Nuclear powered carriers needed for far distance travel and conventional powered carriers more for surrounding water. I have a sense some people in US try hard to convince China not to build nuclear powered carriers and use cost as the reason. I don't know .. Since when US trying to be helpful for China cause
Future PLAN naval and carrier operations
- Thread starter Tam
- Start date
I can believe that the proposed Chinese nuclear carriers have been cancelled for now, but the situation will be different in 5-10 years time.
Presumably the technical challenges (potentially around EMALS, large naval nuclear reactors etc) will have been resolved by then.
Plus 6% annual growth means the Chinese economy grows 33% larger in 5 years. Presumably the navy budget will follow.
And I've consistently thought that Chinese carriers are just too vulnerable and don't provide enough capability, relative to their cost.
However, if China really wants to move beyond the 1st and 2nd Island Chain, eventually China would have to compete with carriers.
But that can wait another 15+ years until the core objectives in the 1st Island Chain are really secure.
So strategically, I think I think it is a good thing for Chinese nuclear carriers to be delayed, because it frees up resources for other naval systems which have a better cost-benefit ratio.
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
First the nuclear propulsion and power equation isn’t absolutely about range. A conventional carrier as the same range as a nuclear if you have the logistics. What it does do is allow more onboard stores for aviation fuel.
Second I think the whole Nuclear Carrier thing has been over blown for a number of reasons.
Second I think the whole Nuclear Carrier thing has been over blown for a number of reasons.
- Although the PLAN now has two carriers in trails we haven’t seen a real step up in there aviation wings. So far the fixed wing seems limited and not expanding as fast as many thought it would.
- Surface warfare nuclear ships are a challenge more so than most think and extremely expensive, the French were forced to curtail the number of carriers to a single ship due to the price of the Charles de Gaulle. The History of the Russian carrier program is one to prove how expensive and fickle just a conventional program can be for a nation without a long carrier program.
- Operating a large fleet of carriers would be optimum for a nation internet on a large range of interests. The US has a large fleet as it operates globally. The British empire when they had a large fleet operated globally, the French had a number of them when they operated globally. Today those latter nations operate more regionally well the US operates globally. The Question for the PLAN is are they intent on being a global player needing a global fleet or just to play in the local area?
- With the Advent of the Chinese own so called “Carrier killers” there command has to question on if they feel safe inventing in a large nuclear fueled carrier type. Those kind of sea denial technologies can be matched by advanced nations and if that happens it could be a PLAN CVN on the receiving end. Just as the USN is in debate on the future of the carrier so should emerging carrier nations be.
I think people are reading too much into an article with no sources and only speculation. Same rag also wrote that China has reduced it’s navy because of the trade war, whereas reality is the opposite, with the navy finishing a lot of ships this year. It’s bad Washington propaganda, full stop. No need to debate on it.
I think the Chinese Navy needs to focus more regionally for the time being.
So that means the 1st Island Chain, where China's core interests lie.
And then the 2nd Island Chain, to the extent that it influences operations in the 1st Island Chain.
But once the 1st Island Chain is secure, I would expect the Chinese Navy to operate globally
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If we're looking in the context of operations between the 1st and 2nd Island Chain, a conventional carrier is operating close to ports for resupply.
At 20knots, it would travel 900km in 24hours, or 1800km in 48hours. That is already enough for operations against the 2nd Island Chain.
So the main advantages of a nuclear carrier (unlimited range and more space for airwing supplies) would be limited.
Yeah, the SCMP still using Minnie Chan to write about military affairs. Someone should write to SCMP and ask them to keep quite about military affairs our hire someone who has good knowledge to write about the PLA.
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I think canceled is too strong a word, as China's carrier program is in its formative stages and lots of technologies are rapidly emerging. The many issues the Ford is facing have been instructive to everyone, including the Chinese, and I would suppose that "reality therapy" that we are undergoing, would suggest to the Chinese that a wiser course of action would be to "dial back" asperations, as well as expectations.
So I would suggest that many of the early speculation of fan boys, was never the actual reality of the Chinese Naval Carrier Program, they tend take things far more seriously, and manage risk......
Have in mind that only TNI is running with the cancelled tag for this thing. The original article has direct quotes from two insiders talking about the following:
1. The fourth carrier will probably start construction in 2021.
2. Plans for a fifth - based on a new nuclear powered design - have been put on hold for now.
3. Electromagnetic catapult and marine nuclear carrier power technologies currently are @ a low TRL in China.
1. The fourth carrier will probably start construction in 2021.
2. Plans for a fifth - based on a new nuclear powered design - have been put on hold for now.
3. Electromagnetic catapult and marine nuclear carrier power technologies currently are @ a low TRL in China.
Intrepid
Major
Really?
I expect 003 to get electromagnetic catapults. Will it be replanned for steam cats?
We don't know, but I really don't think so. All sources (and ground evidence) point to the fact that PLAN is pursuing an electromagnetic catapult system for quite some time now. The quote is the following:. "The insider also said that tests of the electromagnetic catapults used to launch the J-15, China’s only carrier-based fighter, had yet to meet the required standard."
This would be par on course for the tech item. Developing technologies like these to a high TRL takes a lot of time. For reference, USN has been developing their EMALS system since the mid-2000s. More than 15 years later, the system has still not matched its stated reliability goals. This is not unordinary btw, but rather expected for such a new and complicated system. And Ma Weiming is certainly capable enough to rise to the challenge.
002 is expected to use an EMALS system btw.
This would be par on course for the tech item. Developing technologies like these to a high TRL takes a lot of time. For reference, USN has been developing their EMALS system since the mid-2000s. More than 15 years later, the system has still not matched its stated reliability goals. This is not unordinary btw, but rather expected for such a new and complicated system. And Ma Weiming is certainly capable enough to rise to the challenge.
002 is expected to use an EMALS system btw.
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