Chinese ATGM discussion

Copy, thanks Insignius. I was just wondering since shen specificly mentioned the new chinese missile was fiber optic cable guided. Is that another missile being talked here which I didn't catch?
Anyway, why would a MMW radar beamriding missile be able to go even faster then it's laser counterpart? The RBS 70 is said to achieve Mach 2 with laser beamriding.

antiterror13 said:

I thought the encryption technology has been so advanced that spoofing is almost impossible ... and we are talking about 5-10 seconds window before it hits the destination .. I still don't understand

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"Almost" but mostly the worry would be Spoofing form Flares or lasers. by being wire guided unless you can cut the wire there is not real way to mess with it.

@Insignius is was writing in General. In this particular case however you are correct. Being a Vehicle it can fire form some degree of hard cover.

@ Scratch.
A Laser guided system has to keep track of the Laser painting. that means the seeker head has to be able to move inside the rocket and keep the "Dot" Centered. A radar Guided system is operating of a reflected radio signal all it has to do is scan for the strongest possible reflection. It's not looking it's using optics it's listening The Signal is coming to it. Where the Laser signal ony reflects a small portion.

Scratch said:

Copy, thanks Insignius. I was just wondering since shen specificly mentioned the new chinese missile was fiber optic cable guided. Is that another missile being talked here which I didn't catch?
Anyway, why would a MMW radar beamriding missile be able to go even faster then it's laser counterpart? The RBS 70 is said to achieve Mach 2 with laser beamriding.

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HJ-9 is the older laser beam rider missile. ATF-10 is new fiber optic guided missile.

Scratch said:

Is there a type of wire guided missile that is only wire guided in the initial part of the flight? I mean sure if you run out of wire and it ripps, the missile will continue to go straight ahead and you can hope that it's good enough. But that "feature" is not by design.
Does that HJ-9 provide a sensor video feed back to the operator then? Otherwise the method of operation wouldn't really be different, right?

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I see that Insignius, and one or 2 others, have already explained on the subject in much detail.

On the question: Since the missile is NLOS, I was presuming the missile uses its onboard sensors, noticeable by the lenses on the nose cone of the missile, to actively guide the missiles to its target when the target goes out of LOS or when the wire, or fibre optic cable, is cut due to insufficient length or obstacles along the way.

antiterror13 said:

I thought the encryption technology has been so advanced that spoofing is almost impossible ... and we are talking about 5-10 seconds window before it hits the destination .. I still don't understand

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It's much easier to mess with the signal to destroy the targeting data than having to break open the encryption if this was what was meant by "spoofing".

TerraN, now you're getting me all messed up

I thought we were specifficly discussing beamriding systems. In those, contrary to your discription, there's no seeker in the missile head to look for reflected laser / radar energy. The operator keeps his crosshairs centered on the target, causing a coaxially mounted laser / radar emitter to emitt in the same direction. The sensors in the tail of the missile then try to keep the missile centered in that beam were the signal is at it's strongest. And I don't really believe a laser based system is at a speed / agility disadvantage here, since there is a working SAM system based on that principle. The RBS 70 is capable of engaging maneuvering airplanes.

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I have now also looked back at the video with the ATF-10 operation. Looks like the missile's sensor feed is indeed transmitted to the operator via fibre optic cable to allow him to command the missile. Would be interesting to know if the missile is able to continue tracking autonomously if the cable is cut.

claims it's the HJ-12.

HJ-12. I noticed that launcher optic is much larger than in Javelin.

The PLA came a long long way

Is this baby for export only? or already operational in PLA?

antiterror13 said:

Is this baby for export only? or already operational in PLA?

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Supposedly already in PLA use for some years.