Chengdu next gen combat aircraft (?J-36)

00CuriousObserver

00CuriousObserver

Junior Member
Registered Member
Nx4eu said:
I remember in the early days of the J-36 first flight, wasn't there someone important who said the carets were only temporary and would be converted to DSI's later on. Something that was sort of brushed aside
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The truth might be somewhere in the middle. They had multiple designs in mind, and they also incorporated some feedback from flight tests.

Maybe it's a good idea to revisit what the trio said back during the initial flight. Yankee will write an article on this on Sunday, so also wait for that.
 
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latenlazy

Brigadier
Tomboy said:
At this point with all the chest thumping in this forum recently I'm just interested in how we actually stack up with the competition, are we truly that far ahead or are we just being overconfident. If you are so knowledgeable why don't you give us lesser folks some pointers on how exactly is this a improvement.
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“…are we truly that far ahead or are we just being overconfident. If you are so knowledgeable why don't you give us lesser folks some pointers on how exactly is this an improvement…” is the attitude of an insecure chest thumper btw.

I have been giving you quite a lot of “pointers” over the length of our interactions, including just earlier when you freaked out over the shape of the nozzle exit, and you mostly react to those “pointers” with a stinky temperament, so don’t be surprised if I don’t oblige your unearned sense of entitlement every time. In the future try not to be such a childish and insufferable presence if you want to be taken seriously here. If you don’t want to be treated like a 傻逼 don’t act like one.
 
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mack8

Junior Member
ZeEa5KPul said:
Everybody's assuming DSI for the new prototype, but are the photos clear enough to show a bump? It could be a suction mesh gizmo like the J-XDS.
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This is exactly what i believe too. Use on J-50 would have also provided useful data for what looks to be possibly a similar intake on J-36 no. 2.
 
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iewgnem

Captain
Registered Member
Tomboy said:
At this point with all the chest thumping in this forum recently I'm just interested in how we actually stack up with the competition, are we truly that far ahead or are we just being overconfident. If you are so knowledgeable why don't you give us lesser folks some pointers on how exactly is this a improvement.
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It's a bit hard to figure out how you stack up against the competition if the competition hasn't qualified for the competition yet.
I'm sure we can circle back to this if and when America actually manage to build a 6th gen okay?
 
Nx4eu

Nx4eu

Junior Member
Registered Member
Tomboy said:
I'm not sure what you are getting here? Trenched exhaust is known to offer superior IR signature and stealth, I'm not saying China must blindly copy the US to be good. It could also be simply because they could not solve technical problems with trenched exhaust system and have to resort to something less advanced.
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How exactly much is the IR reduction between the trough of the YF23 versus the 2D nozzle of the F-22, I keep hearing it's superior but by how much? Is it not possible to integrate new cooling solutions to the 2D nozzle to reduce the difference. A massive chunk of the rear of the aircraft has been removed, I wonder how much weight has been saved. The designers must have weighed the benefits of more control authority, versus how much IR reduction is lost versus how much additional weight is saved, et cetera.

Let's for one moment assume the NGAD is a delta canard with exhaust troughs, while the J-36 is a double diamond delta wing with 2D TVC. One design compromises frontal RCS in favor of superior IR, while the other design compromises IR, for superior frontal RCS. I don't want to start any arguments on Canards and RCS, this is an argument of overall design parameters, requirements, and cost benefit analysis.

You have a simple problem of tunnel visioning on one particular part of the aircraft, and not looking at the whole.
 
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latenlazy

Brigadier
Nx4eu said:
How exactly much is the IR reduction between the trough of the YF23 versus the 2D nozzle of the F-22, I keep hearing it's superior but by how much? Is it not possible to integrate new cooling solutions to the 2D nozzle to reduce the difference. A massive chunk of the rear of the aircraft has been removed, I wonder how much weight has been saved. The designers must have weighed the benefits of more control authority, versus how much IR reduction is lost versus how much additional weight is saved, et cetera.

Let's for one moment assume the NGAD is a delta canard with exhaust troughs, while the J-36 is a double diamond delta wing with 2D TVC. One design compromises frontal RCS in favor of superior IR, while the other design compromises IR, for superior frontal RCS. I don't want to start any arguments on Canards and RCS, this is an argument of overall design parameters, requirements, and cost benefit analysis.

You have a simple problem of tunnel visioning on one particular part of the aircraft, and not looking at the whole.
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His real problem that is he treats nitpicked details and features like they’re magical relics which give you stat buffs in set categories. He’s basically trying to compare these details like they’re items in an RPG video game. The real engineering don’t work like that.
 
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MeiouHades

New Member
Registered Member
@Tomboy Seriously, that is not at all how engineering works. This is a rather juvenile display and not something that most of us like to see here, please stop. We can discuss technical merits and faults until the cows come home but the fact is, we sorely lack the test and engineering data that the folks over at CAC have access to. To simply conclude that "maybe they're not able to solve the technical problems associated with wxyz...." going off of a blurry image of literally just the second prototype of an aircraft (that itself showed a rather significant difference from its first prototype) is not a good look. Let's not deny ourselves the ability to be both patient and nuanced.
 
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