Chinese tradition, ceremony,culture


Brumby

Major
When you talk about these, please remind yourself that you are talking about a subject matter of comparative civilizations. China is not part your western civilizations, it does not want to be, and it never will be. China is not Japan or South Korea. China is China. Don't use the norms of your own civilization as a universal rule, because they are NOT.


China is NOT your typical nation state, which is a concept founded in the history and political science of the Europe. China is China, and China has always been China. Traditionally, China is not called a country, it was called an imperial court "天朝". Read enough Chinese history and literature, and you will know that traditional Chinese do not usually refer to their "country" as a country ("~国"), it was referred to an imperial court, or imperial dynasty. The idea of "country" has always been subservient to the idea of "the imperial court".


I think this is because China has many countries: Wu (吴), Chu (楚), Bashu (巴蜀), Qilu (齐鲁), Qinchuan(秦川), ....etc. These are the countries (国). China is above that. This is not just a simple territorial divide. Without the idea of China above, these "countries" can form their own organic nation states. These don't even have ethnic/racial divides like the Turks or Tibetans. They are all part of China simply because China is not a nation state. China is a civilizational state.


There are no existential conflict between China the civilization state, and the many little Chinas the (could-be) nation states. Because the idea of China is not on the same level of the nation state. Chinese people are born and raised with the awareness that they are sharing country with distinct people they have little commonalities with. I was aware of this as early as in elementary school. I was born in the city of Wuhan, basically in what I would call the Chu (楚) identity. I instant felt foreign when going to Jiangsu (江苏), or Guangdong (广东). But, I didn't feel foreign at all when going to Hunan (湖南) province, or anywhere else in Hubei (湖北) province, or south part of Henan (河南) province. I don't understand Henan or Hunan dialect/languages, or even some local dialects within Hubei province, but I didn't feel foreign there. But for Jiangsu and Guangdong, I did feel foreign there and I don't understand their language/dialect.


Similarly speaking, some neighboring language-culture regions within China forms a cluster, even if people don't typically understand each other's dialect, but they are close enough that they feel akin them. You will see people in Guangxi feeling a lot more kinship with people in Guangdong than the people in Guizhou. People in Fujian would feel a lot more kinship to people in Taiwan than people in Guangdong. This is the idea of the country, the nation state.


China is none of those could-be "countries". For the Chinese to put their Country above the Party (which is heir to the concept of the imperial court), they will only end up destroying China. Because their concept of a country is a bottom up concept, based upon each of their could-be nation states. This is why the Party is above the country. Because the without the Party, there is NO one country of China.

For example, the concept of national loyalty or patriotism for Chinese people is materialized in the phrase “報國”: to repay the "country" (presumably with one's own life). However, this does not really make sense in context of the phrase itself, because 報 also carries the meaning "to return...". This means that the "country" (國) in this case at least allegorically has a physical body, which somehow gave birth to this individual how wants to repay his life. In Chinese culture, an imperial court or the Party (CCP) can not give birth to anyone, these two concepts has the allegorical the male gender. In Chinese culture, "Country" has the female gender, allegorically.


In Chinese culture, the Imperial Court (which the CCP is heir to) is the Father Figure, and the Country (countries) is the Mother Figure. Chinese traditional culture calls on men to love and obey their father, while protect and take care of their mother. The “Country” represents the physical regions of the earth, which is female (or Yin, 陰).


Another evidence is in poetry. Traditional Chinese poets use the word "country" as a specific region(s) of land within in China. You see them use the term "北國" (Northern Country) or "南國" (Southern Country). These does NOT mean the northern/southern part of the (one) country, rather, these are different countries: the country of the north, or the country of the south. This is because you NEVER encounter even one person who says "eastern country" (東國) or "western country" (西國) to refer to the western/eastern part of China. This is because there are NO real countries in China that could be thought of as the country of the east, or country of the west.


Northern country could trace their roots all the way to Shang and Zhou dynasty, which are in what we call Northern China Plain today. Southern country can trace their cultural root to at least the Kingdom of Chu, which for a the majority of the history of the Later Zhou dynasty, was the emerging power that is a civilizational challenger to the Zhou Court. The southern country is also enriched with waves of migration from the central plain as a result of nomadic invasion for 20 centuries.
This conversation is being moved from the HK protest thread.

Jimmy,
You obviously spent effort in posting and deserve a reply. Can you summarize the main points that you wish to make as a lot of what you said is background information before I make specific comments.
The Chinese philosophical idea of "State" to my knowledge and the consequent "mandate from heaven" was promoted by Moh-Tzu way before even Qin Shi Huang founded the Qin dynasty.
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Tam

Major
Registered Member
SCMP just posted a video about her. Lol, SCMP doesn't even have a fraction of her follower count in YouTube. She's practically a YouTube franchise on her own.


Started watching her. Her videos seems so relaxing so chilling out.

One of her most popular videos, she's going IKEA on bamboo.

 

Hendrik_2000

Brigadier
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #237
Yes I watch her video and she should be applauded for trying to bring back tradition of family love, good food and self sufficiently, appreciation of craft, beauty and perfection I am glad that there is still young people in China who honor and respect their tradition Here she talk about herself and why her vlog is so popular. I guess a lot of people in China are now longing for root,belonging and simpler form of life instead rat race. But unfortunately the interviewer is a Hongkie who does not appreciate what she does

Craft, artisan and perfection is not Japanese monopoly China and Chinese does value and exhibit those characteristic as well but recent past submerge those natural instinct. Hopefully it will resurface again This episode embody those traits. I like her artistic touch in her video beautiful
 
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solarz

Brigadier
Yes I watch her video and she should be applauded for trying to bring back tradition of family love, good food and self sufficiently, appreciation of craft, beauty and perfection I am glad that there is still young people in China who honor and respect their tradition Here she talk about herself and why her vlog is so popular. I guess a lot of people in China are now longing for root,belonging and simpler form of life instead rat race. But unfortunately the interviewer is a Hongkie who does not appreciate what she does
I saw another video from that interviewer, and at the end of the video, she was making fun of Li Ziqi for going on and on about different kinds of bamboo. Very disrespectful and condescending.

One of the aspects I am most uncomfortable with when I visit China is the importance everyone places on displays of material wealth. However, the recent popularity of Li Ziqi shows that Chinese people are now looking for something more. They are starting to place more value on leisure time, freedom from stressful demands, and living a simple life.
 

advill

Junior Member
May I take this opportunity of wishing all my Chinese friends in this chat group in advance “A Happy, Prosperous & Peaceful Chinese New Year”. In the Chinese tradition of my dear wife’s family, & as advised by my late & wonderful Mother in Law, the Chinese Teochew (Chouzhou) Dialect CNY greeting is “Sin Chia Joo Ee”.
 

Gatekeeper

Captain
Registered Member
May I take this opportunity of wishing all my Chinese friends in this chat group in advance “A Happy, Prosperous & Peaceful Chinese New Year”. In the Chinese tradition of my dear wife’s family, & as advised by my late & wonderful Mother in Law, the Chinese Teochew (Chouzhou) Dialect CNY greeting is “Sin Chia Joo Ee”.
Thank you. But the Luna new year is not till the 25th Jan in the western calender, and we need to get past another date 過凍。 before Luna new year can start in earnest.
 

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