Chinese semiconductor industry

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TD739

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They can be purchased for study and dissection or short-term use until SMEE's lithographs are ready but never as a true alternate to domestic machines. The Chinese government should require a license to import this and make it clear to all who wish to apply. This is a mistake that, if made, would be a blunder of the lowest IQ levels.

Even SMEE is ready, ASML could still offer low price due to its matured product and initial investment already recouped.
What made you think China government would do that to a Dutch firm? US government slaughtering Chinese firms yet Chinese government acting scared and idn't go after US firms or setup obstacles for them.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
What made you think China government would do that to a Dutch firm? US government slaughtering Chinese firms yet Chinese government acting scared and idn't go after US firms.
Isn't China known for dissecting foreign stuff to learn from them?

Reread post 887 Chinese semiconductor industry. Your definition of "slaughter" may be an English issue. For something to be slaughtered, it has to be dead. Just like when Deino banned your account, he didn't "rape" you; that word also means something else. People with low IQ always interpret silence and reserve as fear but people who understand the situation see that the instigator, the one who is attacking, is doing so out of fear and desperation. That is the driving force behind the Thucydides' trap. American firms like Whatsapp, Yahoo, Google are already banned in China. China went after them before the US even started the tech war because China identified them as threats. Going after firms that aren't threats is a digression.
 
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j17wang

Senior Member
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China should no longer sit back and watch their companies get banned on flimsy grounds. Swedish companies like Ikea, H&M etc make lot of money in China , its time they get kicked out. Chinas meek response to Huawei getting banned is encouraging other countries to follow suit.

No need for formal ban, just let every chinese consumer know who they are supporting when they go into an Ikea, H&M. Also does not make sense to ban Erricson, they still make a good product, and I am sure Huawei learns a thing or two by letting them continue to operate in China.
 

ansy1968

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What if ASML offer similar machine at much lower price?

I heard there lacking of high power 30kw or above CO2 laser needed for EUV in China unless you want to buy from Japan. Until that's settled not sure time table means anything
Hi TD739,

Yup, as WTAN and SKYWATCHER had explain the main problem is the power source. it is using DPP at 125W, it can make do but is Inefficient a 70 sheet per exposure compare to ASML 140 sheet. they are waiting for a LPP power source and for that we need info regarding the progress from WTAN.

As you can see all the rumors that posted here had come true, I believe the timetable will be achieve cause there is an urgency, CIMP will get a lot of resources and help for all state institution. It will be a Chinese version of a Manhattan project.
 

TD739

Junior Member
Registered Member
Isn't China known for dissecting foreign stuff to learn from them?

Reread post 887 Chinese semiconductor industry. Your definition of "slaughter" may be an English issue. For something to be slaughtered, it has to be dead. People with low IQ always interpret silence and reserve as fear but people who understand the situation see that the instigator, the one who is attacking, is doing so out of fear and desperation. American firms like Whatsapp, Yahoo, Google are already banned in China. China went after them before the US even started the tech war because China identified them as threats. Going after firms that aren't threats is a digression.

Just to emphasize my point that the Chinese government is too scared to act when its firms are being hurted .
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
Just to emphasize my point that the Chinese government is too scared to act when its firms are being hurted .
M'kay I see once again, you've got nothing left but to repeat short phrases you can't defend so I'll just quote myself from 887:

"Changing accounts to say the same things won't make them true, Bo. Shouting matches and one-ups don't determine the victor; results determine the victor and never has Chinese tech been as close a peer to American tech nor has it been moving as fast as it is today. Xi JinPing could not spur Chinese tech innovation alone; he warned on the need for self-reliance and he invested money but Chinese firms took that money and did little to no work, in the worst case using it to buy foreign tech and scrubbing off the logos to pass of as domestic ones. Trump's tech war is what it took to finally move them off their lazy greedy corporate behinds and to start really investing in the technology that China lacks. While this tech war may be a death sentence for smaller countries, it's more of an opportunity than an attack for China because this is what it takes to awaken Chinese innovation, the largest innovative force in the world. You have a man with his head buried in his work to overcome all of his own weaknesses confused with someone who is timid and shy just because he's not running his mouth and trying to attack others. Investment and growth in China is what the US is trying to stop, so the best response to American actions is to find which technological areas America fears most and develop them. America already knows that it can't out-grow China so its last resort is sabotage, which is always an uphill battle. China doesn't need to waste energy on its own uphill battle; it can arrange all of its strength around its own growth. And the result of that is that Chinese firms are developing their own technology where they used to rely on foreign/American providers. If you think that vying for self-sufficiency at the cost of bleeding some profits is being slaughtered, then you are for more capitalistic and short-sighted in your thinking than anyone you can accuse."

