AUKUS News, Views, Analysis.

[daifo]

In a way, AUKUS may appear shocking or annoying but you have to also look at the real situation. The entire landmass of East asia, central asia, middle east, africa , and europe is increasingly being connected via trade. There are people in one country closely related to people in the neighboring country, hence there are many bonds being made. If there is peace between neighbors, there will be increase economic and technology sharing activity All of these are threats to what are mainly isolated island nations like the the uk, austrailia, and the US.

 

[DarkStar]

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“In short, AUKUS not only negatively affects regional peace and stability from China’s perspective but it also appears to be a sucker deal from Washington’s perspective. So why, then, does Australia still want to do it? Behind all the beautiful but obviously hollow rhetoric of Joe Biden, the real purpose, in my view, is money. AUKUS tore apart a $66 billion existing contract involving a major ally in Europe, supplanting it with a deal worth about $100 billion for American defense contractors by replacing diesel engines with nuclear reactors. That is a lot of money, and it means a lot of jobs in Connecticut and other parts of the U.S.

Whether this deal is in the national interest of Australia or even whether these wonderful submarines will ever be delivered as promised are entirely different issues, and the current administration in Washington couldn’t care less.”

This supports the thesis that the Five Eyes function as a white anglo chauvinist organisation, yet even then this white anglo commonwealth is divided on how to live with China. You have some who are perfectly fine with China, like NZ which has been noticeably becoming less anglo and more Maori in character and diplomacy and Canada which is irrelevant in Asia- where the money and growth is.

This sub deal is basically trying to loot as much from australia back to the imperial heartland of anglo america before it is lost to Asia.

 

[tonyget]

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[ansy1968]

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@tonyget bro after being slap in the face, France now realized that the confrontational approach to China is wrong . sacre bleu,
nous sommes trompés !!!

I really like this thread, I learned a lot of French words so for all of you out there ' Puissiez-vous avoir une belle journée à venir"

 

[Sardaukar20]

China shouldn't buy anything from Russia except helicopters. Being forced to buy an important asset like SSN means admitting you are a political junior partner with a tiny GDP and weak military unworthy of respect and that needs others to lift you up like IND or AUS. It would be the ultimate humiliation for the PLAN.

The only possible case is if Russia also makes a strategic purchase from China, such as buying a 003 carrier.

Some countries are actually like that, so they buy. But China isn't. China builds.

China at this point in time doesn't truly need Russian submarine nuclear naval propulsion. Nevertheless, buying naval propulsion reactors from Russia could give China some opportunities for technology transfer and reverse engineering. Something similar to their 2015 Su-35 deal. Or the Russian assistance with their strategic early warning project.

What China could possibly want from Russia is nuclear propulsion reactor designs for large ships. Russia has something like that in their Kirov-class battlecruisers. They probably are still keeping design papers for their canceled Ulyanovsk-class CVN nuclear reactors. Russia OTOH desires more flattops. They have not yet replaced the 4 Mistral class LHDs not delivered by France. China could offer them their 075 LHDs with technology transfer for building them in Russian yards. One has large vessel nuclear propulsion technology, the other has a modern LHD design. Its not such a bad idea to cut a deal for trade.

Nevertheless all of this is very hypothetical. It still very much depends on how bad the proliferation of nuclear technology goes around the world. I suspect that India, SK, and Japan should probably want to get an AUKUS-like nuclear sub deal with the US, UK, and France. India will be highly suspect, because they are now not too happy with their last US-India nuclear deal. And a fuming France has already expressed a desire to sell more arms to India.

 

[ansy1968]

China at this point in time doesn't truly need Russian submarine nuclear naval propulsion. Nevertheless, buying naval propulsion reactors from Russia could give China some opportunities for technology transfer and reverse engineering. Something similar to their 2015 Su-35 deal. Or the Russian assistance with their strategic early warning project.

What China could possibly want from Russia is nuclear propulsion reactor designs for large ships. Russia has something like that in their Kirov class battlecruisers. They probably are still keeping design papers for their canceled Ulyanovsk class CVN reactors. Russia OTOH desires more flattops. They have not yet replaced the 4 Mistral class LHDs not delivered by France. China could offer them their 075 LHDs with technology transfer for building them in Russian yards.

Nevertheless all of this is very hypothetical. It still very much depends on how bad the proliferation of nuclear technology goes around the world. I suspect that India, SK, and Japan should probably want to get an AUKUS-like nuclear sub deal with the US, UK, and France. India will be highly suspect, because they are now not too happy with their last US-India nuclear deal. And a fuming France has already expressed a desire to sell more arms to India.

@Sardaukar20 bro totally agree, China may want to look at Russia future plans and development regarding submarine and nuclear technology, may also help by jointly develop it with Chinese money and ideas. Bro 2 minds is better than one especially with the Russian with decades of experience they may compliment each other who knows.

My concern with the help it may delay the mass production of Type 9V.

 

[Sardaukar20]

@Sardaukar20 bro totally agree, China may want to look at Russia future plans and development regarding submarine and nuclear technology, may also help by jointly develop it with Chinese money and ideas. Bro 2 minds is better than one especially with the Russian with decades of experience they may compliment each other who knows.

My concern with the help it may delay the mass production of Type 9V.

Agreed. But I don't think it'll delay the 09V construction. If the 09V is already scheduled for mass production. Then it already has a ready nuclear propulsion design.

What I'm talking about importing from Russia is large vessel nuclear reactor technology. Like those in their ice-breakers, Kirov-class battle cruisers, or their canceled Ulyanovsk-class CVN. It could help to accelerate the progress for China's own CVN program, which is still a work in progress. Ironically, such a deal is a softer violation of the NPT than the AUKUS nuclear sub deal.

 

[MrCrazyBoyRavi]

How long will it take before Australia will be 2nd biggest anglo nation by population and gdp !! Australia is huge nation with a lot of natural resources so there is ample space for population expansion as well as migration from european nation. People shouldn’t ignore Australian threat just because its GDP is small right now.

 

[Lethe]

How long will it take before Australia will be 2nd biggest anglo nation by population and gdp !! Australia is huge nation with a lot of natural resources so there is ample space for population expansion as well as migration from european nation. People shouldn’t ignore Australian threat just because its GDP is small right now.

The highest projection I have seen is for 60m people by the turn of the century, but that rather depends on maintaining the high levels of immigration that we have seen in recent decades, recently interrupted by COVID. China was one of the major sources of that immigration, and one would expect that Beijing will further discourage the movement of both people and investment to Australia going forward.

 

[daifo]

How long will it take before Australia will be 2nd biggest anglo nation by population and gdp !! Australia is huge nation with a lot of natural resources so there is ample space for population expansion as well as migration from european nation. People shouldn’t ignore Australian threat just because its GDP is small right now.

Immigration in a democratic country will likely change policies of the country. In 20 years, the attitude of the AU may completely u-turn and now they are still stuck with a $ 50(whatever the huge cost) billion nuclear sub.