China's red sea/gulf/middle east strategy

I'm curious that there's no thread for this, or at least in the first 2 pages I checked.

Just curious what you guys all think about the current situation, since it seems like a pretty big blow for US power and prestige that they cannot stop the attacks, and afaik, Chinese ships are still sailing through even if Costco isn't, probably out of fear of crossfire or accidents.

Afaik, 3 Chinese warships are doing patrols and even escort missions in red sea, just for Chinese ships, not others lol. Iirc. It was type 52d destroyer, type 54a frigate and supply ship. Most likely based out of Djibouti and as part of their usual anti piracy missions, iirc it's the 45th rotation.

For China I assume they are spying on us/UK etc anti ship missile defenses, especially since I Believe the houthis or "Iran backed groups" have access to Chinese C701/C801 anti ship missiles. China exported them to Iran years ago and even houthi rebels have announced they not only have them, but also have domestic production capabilities. I dunno how accurate this is, or if it is "domestically produced" by ordering all the components off Alibaba like Iranian drones..


China is probably even giving/sharing identification data. As in which ships are Chinese and which arent. How else can houthis be sure? It's not a big step from there to also share targeting data.. especially if 3 Chinese warships are there. How will usa know, and even if they did, what can they do? Just like usa provide such info in Ukraine. What can Russia do? Russia can also play such games, and I'd be surprised if they weren't.

Whats your takes on it and will china just sit back forever and this be the new normal? Or will china let USA sweat it out for awhile and make concessions to China and then China will come in and save the day in the end and be the peacemaker just like Iran/Saudi?

Ex0 said:

I'm curious that there's no thread for this, or at least in the first 2 pages I checked.

Just curious what you guys all think about the current situation, since it seems like a pretty big blow for US power and prestige that they cannot stop the attacks, and afaik, Chinese ships are still sailing through even if Costco isn't, probably out of fear of crossfire or accidents.

Afaik, 3 Chinese warships are doing patrols and even escort missions in red sea, just for Chinese ships, not others lol. Iirc. It was type 52d destroyer, type 54a frigate and supply ship. Most likely based out of Djibouti and as part of their usual anti piracy missions, iirc it's the 45th rotation.

For China I assume they are spying on us/UK etc anti ship missile defenses, especially since I Believe the houthis or "Iran backed groups" have access to Chinese C701/C801 anti ship missiles. China exported them to Iran years ago and even houthi rebels have announced they not only have them, but also have domestic production capabilities. I dunno how accurate this is, or if it is "domestically produced" by ordering all the components off Alibaba like Iranian drones..

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Whats your takes on it and will china just sit back forever and this be the new normal? Or will china let USA sweat it out for awhile and make concessions to China and then China will come in and save the day in the end and be the peacemaker just like Iran/Saudi?

Click to expand...

It's actually pretty clear that China has already sided with the 'axis of resistance' (at UN, saying how Palestinians/Hamas has the right for violent self defense).

So yes, they are gonna just gonna sit out on things and not come and help US

Michaelsinodef said:

It's actually pretty clear that China has already sided with the 'axis of resistance' (at UN, saying how Palestinians/Hamas has the right for violent self defense).

So yes, they are gonna just gonna sit out on things and not come and help US

Click to expand...

Yeah I don't mean that they will join us coalition, but as in they will actually apply pressure and do it for Chinese interests since 40% of shipping that goes though is Chinese. They don't seem to be doing anything or care ATM.

Kind of similar to NK maybe. They won't help USA, but they will apply pressure and even go along with sanctions for their own interests. Like not yet, but in future. This might change as Chinese companies apply pressure and Chinese gov needs to respond..

Anyone know who's paying the extra costs for shipping? Europeans? Or is Chinese also paying the price? And just what is the price for China, if any?

In this era of no holds barred strategic competition, any event that asymmetrically raises your opponent's cost is a win. If China has to pay 20% more for shipping, but the US/UK has to pay 80% more, that's a huge win for China.

Ex0 said:

I'm curious that there's no thread for this, or at least in the first 2 pages I checked.

Just curious what you guys all think about the current situation, since it seems like a pretty big blow for US power and prestige that they cannot stop the attacks, and afaik, Chinese ships are still sailing through even if Costco isn't, probably out of fear of crossfire or accidents.

Afaik, 3 Chinese warships are doing patrols and even escort missions in red sea, just for Chinese ships, not others lol. Iirc. It was type 52d destroyer, type 54a frigate and supply ship. Most likely based out of Djibouti and as part of their usual anti piracy missions, iirc it's the 45th rotation.