And 892:
"Your definition of "slaughter" may be an English issue. For something to be slaughtered, it has to be dead. Just like when Deino banned your account, he didn't "rape" you; that word also means something else. People with low IQ always interpret silence and reserve as fear but people who understand the situation see that the instigator, the one who is attacking, is doing so out of fear and desperation. That is the driving force behind the Thucydides' trap. American firms like Whatsapp, Yahoo, Google are already banned in China. China went after them before the US even started the tech war because China identified them as threats. Going after firms that aren't threats is a digression."
 

TD739

Junior Member
Registered Member
Hi TD739,

Yup, as WTAN and SKYWATCHER had explain the main problem is the power source. it is using DPP at 125W, it can make do but is Inefficient a 70 sheet per exposure compare to ASML 140 sheet. they are waiting for a LPP power source and for that we need info regarding the progress from WTAN.

As you can see all the rumors that posted here had come true, I believe the timetable will be achieve cause there is an urgency, the State institution CIMP will get a lot of resources and help for all state institution. It will be a Chinese version of a Manhattan project.
DPP is not meant for commerical. It's experimental thing for proof of concept.
Chinese research institute used DPP for the exact reason of no high power laser available for LPP. If they the high power laser they wouldn't use DPP, its inferior.
 

TD739

Junior Member
Registered Member
M'kay I see you've got nothing left but to repeat short phrases you can't defend so I'll just quote myself from 887:

"Changing accounts to say the same things won't make them true, Bo. Shouting matches and one-ups don't determine the victor; results determine the victor and never has Chinese tech been as close a peer to American tech nor has it been moving as fast as it is today. Xi JinPing could not spur Chinese tech innovation alone; he warned on the need for self-reliance and he invested money but Chinese firms took that money and did little to no work, in the worst case using it to buy foreign tech and scrubbing off the logos to pass of as domestic ones. Trump's tech war is what it took to finally move them off their lazy greedy corporate behinds and to start really investing in the technology that China lacks. While this tech war may be a death sentence for smaller countries, it's more of an opportunity than an attack for China because this is what it takes to awaken Chinese innovation, the largest innovative force in the world. You have a man with his head buried in his work to overcome all of his own weaknesses confused with someone who is timid and shy just because he's not running his mouth and trying to attack others. Investment and growth in China is what the US is trying to stop, so the best response to American actions is to find which technological areas America fears most and develop them. America already knows that it can't out-grow China so its last resort is sabotage, which is always an uphill battle. China doesn't need to waste energy on its own uphill battle; it can arrange all of its strength around its own growth. And the result of that is that Chinese firms are developing their own technology where they used to rely on foreign/American providers. If you think that vying for self-sufficiency at the cost of bleeding some profits is being slaughtered, then you are for more capitalistic and short-sighted in your thinking than anyone you can accuse. "
Babbling senselessly. Ignored.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
Babbling senselessly. Ignored.
Yes, you do as always. However, you should note that just as your understanding of "slaughter" and "rape" are incorrect, your definition of "babble senselessly" is also wrong. It does not mean to write at a level beyond your reading comprehension while providing points that you cannot rebut. It is much closer to "repeating short phrases you can't defend."

And you do a great job of "ignoring" ;) Any better and it'll catch up to your "skill" in debate LOL
 
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TD739

Junior Member
Registered Member
DPP is not meant for commerical. It's experimental thing for proof of concept.
Chinese research institute used DPP for the exact reason of no high power laser available for LPP. If they the high power laser they wouldn't use DPP, its inferior.
Hi TD739,

Yup, as WTAN and SKYWATCHER had explain the main problem is the power source. it is using DPP at 125W, it can make do but is Inefficient a 70 sheet per exposure compare to ASML 140 sheet. they are waiting for a LPP power source and for that we need info regarding the progress from WTAN.

As you can see all the rumors that posted here had come true, I believe the timetable will be achieve cause there is an urgency, CIMP will get a lot of resources and help for all state institution. It will be a Chinese version of a Manhattan project.
A startup project for LPP

科技大学 教授 , 武汉 CW laser 合作 试图设计和制造中国首个大功率30KW(峰值功率)20纳秒脉冲宽度,频率为100kHz, 它的应用是用于极紫外光刻. 我们在武汉有生产基地。欢迎来参观

它的构建块基于对SCP4000 CO2 快速横向流动激光的增强, SCP4000 是 武汉 CW laser 产品. 新产品命名为 SCP10000. 连续波最大激光输出为10,000瓦. 为了获得纳秒级的脉冲宽度范围,将需要一台种子激光器,它将驱动多个SCP10000.

SCP10000 将用作激光放大器. 4个SCP10000将连续排列. 最终激光峰值功率输出为30kW.

为了实现中国第一台极紫外光刻所需的纳秒脉冲宽度的高功率激光器原型,用于制造7纳米及以下

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