09V/09VI (095/096) Nuclear Submarine Thread

antiterror13

Brigadier
China already had SSN compareable to the SSN-751. The latest 093 are at least as good as the improved LA class !

I like the statement, but quite big statement in my opinion. I think the latest 093 is better than LA class but slightly below improved LA

Type 095 is expected to be close to Virginia, slightly lower

Sub Reactor technology is one big thing that China is lacking compare to the US or British
 

Totoro

Major
VIP Professional
Construction is of subs is done in several stages but we have no info on just what part of the construction is going to be performed in which hall, to which degree. For example, some US Virginia subs started construction roughly 4 years prior to them being laid down. What laid down means for Virginias is when first two large modules get placed and mated together, forming the basis on which other large sections are joined. Of course, all the big sections are worked on nearly simultaneously through those 4 years.

Now, some work on sections may happen to some degree in a hall separate from those big halls that get most spotlight. But we don't know if all work happens there. It's also likely that, perhaps, empty hull sections get fabricated in separate halls and then transported to the southern halls where all the items, interior construction, subsystems and what not will get placed. And that would likely happen, as with Virginias, pretty much all at the same time, on all sections of the sub.

Basically, if one has a 300 meter long hall, and there is work to be done on all those sections at once, the work process make take up the entire length of the hall, for a single submarine that will in the end be 120 m long. Of course, length of the hall will not be taken up by a single sumbarine and its parts during the entire time that subsections are being worked on and furbished. Once the Sub is largely mated, and there are just months or at best a year before the sub gets launched, there will be a lot of space behind the sub. So first section or two of the next sub will be able to move in behind the completed sub.

Now we don't know if the above is the actual process. It may not be. Maybe sections get fully furbished before they move into the big halls. But in case what was described above is close to the actual process, we'd basically be looking at this: A few years of preconstruction (done in another hall), followed by a few years of joining all the parts within each section (done in the final assembly hall), followed by at most a year of joining those finished sections up and finalizing the sub.

Given that the bigger of the two southern halls seems to have 6 lanes altogether, and that the smaller seems to have 4 lanes planned, that'd suggest a few years per each lane for each sub being built. If we're indeed talking about 10 lanes, and if we're talking, say, 3 years spent in assembly hall, that's roughly 10 submarines launched in said 3 year period. Or approximately 3.6 subs per year. Or approximately one sub launched every 14 weeks.
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
I like the statement, but quite big statement in my opinion. I think the latest 093 is better than LA class but slightly below improved LA

Type 095 is expected to be close to Virginia, slightly lower

Sub Reactor technology is one big thing that China is lacking compare to the US or British
I am not so sure about that. They certainly working on it and progress has been made Not too long ago there is report that China did successfully developed a small natural circulation reactor that can supply 75% of the power requirement for the Sub . Natural circulation reactor is the thing about sub propulsion since they don't require pump for circulation. Small amount of circulation still need pump. But reactor development is time consuming just like jet engine.

But don't forget that nuclear Sub development is complex it involve not just propulsion but also hydrodynamic(hull), sensor, and weapon. fire control and battle management. China did improve type 93 incrementally toward a generational leap in Submarine design. The fact that they built the hall for mass production It should tell us that now they have the design for the next generation of Submarine
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
1. The number of years it takes the US to build a sub isn't the number of years it takes China.

2. The total number of years isn't spent in those halls. They're assembly halls - modules go in, completed submarines come out.

The analysis took two years as an illustrative example. The point is that you have to divide the number of slots by the number of years a submarine spends in those halls to get the average annual output.

The assumption is submarine module assembly take 10-12 months, as we've seen with some of the Virginias
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
Given that the bigger of the two southern halls seems to have 6 lanes altogether, and that the smaller seems to have 4 lanes planned, that'd suggest a few years per each lane for each sub being built. If we're indeed talking about 10 lanes, and if we're talking, say, 3 years spent in assembly hall, that's roughly 10 submarines launched in said 3 year period. Or approximately 3.6 subs per year. Or approximately one sub launched every 14 weeks.

Your 3 years in an assembly hall is a very bad assumption.

Virginia SSNs are assembled from 3 superblocks which can take 10-12months
Arleigh Burkes are also assembled from 3 superblocks which can take 10-12months

It's far cheaper and quicker to perform work earlier than later.

The rule of thumb (from the US) I've read is that it is cheapest to build at the module/hull fabrication stage
But if the same work has to be performed in an assembly hall, it costs 3x as much
And once the ship has been launched, that work costs 9x as much

So I stand by the previous assessment.

10 lanes which could hold 2 SSNs each. And each SSN could take as little as 1 year to assemble.
That comes to a theoretical maximum of 20 SSNs per year, which is far in excess of any conceivable level of Chinese SSN/SSBN production.
 

windsclouds2030

Senior Member
Registered Member
^Now we know why those building halls were built--to produce the high volumes of SDF comments ;)
And I already read the Popular Science's article on the new building for sub production in Huludao, Bohai Sea for how many years....and later Sutton's article on another nearby expansion... but so far no new production is going on after so many years... no known pic... perhaps China is just playing some dirty trick of psy-war to appear stronger than it's actually by erecting the new empty building... a deceiving act for posturing purpose.... who knows about this underground... errgh, I mean underwater stuffs, tho hard to apply 'seeing is believing'.

Edit: yes, some sat pics presented by Sutton to anyone's guess which type it's
 
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