For China I assume they are spying on us/UK etc anti ship missile defenses, especially since I Believe the houthis or "Iran backed groups" have access to Chinese C701/C801 anti ship missiles. China exported them to Iran years ago and even houthi rebels have announced they not only have them, but also have domestic production capabilities. I dunno how accurate this is, or if it is "domestically produced" by ordering all the components off Alibaba like Iranian drones..

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

China is probably even giving/sharing identification data. As in which ships are Chinese and which arent. How else can houthis be sure? It's not a big step from there to also share targeting data.. especially if 3 Chinese warships are there. How will usa know, and even if they did, what can they do? Just like usa provide such info in Ukraine. What can Russia do? Russia can also play such games, and I'd be surprised if they weren't.

Whats your takes on it and will china just sit back forever and this be the new normal? Or will china let USA sweat it out for awhile and make concessions to China and then China will come in and save the day in the end and be the peacemaker just like Iran/Saudi?

Click to expand...

They are there to defend against “Houthis” armed with Harpoon missiles.

Ex0 said:

I'm curious that there's no thread for this, or at least in the first 2 pages I checked.

Just curious what you guys all think about the current situation, since it seems like a pretty big blow for US power and prestige that they cannot stop the attacks, and afaik, Chinese ships are still sailing through even if Costco isn't, probably out of fear of crossfire or accidents.

Afaik, 3 Chinese warships are doing patrols and even escort missions in red sea, just for Chinese ships, not others lol. Iirc. It was type 52d destroyer, type 54a frigate and supply ship. Most likely based out of Djibouti and as part of their usual anti piracy missions, iirc it's the 45th rotation.

Click to expand...

The bold part is not true, they provide convoy protection to all ships regardless of flags.

Michaelsinodef said:

It's actually pretty clear that China has already sided with the 'axis of resistance' (at UN, saying how Palestinians/Hamas has the right for violent self defense).

So yes, they are gonna just gonna sit out on things and not come and help US

Click to expand...

Pretty much the entire Global South have sided with the Palestinians.
That is 5 out of every 6 people in the world.

And increasingly, we'll see more "Western" countries side with the Palestinians the longer this goes on, particularly in Europe.

Ex0 said:

China is probably even giving/sharing identification data. As in which ships are Chinese and which arent. How else can houthis be sure? It's not a big step from there to also share targeting data.. especially if 3 Chinese warships are there. How will usa know, and even if they did, what can they do? Just like usa provide such info in Ukraine. What can Russia do? Russia can also play such games, and I'd be surprised if they weren't.

Whats your takes on it and will china just sit back forever and this be the new normal? Or will china let USA sweat it out for awhile and make concessions to China and then China will come in and save the day in the end and be the peacemaker just like Iran/Saudi?

Click to expand...

Regarding the bold part. If you are a paid subscribers of a live ship tracking application, you can see many ships that are travelling through Red Sea now added additional info on their ship description such as "This ship is manned by all Chinese crew", or "This ship does not sailed to Israel" etc.

Houthis can get public information on each ship by subscribing to many such live ship tracking apps. In fact any body can do that.

Frankly I think the US and UK are calling some of the missile attacks ASBMs just to get China to think ASBMS don't work against Western navies. One of Peter Zeihan's arguments for China collapsing was he said the US was going to stop being the policeman of the world and stop patrolling international waters leaving the world's oceans open to piracy and chaos. China's economy be would grinding to a halt from all the pirates of the sea taking over Chinese cargo ships. The Western alarmists are always crying that China has a bigger navy than anyone else... Does China cause geopolitical chaos in the world? The US stops protecting the seas for its allies, no more allies' economies. That why they're there at the Red Sea in the first place.

Ex0 said:

Yeah I don't mean that they will join us coalition, but as in they will actually apply pressure and do it for Chinese interests since 40% of shipping that goes though is Chinese. They don't seem to be doing anything or care ATM.

Kind of similar to NK maybe. They won't help USA, but they will apply pressure and even go along with sanctions for their own interests. Like not yet, but in future. This might change as Chinese companies apply pressure and Chinese gov needs to respond..

Anyone know who's paying the extra costs for shipping? Europeans? Or is Chinese also paying the price? And just what is the price for China, if any?

Click to expand...

Buyer always pays for shipping when terms are FOB which is the standard business term for Chinese export businesses. Buyer assumes all risk and cost the minute that the product leaves the seller's facility.

If you don't believe me just look at listing on Alibaba.