Chinese UAV/UCAV development

free_6ix9ine said:

I actually disagree with this approach of large stealth UCAVs, geometry and material science may make a large aircraft slightly more stealthy. But the RCS is still going to be massive.

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free_6ix9ine said:

My definition of a large UAV is something similar to the GJ-11 or X-47 or Reaper or Predator.

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While propellered UAVs such as Reaper and Predator are not meant to be stealthy, flying wing UAVs such as the GJ-11 and X-47 are quite stealthy. Carefully designed shaping – coupled with radar absorbent coating – can make large aircraft very, very, very stealthy by massively reducing their RCS. I don't know what century you live in, but stealth technology has advanced by leaps and bounds since 1975.

free_6ix9ine said:

They are trying to replicate the capabilities of a manned jet just without a pilot.

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No, this is false. Just because an UAV flies and drops bombs doesn't mean it replicates the capabilities of manned warplane. UAVs provide desirable capabilities that manned planes simply cannot match, such as time on station and endurance, both are more useful in a host of scenarios than manned platforms.

free_6ix9ine said:

I am proposing something that is not trying to replicate a manned aircraft, but rather a cruise missile. That can loiter and is reusable.

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You are just all over the map. Why replicate anything when you already have the original? Reusable cruise missiles? Did you mean loitering munitions? But why? What's the point?

By the way, could you change your profile image to something less off-putting?

by78 said:

you are just all over the map. Why replicate anything when you already have the original? Reusable cruise missiles? Did you mean loitering munitions? But why? What's the point?

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Imagine a loitering cruise missile that has a detachable warhead. The "missiles"/drone can fly in a swarm of 1000 to the target area and loiter. A human operator can designate which target to destroy and the system assigns that target to one of the drones. The drone drops its warhead on the target and automatically fly's back to base to be rearmed and reused.

Point is to have a small hard to shoot down drones which are reusable to keep costs down.

free_6ix9ine said:

S-400 or future radars could probably shoot down a stealth drone like the X-47. But could S-400 shoot down a drone swarm of 500 microdones? probably not. Drones are cheap, missiles are not. It's easy to increase the size of your drone swarm but it's not easy or cheap to set up more S-400s.

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You simply haven't thought this through. You realize military targets are incredibly varied and diverse, right? What's that swarm of small drones carrying pitiful payload going to do against a hardened aircraft shelter or an underground target?

Let's say you are trying to hit a parked enemy aircraft that's inside a shelter made of three feet of reinforced concrete under another six feet of packed earth. What are your proposed swarm of drones gonna do? Splatter themselves by the hundreds and hope to eventually do some damage?

by78 said:

You simply haven't thought this through. You realize military targets are incredibly varied and diverse, right? What's that swarm of small drones carrying pitiful payload going to do against a hardened aircraft shelter or an underground target?

Let's say you are trying to hit a parked enemy aircraft that's inside a shelter made of three feet of reinforced concrete under another six feet of packed earth. What are your proposed swarm of drones gonna do? Splatter themselves by the hundreds and hope to eventually do some damage?

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Maybe micro drone is not the right word to describe what I'm proposing. I mean something the size of a cruise missile or a large RC plane. Is capable of carrying one gliding bomb the size of a hellfire missile. Is it a bunker buster? No. But will it take care of tanks? yes.

free_6ix9ine said:

Imagine a loitering cruise missile that has a detachable warhead. The "missiles"/drone can fly in a swarm of 1000 to the target area and loiter. A human operator can designate which target to destroy and the system assigns that target to one of the drones. The drone drops its warhead on the target and automatically fly's back to base to be rearmed and reused.

Point is to have a small hard to shoot down drones which are reusable to keep costs down.

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You are looking to replicate the capabilities of existing cruise missiles and UAVs by proposing a Frankenstein hybrid that's jack of all trades and expert at none. It'd be a lot cheaper and simpler to rely on existing cruise missiles and manned and unmanned platforms, whichever fits the mission requirements, and skip your half-baked proposal.

free_6ix9ine said:

Maybe micro drone is not the right word to describe what I'm proposing. I mean something the size of a cruise missile or a large RC plane. Is capable of carrying one gliding bomb the size of a hellfire missile. Is it a bunker buster? No. But will it take care of tanks? yes.

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Why don't you spend some time thinking over what you are proposing instead of blurting things out willy-nilly? It'd save all of us a lot of time.

by78 said:

You are looking to replicate the capabilities of existing cruise missiles and UAVs by proposing a Frankenstein hybrid that's jack of all trades and expert at none. It'd be a lot cheaper and simpler to rely on existing cruise missiles and manned and unmanned platforms, whichever fits the mission requirements, and skip your half-baked proposal.

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It's hardly cheaper to rely on cruise missiles. Since you can't recover it. A cruise missile cost millions to make. A hellfire missile costs 100k. Hardly the comparison. Also it's not a jack of all trades. I don't know where you got that from? Cheaper and harder to shoot down than a drone. And cheaper than a cruise missile. Plus with loitering its much more accurate than a cruise missile because it can designate moving targets like a drone using electro optical targeting system.

free_6ix9ine said:

It's hardly cheaper to rely on cruise missiles. Since you can't recover it. A cruise missile cost millions to make.

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A cruise missile hardly costs millions to make. In fact, a Tomahawk costs only about 12 times that of a Hellfire.

free_6ix9ine said:

A hellfire missile costs 100k.

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Yeah, but its warhead is only 9kg. A Tomahawk warhead is 450kg. Which would you choose? 12 hellfire missiles that can make cute little dents against a hardened shelter or a 450kg bunker busting warhead?

free_6ix9ine said:

Cheaper and harder to shoot down than a drone. And cheaper than a cruise missile. Plus with loitering its much more accurate than a cruise missile because it can designate moving targets like a drone using electro optical targeting system.

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A swarm of 1000 reusable drones, each with its own electro-optical system and associated targeting software and hardware? That sounds a hell lot more expensive than 50 flying wing stealth UCAVs (with an RCS no bigger than a bumble bee) that can loiter for hours and hours, each having the flexibility of carrying at least a dozen Hellfire-sized missiles or far bigger munitions, depending the job. And that's without considering backend costs of maintaining your fabled 1000-strong fleet of drones and the logistics of transporting and deploying them.

You really need to put more thought into what you're proposing. Or at the very least, have a grasp of such basics as the cost of a cruise missile before putting forward your bold ideas.

P.S. Do you mind changing your profile image to something less off-putting and offensive? This is a respectable forum.

I think the upper size limit for a drone is basically the same as a single engine, single seat fighter.
Larger than that and you are making a really expensive platform without on-site oversight.
I think the proposals of large dual engine drones are insane to be honest.

siegecrossbow said:

Stealth UCAVs are pretty much taking over the role occupied by the F-117.

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Pardon? how do you define "role occupied by the F-117"