PLAN Type 051B/C Class Destroyers

Discussion in 'Navy' started by supertran, Jul 11, 2006.

  1. Tam
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    Tam Senior Member
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    I don't really think a CM-302 was actually ever made, just as much of these defense exhibits. They show models of proposals, and they took this picture of a YJ-12 being fired and placed it in their display stand (CPMIEC's I believe).

    If the 051B has YJ-12, it would be the only ship in the PLAN to have this, making it a doubly unique, along with being the only one in its class. The "only" being because the entire Sovremmenny upgrade program seems to be on a limbo --- last picture of 136, shows a finished but dirty ship, still without ASMs, and still moored somewhere. The next potential upgrade might be on the 052B, if that should be confirmed.
     
  2. Bltizo
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    Bltizo Moderator
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    I imagine CM-302 is just an export version of YJ-12A and that production of it would be dependent on an order. I can't imagine it would have any kind of protracted development cycle; downgrading some of the guidance and propulsion could make it work.


    I'd be interested to know if there are any land based YJ-12 launchers that exist in service. I think it would make too much sense to not have a land based variant of this missile but who knows
     
  3. Tam
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    Tam Senior Member
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    Export missiles usually cut down on propellant, which reduces range, in exchange for a heavier warhead.

    Said to have been deployed in the Spratleys. The land based variant is supposedly YJ-12B.
     
  4. Bltizo
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    Bltizo Moderator
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    Is it? I've known that export variants are shorter ranged, but I've never seen anything convincing to suggest how that reduction was achieved, and nothing specific about exchanging propellant for a larger warhead. If you have a source for that I'd be happy to read it.


    That's what I was thinking of, but I consider it strange that we haven't seen any pictures of it before
     
  5. Viktor Jav
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    Viktor Jav Junior Member
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    Is not because that China, while not a member, adheres to the terms set out by the Missile Technology Control Regime that restricts sales of missiles with ranges of 300km and beyond to nations that don't have the capacity to built such missiles themselves ? This is a more believable stance as China has made several public statements regarding the matter.
     
  6. Tam
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    Tam Senior Member
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    Thanks to Hongjian at the CDF for finding this.

    https://lt.cjdby.net/thread-2505509-1-1.html

    The YJ-12s will stack, allowing the ship to mount as many as 16 if needed. Visitors asked the sailors about it. Note the mounting points and the official model. This makes sense if these missiles will be mounted on the Sovremmenny refits.


    211336gd42ea46bm4mduhb.jpg 213205a6omhi2ko6b0buh6 (1).jpg
     
  7. backwindow
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    backwindow New Member

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    Single barrel? They might planed it initially.
     
  8. Hendrik_2000
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    Hendrik_2000 Brigadier

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    Type 051B: When the destroyer "Shenzhen" goes to Shenzhen
    SEA
    BY
    HENRI KENHMANN
    2018-10-24
    http://www.eastpendulum.com/type-051b-quand-le-destroyer-shenzhen-se-rend-a-shenzhen

    The Chinese Destroyer 167 Shenzhen , the only Class 051B class ship, flew to Shenzhen City last week for a four-day stopover, during which the 6,600-ton building took advantage to open its doors to visitors .

    The event is all the more interesting when we know that this is the first time since its long renovation, which took place between 2015 and 2017, that Shenzhen is open to the public. Many amateurs and enthusiasts were able to speak with the officers on board during their visits, which also allowed us to learn a few new things about the "new" Type 051B .


    YJ-12A, the new but (very) expensive spearhead of Shenzhen...
    If we make a list of the most significant weapons that have been installed on the Shenzhendestroyer recently, at least those that are visible from the outside, YJ-12A supersonic anti-ship missiles are probably coming out easily.

    Sea-Sea variant of the new YJ-12 that can only be launched from heavy bombers of the Chinese Navy so far, this YJ-12A is part of a new generation of Chinese anti-ship missile with the YJ family -18, which comes in Surface-Sea, Sea-Sea, Surface-Ground and Sea-Sol versions.

    But both are still in the shadows today and no technical details have been revealed, at least not officially. One can only extrapolate the performance of the YJ-12A through its export version, the CM-302, which has degraded features in comparison. According to the CASIC designer's brochures, the CM-302 has an explosive charge of more than 250 kg and has a range of 290 km, the MTCR regime which China is one of the signatory countries obliges. with a 90% probability of hitting his target with a single missile.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Needless to say, there are many fans who have tried to find out more about the YJ-12A at open days, and to be honest they have not been disappointed. We first learn from the presentation panel that the missile is designed primarily to hit "large and medium-sized ships, as well as aircraft carriers and fleets," and the destroyer Shenzhen is the first Chinese naval ship to to be equipped. The text also highlights its "multiple methods of penetration" and its "high speed cruising"

    As for the range of the missile, the figure given orally by one of the Chinese officers on the spot is "400 km", while others have pointed out the very high price and also the very high precision (?) Of the missile, which would explain why only one YJ-12 will be fired for each target, against two with missiles of the older generation.

    As for the power of the missile, and still according to an officer on board, "If a ship of the same tonnage as Shenzhen is hit by a (YJ-12A), it will be broken in two and the ship can be immediately abandoned. there will be nothing to do.

    Other questions were also asked, such as why the ship was instead equipped with the YJ-12A instead of the YJ-18A, or why the YJ-12A was not integrated into the vertical launch system ... And for that the answer was simple and unique: "There is not enough room".

    For the record, YJ-12A launch boxes were emptied for this event, if we believe in the political commissioner of the Chinese destroyer.


    No means of additional anti-submarine warfare?
    Apart from the YJ-12A anti-ship missiles, the other major change brought by the MLU works to the Shenzhen destroyer is the provision of a 32-cell vertical launch system, the same as found on the 30 Chinese ASM frigates Type 054A.

    If the officers of the Chinese destroyer refused to indicate, probably for reasons of confidentiality, the exact model of the airborne anti-aircraft missile to know if it is the old HQ-16 or the new HQ-16C to Dual Mode headliner, we still learn that the anti-submarine missile control interface has not been installed in the Shenzhen VLS system, unlike all Type 054A frigates.

    As a result, this retrofitted destroyer can not launch Yu-8 torpedoes from its vertical cells, and the building's political commissioner, responding to visitors' questions, also pointed out that there was neither the budget nor the location necessary to install sonars towed to the stern of the ship.

    [​IMG]
    The destroyer Shenzhen has kept its original 100mm guns after the renovation.

    [​IMG]
    Shenzhen's 32-cell VLS system

    [​IMG]
     
    mys_721tx, Hyperwarp and jobjed like this.
  9. Hendrik_2000
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    Hendrik_2000 Brigadier

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    (cont)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    One of the two CIWS H / PJ-11 at 10000 rd / min rate of the Shenzhen destroyer

    Now with only light torpedo tri-tube launchers and probably still the hull sonar, the role of the newly refurbished Shenzhen destroyer seems to be oriented towards controlling the sea as before, but with an anti-sub-wing capability. navy limited and rather defensive now, which is not a problem in itself at the scale of the fleet, knowing that the vectors of anti-submarine warfare within Chinese naval forces are growing rapidly , both in number and quality.

    Henri K.
     
  10. FriedRiceNSpice
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    FriedRiceNSpice Senior Member

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    Is there a reason why these ships don't simply use YJ-18? Wouldn't it simplify logistics and maintainace as well as drive down unit costs to just have a single AShM?
     
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