CV-16, CV-17 STOBAR carrier thread (001/Liaoning, 002/Shandong)

[Michaelsinodef]

Do you think at this stage, it is safe for us to assume that the J-15B and J-XY/35 are compatible with STOBAR launch in addition to CATOBAR?

All I am asking and suggesting, is that it is something we should await to be verified, given how significant of a capability increase this would be.

If it turns out they can't, would you not be surprised if that was the case though?

With that said, like you are saying, I don't think we can slam down the hammer and says it will be that case (J15-b and J-XY/35 compatible with both STOBAR and CATOBAR).

But I think we can say it's a high likelihood/expectation.

 

[Blitzo]

If it turns out they can't, would you not be surprised if that was the case though?

With that said, like you are saying, I don't think we can slam down the hammer and says it will be that case (J15-b and J-XY/35 compatible with both STOBAR and CATOBAR).

But I think we can say it's a high likelihood/expectation.

I think the likelihood of it happening is higher than it not happening.... But I also wouldn't say it is "basically confirmed" -- which is the threshold where an outcome is so virtually guaranteed that it would take evidence to convince us otherwise.

The reason I'm harping on about confirmation and verification, is that the ability of J-XY/35 and J-15B to be STOBAR launched will greatly influence the future relevance and shelf life of CV-16/17, in turn greatly influencing the assessment and estimates of the PLANs overall projected carrier capability for at least the foreseeable future.


Is the J-XY/35 and J-15B's capability to launch from both STOBAR and CATOBAR "basically confirmed" or "all but guaranteed"?

I personally don't think so. Yes, the likelihood is high, but it is not "basically confirmed" or "all but guaranteed".
So by extension, it means we should be obliged to await confirmation and/or other forms of verification.

 

[tphuang]

I listened again to most of that podcast. My impression is that China will try to fly whatever they can off CV-16/17. There is a lot of value in being able to have multiple carriers around that you can do take off and landing. It makes no sense to have 3 carriers around and not being able to do J-35 take off and landing for part of the year because the lone 003 is under maintenance. Having 2 carriers around gives them the luxury of being able to fly year round off a real carrier.

The other thing that surprised me is the KJ-600 portion. I previously didn't consider the scenario of KJ-600 off CV-16/17, but now that seems distinctly possible.

 

[gelgoog]

Why shouldn't it be able to? The MiG-29K the Indians use operates from a smaller carrier.
I expect China to put the J-XY in operation in 001 and 002 and use them to ramp up the tempo of training of naval fighter pilots.

I do not know about the KJ-600. But prop aircraft typically require shorter runways to takeoff. It depends on the weight I guess.

 

[daifo]

Even a C-130 was able to land and take off from a carrier, so it is within a realm of possibility for the KJ-600 if it was design with the ability to generate enough speed

 

[lcloo]

RATO takeoff for KJ600 from CV16 and CV17 is possible, rocket assisted take off had been used in China for J6 fighter jets many decades ago. It is up to PLAN to decide whether they want to deploy RATO KJ600 on CV16 and CV17, or wait for a smaller and lighter AEW&C drone.

Transport and liaison variants of KJ600 air frames could be useful when CV16 and CV17 are far at sea beyond range of shore based helicopters. So I won't be surprise if PLAN has plan for RATO KJ600 and its variants for deployment on STOBAR carriers.

 

[by78]

Carrier Shandong has entered dry dock at Dalian shipyard.

 

[by78]

Just a nice screen capture of a busy flight deck on Shandong.

 

[Blitzo]

Just a nice screen capture of a busy flight deck on Shandong.

That there on the bow looks like seven J-15s packed together.
A simple thing, yet the relative proximity to one another in terms of how closely they are spotted, does suggest a degree of greater confidence and skill of the deck crew to maneuver, spot and respot aircraft as part of the flight cycle.

In the early years when Liaoning and Shandong were in service, that kind of proximity was rarely seen with that many aircraft.

 

[tphuang]

That there on the bow looks like seven J-15s packed together.
A simple thing, yet the relative proximity to one another in terms of how closely they are spotted, does suggest a degree of greater confidence and skill of the deck crew to maneuver, spot and respot aircraft as part of the flight cycle.

In the early years when Liaoning and Shandong were in service, that kind of proximity was rarely seen with that many aircraft.

exactly, it's quite impressive to see them being able to operate J-15s in such tight spaces.

In the same Shilao podcast, they made a point to talk about how Indian Navy's Vikrant was too narrow and doesn't have any margin, so can't operate anything other than Mig-29K or have efficient operation. It was made in the same section where they talked about CV-16/17 and 003 are all wide enough to comfortably accommodate J-15 operation implying that it is capable of faster operation.

Given that CV-16/17 are based on Admiral Kutznetsov class, it's quite an impressive feat to see how PLAN has been able to be operate a much larger fleet and deck operation than the Russians.