Coronavirus 2019-2020 thread (no unsubstantiated rumours!)

plawolf

Lieutenant General
As they say, play stupid games win stupid prizes. It’s no accident that the west has all these issues with low trust of vaccines and an epidemic of misinformation to rival their Covid disasters precisely because their media is more interested in political and racist point scoring then trying to give good solid information and present an unified front to actually better fight Covid.

I say fuck them. They were never going to buy Chinese vaccines and their scaremongering isn’t really going to sway many because they can’t even make enough vaccines for their own people never mind try to match China in ‘vaccine diplomacy’; as if somehow going out of your way to speed up delivery of life saving vaccines during a world wide pandemic is somehow a selfish and insidious act. All the while western nations ‘selflessly’ monopolise all the supplies of their own ‘superior’ vaccine and are gracious enough to offer any leftovers to developing countries. How generous.

In a way, it’s actually a sign of how bad things are getting that the western msm are resorting to such crude and transparent smear campaigns.

Would love to see how they continue to spin to square their circle to explain how countries buying ‘inferior’ Chinese vaccines are getting their outbreaks under control and reopening when the west is still trapped in its endless cycles of premature relaxation and fresh new waves of infections and deaths.

This is what happens when your culture and society gets so deluded and perverted as to accept a ‘post-truth’ norm in their politics and world view. You can only lie and spin so much before reality bitchslaps you with a wake up call. Ignore it and you are only setting yourself for another in the not to distant future. China went through its own shameful period like this during the Qing dynasty. Maybe the west needs it’s own century of humiliation to learn some hard truths.
 

Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
Registered Member
I agree with your opinion. Better to let scientists and bureaucrats speak freely (on their field) and to suffer some PR gaffes than to replace them with politicians
Let data speaks for itself. It would be wise to follow Deng Xiaoping's dictum: "Seek truth from facts" and not "raise your fingers in the air and see where the wind is blowing" which is typical from any democratic politicians.
 

KYli

Brigadier
I wouldn't change anything for s..t and I wouldn't want Chinese scientists play politics or be saddled with political b.s. like how it was done in the former U.S.S.R. Gao Fu has nothing to apologize for nor does he need to change or calibrate his future statements. As long as he sticks to the facts and science he and the rest of the country will be vindicated by history and results.

What you're advocating for is purely from a temporary P.R. war against the recalcitrant west. The current struggle China is facing with is a long term struggle. If the Chinese keeps calibrating to win some useless P.R. war at the expense of it's overall strategic objectives then it's just a wasteful and unnecessary endeavor. Let the Americans focus on their vacuous self congratulatory statements since their declarations have absolutely nothing to do with reality. Sooner or later reality will catch up to their b.s. and the whole world will witness who's been telling the truth. Actions speaks louder than words it doesn't matter if it's Putonghua.
That's why Chinese government and media suck at propaganda. Gao Fu isn't just a Chinese scientist. He is also a senior bureaucrat. I never say anything about not sticking with facts and science or asking Gao Fu to be replaced. I am saying as a senior bureaucrat Gao Fu has the responsibility to state the facts but at the same time choose his words wisely so opponents wouldn't take his words out of context. I am not advocating a temporary PR war but I am advocating senior bureaucrats in China need to refine and polish their communication skills. Speaking the truth and sticking with science but be crystal clear and straightforward so your opponents can't twist your words.

If you think propaganda doesn't have overall effect in the long term struggle between China and the West, then I would point out many riots, regime changes, and wars are caused by mere rumors and propaganda. Xinjiang genocide is a complete lie but many Muslims still believe it is true.

I don't care much about how Westerners think about China or Chinese vaccines. But their propaganda is giving countries that buy and use Chinese vaccines a hard time to explain to their constituents that Chinese vaccines are reliable and effective. Both Chile and Indonesia need to come out to defend Sinovac. Gao Fu needs to do better.
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
And your point of bringing this to everyone's attention here is to prove what exactly? That all western Democracies or all Democracies for that matter lies through their teeth and suffer no consequences. Is this what you're pushing for the beaurucrats in China is to micromanage or vet their scientists before making comments in the western media? Like having political commissars.
Sure, just let any scientist speak their mind to the media and let the Western media pick and choose their words to twist, like Chinese morons (that are scientists) that said bats must be the host of the virus and must have jump to humans from the Wuhan wet market before any investigation has started. In this case, a top Chinese scientist that spoke in such way that even Chinese believe the Chinese vaccines are ineffective and refuse to take it.

Didn't some of you complain Chinese PR sucks?
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
That's why Chinese government and media suck at propaganda. Gao Fu isn't just a Chinese scientist. He is also a senior bureaucrat. I never say anything about not sticking with facts and science or asking Gao Fu to be replaced. I am saying as a senior bureaucrat Gao Fu has the responsibility to state the facts but at the same time choose his words wisely so opponents wouldn't take his words out of context. I am not advocating a temporary PR war but I am advocating senior bureaucrats in China need to refine and polish their communication skills. Speaking the truth and sticking with science but be crystal clear and straightforward so your opponents can't twist your words.

