Chinese Engine Development

latenlazy

Brigadier
I disagree. Engine tech is essentially an iterrative process. The AL 41 came from the AL 31 which was a turbofan adaptation of the AL 21 by the addition of a power turbine and bypass fan. The F100 has its roots in the J79 turbojet which also served as the gas generator aka "core" of the CF-6 high bypass turbofan which powered the C-5 galaxy.
It may be iterative, but you can’t simply slap a fan section onto an old turbojet core that was never developed to be a turbofan. The whole engine works as one integrated component. Treating components as modular when they’re not designed as such is one reason why the WS-10’s development process was such a nightmare. Mix and match isn’t a good way to do jet engine design when your downstream mechanisms have high dependency on your upstream mechanisms, unless you explicitly design such components with such flexibility in mind first.
 

free_6ix9ine

Junior Member
Registered Member
It may be iterative, but you can’t simply slap a fan section onto an old turbojet core that was never developed to be a turbofan. The whole engine works as one integrated component. Treating components as modular when they’re not designed as such is one reason why the WS-10’s development process was such a nightmare. Mix and match isn’t a good way to do jet engine design when your downstream mechanisms have high dependency on your upstream mechanisms, unless you explicitly design such components with such flexibility in mind first.

A turbo jet is essentially the "core", if by core you mean the thing that generates hot gasses. By adding another turbine that is only linked to a fan, your essentially just converting that heat energy into rotational energy.
 

latenlazy

Brigadier
A turbo jet is essential the "core", if by core you mean the thing that generates hot gasses. By adding another turbine that is only linked to a fan, your essentially just converting that heat energy into rotational energy.
Yes, but that does not mean an engine designed to be a turbojet would take well to conversion into a turbofan. You make it sound like gas is just homogenous ether. The way your fan section impacts the gas dynamics downstream into your core is a very serious design detail that you’re glossing over.
 

Orthan

Senior Member
I really hope they couple WS-19 development with J-35. Sure, Navalizing the engine is an extra step that may hamper development speed but for a change, the rewards associated with the risk endured are nothing short of overwhelming. An EJ200 F414 class reliable engine is a must for China.

Such a WS-19 could also help in the fast development of Carrier borne UAVs ( operating aboard Type 076).

Does anyone knows about the actual status of the WS-19 development? Has it been flight tested yet, or is it still in ground tests? or has it even been tested at all?
 

Orthan

Senior Member
There were reports the WS-19 was in ground testing months(?) ago.
Have not heard anything about flight testing.

Are you implying that WS-19 started ground testing only months ago? Going somewhat faster than WS-15 (ground-testing in 2005?), expect WS-19 to enter service in a long, long time, i mean, if ever.
 

latenlazy

Brigadier
Are you implying that WS-19 started ground testing only months ago? Going somewhat faster than WS-15 (ground-testing in 2005?), expect WS-19 to enter service in a long, long time, i mean, if ever.
Not comparable situations. The WS-15’s engine core was first tested back in 2008. A complete prototype engine wasn’t assembled until around 2013-4. The component technologies for the WS-15 didn’t even exist at the start of the project, and it’s probable that the WS-15 underwent redesign over time as more component technologies matured. That’s why the WS-15’s development has taken so long. They weren’t just building a new engine but developing the entire technological base from scratch.

The WS-19 won’t need the time to develop a new technological base. It’s using component technology derived from the WS-15. Given that the WS-15 is already in batch production testing that will mean the WS-19’s prototyping and development testing phases should be much shorter. We got an image of the WS-19 from two years back, so technically there’s already an engine probably two years into its testing process.
 

Orthan

Senior Member
Given that the WS-15 is already in batch production testing that will mean the WS-19’s prototyping and development testing phases should be much shorter. We got an image of the WS-19 from two years back, so technically there’s already an engine probably two years into its testing process.

But has WS-15 been flight tested? if not, is it normal to test batch production before it?

As for the WS-19 image, are you refering to this?
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