F-22 Raptor Thread

thunderchief

Senior Member
Be interesting to know what the ROEs were.

Usaully, the F-22 is fairly well handicapped in order to allow other aircraft to get close so they can turn and burn with them.

So, I'd love to know what those ROEs were, and then what the outcome was based on the ROEs.

But outside of rumors and slips of tongues...it will undoubtedly all be classified.

Well, from description it looks like classical 1 on 1 merge and short range combat. No AWACS, no BVR combat, so F-22 stealth advantage was nullified . Under such circumstances , Su-30MKK and F-22 are fairly equal . I guess that newer Flankers with more powerful engines (especially Su-35) would even have slight advantage over Raptor .

There's no shame in that, those planes are simply made for different kind of missions . In real war, Raptor pilots would strive to stay away from this kind of situation.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Well, from description it looks like classical 1 on 1 merge and short range combat. No AWACS, no BVR combat, so F-22 stealth advantage was nullified . Under such circumstances , Su-30MKK and F-22 are fairly equal.
Well, just because there is no AWACS and because it is not BVR, does not mean that the stealth advantage of the F-22 is nullified. They still have to get eyes on them...and that is not easy to do with the F-22, evn if it is within "visual range."

In the mean time, the F-22 will be able to use both their eyeballs and their radars to find the adversary.

But the ROEs can further clarify that advantage. In some cases the ROEs indicate that the fight has to be with IR guided weapons and guns.

If it is just guns, then I agree that the F-22s stealth is largely negated.

But if it includes IR weapons, the F-22's IR stealth is very good.
 

thunderchief

Senior Member
Well, just because there is no AWACS and because it is not BVR, does not mean that the stealth advantage of the F-22 is nullified. They still have to get eyes on them...and that is not easy to do with the F-22, evn if it is within "visual range."

In the mean time, the F-22 will be able to use both their eyeballs and their radars to find the adversary.

But the ROEs can further clarify that advantage. In some cases the ROEs indicate that the fight has to be with IR guided weapons and guns.

If it is just guns, then I agree that the F-22s stealth is largely negated.

But if it includes IR weapons, the F-22's IR stealth is very good.

We are talking about 10km range (or less) , so I'm pretty much convinced that OLS-30 would pick up Raptor on those distances . I'm not certain about Bars radar, but from information we have publicly available I guess it would too manage to achieve lock .

As for R-73 missiles, it's hard to tell what would happen in frontal hemisphere but from the sides/rear F-119 is a huge source of IR emissions , especially in afterburner mode .
 

93fiM5

New Member
Whats the timeline on adding the AIM-9X to the F-22 with off bore sight capability? Any proposals to add helmet mounted cuing? That would definitely make the Raptor a bit more lethal in visual range encounters.

-Greg
 

HMS Astute

Junior Member
Re: US Air Force F-22 Raptor, News, Pictures & Video

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Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
Re: US Air Force F-22 Raptor, News, Pictures & Video

HMS Astute [IMG said:
http://i.imgur.com/XHF3v0j.jpg[/IMG]

Beautiful pictures of the most beautiful fighter aircraft in the world, did I also say most capable, most certainly, and if "form follows function", then this truth is indeed self evident. Lots of pretenders and wannabes, but only ONE Raptor! Still the most amazing aircraft of all time! long live the Queen!
 

Bernard

Junior Member
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Talon HATE pods as a TacAir bridge to the F-22; Engine spares.

Sept 16/14: Talon HATE. Boeing Advanced Network & Space Systems, Phantom Works has completed the final design review for the USAF’s Talon HATE pod program, which is designed to enable existing fighters to share information with F-22s over stealth-friendly secure datalinks. The core of this effort integrates the same IFDL datalink used on F-22As with MIDS-JTRS, a Link-16 box whose new software-defined electronics allow it to use different waveforms concurrently. Fighters equipped with the Talon HATE pod can bridge the gap between the F-22A and everyone else, serving as a distribution node over more universal modes like Link-16. As a bonus, pod-equipped fighters also get IRST long-range infrared to find targets – a method that bypasses radar stealth. This is especially useful against low-flying cruise missiles.

Note that unarmed platforms like the BACN UAVs and business jets can already handle datalink bridging, but you wouldn’t take them into enemy airspace. Hence the fighter pod approach. Tactically, Talon HATE allows the F-22 to act as a “bird dog” forward observer of sorts, transmitting the position of enemy aircraft and key ground systems to pod-equipped legacy fighters, who share the data with the rest of the force. To the extent that legacy fighters employ new missiles with full 2-way datalinks and compatibility with F-22 retargeting, the F-22s could even serve as terminal guidance. The idea isn’t entirely new, and was demonstrated during the Northern Edge 2006 exercise when F-22s were used to find opponents whose positioning behind obstacles made them invisible to standard AWACS (q.v. Key Events, June 9-16/06). What’s new is the ability to do this without giving away the F-22′s position: Talon HATE is an initial effort, and may be followed by a “5-to-4″ program.

F-15C air superiority fighters are Talon HATE’s initial platform, but MIDS-JTRS is being deployed on the US Navy’s multi-role F/A-18E/F Super Hornets, as is expected to spread to other fighters as a standard. Boeing is scheduled to deliver several Talon HATE systems to operational F-15C squadrons in 2015. Sources: Boeing, “Boeing Completes Design Review for U.S. Air Force’s Talon HATE Program”.

Sept 16/14: Engines. United Technologies subsidiary Pratt & Whitney in East Hartford, CT receives a $7 million contract modification for a rotable F119 PW-100 engine parts pool. All funds are committed immediately, using FY 2014 USAF O&M budgets.

Work will be performed at East Hartford, CT, and is expected to be complete by Dec 31/14. USAF Life Cycle Management Center in Wright-Patterson AFB, OH manages the contract (FA8611-08-C-2896, PO 0125).

Sept 12/14: Engines. United Technologies Corp. subsidiary Pratt & Whitney in East Hartford, CT has received a $7,627,698 contract modification for F-22 sustainment, including the purchase of an additional 112 Rotor 5s for the F119 engines. All funds are committed immediately, using FY 2014 USAF O&M budgets.

Work will be performed at East Hartford, CT, and is expected to be complete by Dec 17/17. The USAF Life Cycle Management Center at Wright-Patterson AFB, OH manages the contract (FA8611-08-C-2896 P00127)
 
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