Discussing Biden's Potential China Policy

[AssassinsMace]

This is the best position for China now. The EU is in shambles and the US is printing dollars like a drunk uncle.

So with China sanctioning EU so hard (the EU then started whining lol, they seemed so shocked) shows that China doesn't care for the CAI as it was from the start a gift to the EU.

Angela Merkel spent all her political capital to push this deal because she is the only smart one from all these EU moronic leaders. So if they ultimately decide to throw it away, the US would laugh all the way to the bank as they already have their Phase 1 deal

Yes if the investment agreement was just allowing Europe more access to China, then it's no big deal except to Europe that it's gone.

 

[horse]

Meh this is actually very simple.

The US is behind the scenes encouraging Ukraine to make a military move to force Russia to respond. So when Russia responds and starts attacking Ukraine then the US will start a fuss and force Germany to "protect" Ukraine.

So in this way Germany will be forced to stop the Nord Stream 2 pipeline from Russia. Thus US would have managed to stop Germany from being close to Russia and would result in Russia being isolated and more sanctions levied against it.

IMO the US is looking for a regime change in Russia.

But those guys are Nazis.

Cannot see how the Germans will support that.

I think it is going the other way.

Someone is stirring this up. Nuland "F the EU" is back. Same Nuland as always. No longer in the shadows, lol.

 

[solarz]

Meh this is actually very simple.

The US is behind the scenes encouraging Ukraine to make a military move to force Russia to respond. So when Russia responds and starts attacking Ukraine then the US will start a fuss and force Germany to "protect" Ukraine.

So in this way Germany will be forced to stop the Nord Stream 2 pipeline from Russia. Thus US would have managed to stop Germany from being close to Russia and would result in Russia being isolated and more sanctions levied against it.

IMO the US is looking for a regime change in Russia.

How exactly is Germany going to protect Ukraine? Did they grow an army while we weren't looking?

 

[voyager1]

But those guys are Nazis.

Cannot see how the Germans will support that.

I think it is going the other way.

Someone is stirring this up. Nuland "F the EU" is back. Same Nuland as always. No longer in the shadows, lol.

Don't underestimate the US influence on EU countries.

They have civilian organisations there, NGOs, US foreign policy funded think-tanks, Baltic States( new US vassals), US media invested on EU media, constant propaganda from the US to the EU.

Make no mistake, if Russia responds to Ukraine by using military (if Ukraine attacks, Russia will respond 100%) then the US will pull the strings so unbearable pressure will force Germany to stop the Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

You cant imagine how much influence the US wields on the EU. If it decides to use all of its influence(almost always it doesn't fully use it, as they prefer to use their cards only on critical situations), in my opinion Germany will fold 100%

 

[solarz]

Don't underestimate the US influence on EU countries.

They have civilian organisations there, NGOs, US foreign policy funded think-tanks, Baltic States( new US vassals), US media invested on EU media, constant propaganda from the US to the EU.

Make no mistake, if Russia responds to Ukraine by using military (if Ukraine attacks, Russia will respond 100%) then the US will pull the strings so unbearable pressure will force Germany to stop the Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

You cant imagine how much influence the US wields on the EU. If it decides to use all of its influence(almost always it doesn't fully use it, as they prefer to use their cards only on critical situations), in my opinion Germany will fold 100%

So what? Temporary cancellation of a pipeline project vs gaining half of Ukraine? Gee, that's a tough choice!

 

[voyager1]

So what? Temporary cancellation of a pipeline project vs gaining half of Ukraine? Gee, that's a tough choice!

Nope. I have heard some ideas from some US analysts where they proposed a "compromise" of halting gas supplies from Russia if Magnitsky Act sanctions are applied to Russia due to "human rights abuses" = Alexei Navalny

So you see how US wants to play the game. They start with maximum demands of halting the pipeline (impossible) but it will them compromise to, if human rights abuses happen then stop buying Russian gas.

And in this way Germany will be trapped because then the US could at any moment use its influence on the EU(media, NGOs, propaganda etc) to force Germany to stop Russian supplies whenever US wishes to do so.

I admit that this is an excellent plan which if accomplished, then Germany would be severy restrained with the US having a switch button on their hand

 

[solarz]

Nope. I have heard some ideas from some US analysts where they proposed a "compromise" of halting gas supplies from Russia if Magnitsky Act sanctions are applied to Russia due to "human rights abuses" = Alexei Navalny

So you see how US wants to play the game. They start with maximum demands of halting the pipeline (impossible) but it will them compromise to, if human rights abuses happen then stop buying Russian gas.

And in this way Germany will be trapped because then the US could at any moment use its influence on the EU(media, NGOs, propaganda etc) to force Germany to stop Russian supplies whenever US wishes to do so.

I admit that this is an excellent plan which if accomplished, then Germany would be severy restrained with the US having a switch button on their hand

Again, so what?

If Russia actually starts a war with Ukraine, instead of using the rebel proxies, and I'm not saying they're planning to do so right now, then they would only do so after preparing for the consequences.

The only leverage the West holds over Russia is their purchase of Russian energy. Guess who else needs energy and sits right beside the Russian border?

It's no coincidence that Lavrov is saying tough things like destroying Ukraine (should they start a war) shortly after the China-Russia meeting.

 

[voyager1]

Again, so what?

If Russia actually starts a war with Ukraine, instead of using the rebel proxies, and I'm not saying they're planning to do so right now, then they would only do so after preparing for the consequences.

The only leverage the West holds over Russia is their purchase of Russian energy. Guess who else needs energy and sits right beside the Russian border?

It's no coincidence that Lavrov is saying tough things like destroying Ukraine (should they start a war) shortly after the China-Russia meeting.

Well obviously I am talking this from US's point of view, that they want to isolate Russia from Europe.

I think we all understand that the Russia-China meeting sent the signal that China will have Russia's back. This will accelerate Russia's turn to the East (China)

 

[BoraTas]

Again, so what?

If Russia actually starts a war with Ukraine, instead of using the rebel proxies, and I'm not saying they're planning to do so right now, then they would only do so after preparing for the consequences.

The only leverage the West holds over Russia is their purchase of Russian energy. Guess who else needs energy and sits right beside the Russian border?

It's no coincidence that Lavrov is saying tough things like destroying Ukraine (should they start a war) shortly after the China-Russia meeting.

It is pretty much exactly like you said. The West simply failed utterly in managing its relationship with Russia. We are back to 1948. In the interconnected world of the 21st century it shouldn't have ended up like this.

 

[j17wang]

So what? Temporary cancellation of a pipeline project vs gaining half of Ukraine? Gee, that's a tough choice!

You nailed it. Russia lost 25% of its people to defeat European conquerors during the last world war, and a good chuck of those survivors are still alive. Russian people are still taught DAILY the sacrifices of the motherland, if the west thinks that Russia for a second will be cowed by a lost gas pipeline vs getting half of Ukraine, well lets just say the West should have invested more on Russian studies for its diplomat corps. TBH, my only regret is Russia never purchased even a token component of land systems from China. It would be helpful to see how some of these assets perform against opponents.