 supercruise, or even hang back. Then you have a large hypersonic in carry for some close range missions.
Think 6th gen Tu-160, but with flag and AEW&C capabilities.
This is the only way the intercontinental mission makes sense, you punch through the US defense grid where it's weakest, while maintaining fuel for escorts so you have what comes out to an Aerial Strike Group making a beeline, buddy-tanking, for DC, San Diego, etc.
The supersonic helps with air defense roles; you might have a crappy dash range, but you just need to match the J-36 supercruise, or even hang back. Then you have a large hypersonic in carry for some close range missions.
Think 6th gen Tu-160, but with flag and AEW&C capabilities.
This is never ever going to happen and you will get banned again with this kind of tech fantasism. China is not going to use the H-20 to drop gravity bombs on the CONUS. Even if such a bomber was feasible it would be so expensive that a tiny amount would get built, which is obviously crippling on every other mission type.
Supersonic speed is not realistic for the H-20 because it has a low use for it. Air to air capabilities would exist, like the B-21, but these will be very secondary and will primarily be for self-defense. AEW functionality or a CIC will not exist. These require structural features that are detrimental to the aircraft's primary mission set.
Entire point is that what's the point of a H-20 when you have a GJ-X drones? The latter are likely much cheaper and deliver better payload for cost.
You're going from 2 engines to 4 engines, and now making it manned in a 6th generation environment where drones, CCAs, and UASF are de rigeur, and if all you get for the increased cost and a manned requirement is large hypersonic carry, it's sort of a waste.
On the other hand, if you want AEW&C / EW roles, supersonic speed helps A LOT, because it allows you to move with the fighter / drone fleet, and also allows you to flee when you lose.
The entire point is, we've seen that the J-50 and J-36 have mastered tailless agility, so a H-20 shouldn't need folding tails. What are the tails for, then? Yaw stability in supersonic dash.
Moreover, even for the pure hypersonic carry role, the supersonic speed helps a lot because if you lose stealth (and the Americans are working on counter stealth satellites), you still reduce time on target and inject V initial into the hypersonic.
I'm not saying that supercruise would be a requirement, and I doubt supercruise would be worth the cost, but supersonic dash, to reposition, to egress, etc would be important just for the hypersonic launch mission. Once you have supersonic dash, things like theater command, operations command, all of these become cheaper capabilities.
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What this ultimately comes down to, is the H-20 a 5th / 5.5th generation aircraft or a 6th generation aircraft? If it's 5th-5.5th, yeah, subsonic. B-2 clone with B-21-comparsble avionics. If it's sixth generation, when unmanned platforms dominate, it's probably going to be capable of supersonic dash, if only to add initial energy to its hypersonic payload.
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My name is not Bill Sweetman.