If you think propaganda doesn't have overall effect in the long term struggle between China and the West, then I would point out many riots, regime changes, and wars are caused by mere rumors and propaganda. Xinjiang genocide is a complete lie but many Muslims still believe it is true.

I don't care much about how Westerners think about China or Chinese vaccines. But their propaganda is giving countries that buy and use Chinese vaccines a hard time to explain to their constituents that Chinese vaccines are reliable and effective. Both Chile and Indonesia need to come out to defend Sinovac. Gao Fu needs to do better.
This is a perfect example to show how propaganda between China and the West isn't a fair comparison simply for looking at results because the world was already built to be in line with America after WWII. Yeah, Gao Fu's not perfect; far from it. He took a lot of criticism too for failing to recognize the threat of COVID when it just started. But compare the little mistakes he makes to the mistakes that American politicians make. How many stupid things did Trump and his cabinet say about COVID and still have their propaganda be considered "effective" or better than China's? Inject bleach/UV light, it's a virus/bacteria/germ/nobody knows, this is COVID-19 not COVID-1, MERS came from China, etc... If Chinese politicians made these gaffs their careers would be over immediately.
 

Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
Registered Member
That's why Chinese government and media suck at propaganda. Gao Fu isn't just a Chinese scientist. He is also a senior bureaucrat. I never say anything about not sticking with facts and science or asking Gao Fu to be replaced. I am saying as a senior bureaucrat Gao Fu has the responsibility to state the facts but at the same time choose his words wisely so opponents wouldn't take his words out of context. I am not advocating a temporary PR war but I am advocating senior bureaucrats in China need to refine and polish their communication skills. Speaking the truth and sticking with science but be crystal clear and straightforward so your opponents can't twist your words.

If you think propaganda doesn't have overall effect in the long term struggle between China and the West, then I would point out many riots, regime changes, and wars are caused by mere rumors and propaganda. Xinjiang genocide is a complete lie but many Muslims still believe it is true.

I don't care much about how Westerners think about China or Chinese vaccines. But their propaganda is giving countries that buy and use Chinese vaccines a hard time to explain to their constituents that Chinese vaccines are reliable and effective. Both Chile and Indonesia need to come out to defend Sinovac. Gao Fu needs to do better.
Many Muslims in where or which countries? Again, you're basing your comments and understanding from a western mindset or western perspective. The world consist of more than just the west or western led narrative. If your assumptions were true then the B.R.I. Initiative wouldn't have so many member countries that as of this writing is around 130 countries and the membership to B.R.I. is VOLUNTARY and not forced. So please, do tell me how is China being alienated by the world again?
 

Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
Registered Member
Sure, just let any scientist speak their mind to the media and let the Western media pick and choose their words to twist, like Chinese morons (that are scientists) that said bats must be the host of the virus and must have jump to humans from the Wuhan wet market before any investigation has started. In this case, a top Chinese scientist that spoke in such way that even Chinese believe the Chinese vaccines are ineffective and refuse to take it.

Didn't some of you complain Chinese PR sucks?
Where do you get your evidence to support your assertion that "even Chinese believe that Chinese vaccines are ineffective and refuse to take it" per your quote. I mean as of today there's an average of 4 to 5 million Chinese getting Chinese vaccines in China which is more than what India can show so far and at this rate they will come close to surpassing the total number of population getting inoculated in the U.S.

Don't just assert something without providing any facts to support your opinion and expect me to believe any of it at face value. Are there any Chinese that's holding off from getting the vaccine for sure, but is the majority of their reluctance based off on the lack of confidence to their countries vaccines efficacy? Far from it. They are holding off because the number of cases in China has largely been successfully CONTAINED and much of the lives of ordinary Chinese citizens have largely gone back to NORMAL and that's something people in the majority of the world can't claim and most likely wish to have or be under.
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Yeah the Chinese are horrible when it comes to PR. They should know the West will take any opportunity against China. I'll have to assume their mistakes are cultural. What they think they're saying is not the same how others will interpret it. It's just like Ren Zhengfei, CEO of Huawei. While Trump was President and taking actions against China and Huawei, he sent mixed messages. One time he would say things what the Western media called strong comments against the US and then the next he would make conciliatory remarks to Trump. That's what I hate about Beijing because they do that too. Americans don't admit they're wrong nor admit they're in a weaker position. When Beijing makes those statements like someone is "hurting Chinese people's feelings..." I just cringe. Does Beijing think showing China's emotions on their sleeves is going to make the other side change their minds? Where's that poker face that Asians are stereotyped as unemotional and cold? If it's some Sun Tzusian tactic, it doesn't work. It's like Chinese who argue China should take the high road like they seem to think China is doing now. I don't see any rewards for taking the high road. I only see things getting worse so what they think they see as happening is not happening because they see things from a cultural perspective and not all cultures see things the same way especially Western culture.
 
Top