CRAIC CR929 Widebody Airliner


TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Embraer - not worth the hassle. US will roll over Brazil like an ant on the sidewalk.

Example : Last December, Trump slapped tariff on Brazil steel and aluminum when China bought soy bean from Brazil instead the US and Brazil capitulated to get the tariff rescinded.
Embraer wasn’t looking for partnership but sale. Had the deal gone through the E2 series would have become a Boeing brand to compete with Airbus 220 the former C series. This would have shifted Embraer back to smaller biz jets and tactical lines. However the Issues with the Max series of 737 and convid 19 air industry hold has pretty much put Boeing in a no go zone. The Max is now being used as a regulatory testing lab with every part being placed under the microscope and new qualifications being drafted off of it that will be applied to every new aircraft that enters production and sales.
Candidate for a partner.

Rolls Royce, Safran or Airbus - sure.
Taking it in reverse order,

Partnering with Airbus is questionable as the ARJ21 vs Airbus 220, the Comac 919 vs A320Neo and CRIAC A330Neo. I know auto makers do partner with the indigenous makers in China and many of the local Chinese brands bread and butter Are rebadged and indigenous models built on import power trains. Yet that’s a harder sell when the buyers are state owned and the builder is state owned and where with cars you can sell by the thousands it’s hundreds
The Smaller regional jets are the hot sellers these days. Tying to partner Airbus with Comac well having the inside track of the ARJ 21 to the Chinese market isn’t an easy sale.

Safran doesn’t have an engine option if the US decides to impose trade restrictions. The LEAP series is a 50/50 joint between Safran and GE. If GE is out so is LEAP. Unless the French buy out GE or they design a totally new engine.

Rolls Royce is of course British as such they are able to sell freely, unless the UK decides to enact restrictions of her own.
 

foxmulder_ms

Junior Member
That’s fine from the Chinese perspective but Embraer has to have a reason to get in to.
Frankly the whole thing is groundless.
Yes Embraer got burned from the Boeing joint. But why were they looking to crawl into bed with Boeing to begin with?
They had hoped to get a stronger foot in the US market and visa vi Airbus position themselves to counter the shifts into smaller birds.
To have Boeing back a play of the KC390 for replacement of C130 world wide and for the USAF, to position the E series as the bottom of the 7x7 line using Boeing to sure up their service network.
They hoped to Use Boeing as the same steppingstones that you want Comac to use Embraer for.
Obviously it is for money, market and beyond that survival. New E-series doesn't have the best order book.

China has potential for both market and money. Huge potential.

Also, military and civilian companies are separate for Embraer. KC390 has nothing to do with now dead Boeing deal.

Frankly, a Chinese E-series under "CB909" name will be a huge boost for Embraer. They can have a market they never even dreamed. I would say, in current situation, Embreer has much more to gain than COMAC does. Embraer has to have money. Either from Brazilian government or partnership or outright sale of the assets. They have been losing money for the last 10Qs or smt like that.

If China offers the same amount of money (~$4.2billion) Embraer will take it instantly. I am not sure COMAC sees the value in it though. What I was proposing is beyond a simple business transaction. I have been talking about a real collaboration exactly like Airbus.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Also, military and civilian companies are separate for Embraer. KC390 has nothing to do with now dead Boeing deal.
Quite to the contrary Embraer and Boeing’s deal started with the C390. The it was a joint venture that rebranded the KC390 to C390 Millennium. The reason for the reorganization of Embraer separating and isolating the defence arm was to ease the Boeing acquisition including of the C390 line.

Airbus bought out the C series that’s why it’s now A220. Comac could make the push but right now the regionals are where the market is. However Comac seems to want to go made in China from start to finish.
 

foxmulder_ms

Junior Member
Quite to the contrary Embraer and Boeing’s deal started with the C390. The it was a joint venture that rebranded the KC390 to C390 Millennium. The reason for the reorganization of Embraer separating and isolating the defence arm was to ease the Boeing acquisition including of the C390 line.

Airbus bought out the C series that’s why it’s now A220. Comac could make the push but right now the regionals are where the market is. However Comac seems to want to go made in China from start to finish.

This dead 4.2 billion deal was for Embraer Commercial Aviation.

KC390 (C390) is a product of Embraer Defense & Security.

The cancelled deal has nothing to do with KC390. Boeing and Embraer has a deal back in 2012 to work on KC390 together which is updated last year. It is still active and again very much independent of the canceled deal.
 

hullopilllw

Junior Member
Registered Member
Getting Embraer onboard is not going to help with this. And Embraer won't be interested because of this.

As soon as CR-929 shows sign of success, history will repeat itself. So Russia and China better focus on self reliance if they want to make the project a success. There is a lot of discussion on the subject in the C-919 thread.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
2028 Congress : Who supply American technology which enable the Chinese Communist Regime to compete unfairly in the global market and challenge Boeing.
 

Top