055 DDG Large Destroyer Thread

[asif iqbal]

big boys with two smaller boys

 

[Gloire_bb]

At most, it will be a missile as large as the SM-3 or SM-6, both of which are huge missiles.

Chinese full-length cells are notably bigger than mk. 41 ones.
Why not?

 

[by78]

It wont be a DF-21. It will be a big missile, but not anything close to a DF-21. Remember the limitations of cell-length and diameter. At most, it will be a missile as large as the SM-3 or SM-6, both of which are huge missiles. And if the US has no problem with their infra-red signature when they inevitably launch hundreds of them in any fight against an opponent like China or Russia who have space based detection assets, China as well wont have any problems with the Type 055 launching missiles of similiar size and IR-emissions.

As far as we know, this sort of missile could actually be less visible than SM-3/6s because its warhead would be an unpowered glider after its booster seperation phase.

The VLS cells on 055 have significantly greater volume – 60% or more – than the strike version Mk.41 cells from which SM-3 or SM-6 are launched. The mid-ship cells on 055 likely have lengths of up to 9m, with a cell width of 0.85m. So no, it won't fit a DF-21, but it can most certainly accomodate something that almost dwarfs SM-6. A shipborne AsBM would likely be a relatively clean-sheet design, especially for the booster component. The payload could either be a glider or a downsized maneuverable warhead adapted from existing AsBM designs. Naturally, a glider would likely give greater range than a maneuverable warhead. They might get 500 to 600km or more of powered flight out of the missile, which seems low compared to DF-21 or DF-26, but remember that 055 will essentially serve as the first stage of the booster by sailing past the first and/or second island chains to deliver the payload. IMO, China has to be working on a shipborne AsBM; it'd be absolutely confounding and uncharacteristic if they weren't. For what is worth, the

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China is working on an AsBM for Type 055.

 

[Tam]

The VLS cells on 055 have significantly greater volume – 60% or more – than the strike version Mk.41 cells from which SM-3 or SM-6 are launched. The mid-ship cells on 055 likely have lengths of up to 9m, with a cell width of 0.85m. So no, it won't fit a DF-21, but it can most certainly accomodate something that almost dwarfs SM-6. A shipborne AsBM would likely be a relatively clean-sheet design, especially for the booster component. The payload could either be a glider or a downsized maneuverable warhead adapted from existing AsBM designs. Naturally, a glider would likely give greater range than a maneuverable warhead. They might get 500 to 600km or more of powered flight out of the missile, which seems low compared to DF-21 or DF-26, but remember that 055 will essentially serve as the first stage of the booster by sailing past the first and/or second island chains to deliver the payload. IMO, China has to be working on a shipborne AsBM; it'd be absolutely confounding and uncharacteristic if they weren't. For what is worth, the

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China is working on an AsBM for Type 055.

That should not be surprising. Most likely it would start with a VLS launched version derived from the CM400AKG or land launced CM401.

In the interim, an HQ-9 with an active radar seeker can turned into a secondary antiship missile.

 

[Temstar]

Since we're talking about the VLS a lot I figure I'll post this, not sure if it's posted before in this thread:



So options currently for Type-055 VLS:

1. YJ18 AShM, cold CCL
2. HQ16 medium range SAM, hot CCL
3. HQ9 long range SAM, cold CCL
4. DK10 SAM, hot CCL multi-pack
5. YU8 rocket propelled torpedo, hot CCL
6. CJ10 LACM, cold CCL
7. YJ83 AShM, hot CCL

I thought there's a YJ18 version that's LACM that's also compatible for 055 but I could be wrong. The fact that concentric canister launch supports both hot and cold launch is amazing.

 

[Tam]

Since we're talking about the VLS a lot I figure I'll post this, not sure if it's posted before in this thread:

View attachment 63313

So options currently for Type-055 VLS:

1. YJ18 AShM, cold CCL
2. HQ16 medium range SAM, hot CCL
3. HQ9 long range SAM, cold CCL
4. DK10 SAM, hot CCL multi-pack
5. YU8 rocket propelled torpedo, hot CCL
6. CJ10 LACM, cold CCL
7. YJ83 AShM, hot CCL

I thought there's a YJ18 version that's LACM that's also compatible for 055 but I could be wrong. The fact that concentric canister launch supports both hot and cold launch is amazing.

YJ-18 LACM, probably under a DH or CJ designation instead, would simply be a YJ-18 without the terminal rocket stage. Instead the cruise missile flight stage would extend into a full solid section with fuel, guidance system and warhead. This would be snub nosed and shorter than the YJ-18 ASM, so it will fit within the 7m length cells. The missile would be purely subsonic. It would also be possible to create a purely subsonic YJ-18 ASM out of this, so its basically like a TASM or YJ-62.

Of the list, I would say, missiles like the DK-10, YU-8, HQ-16, CJ-10, and YJ-83 are not verified with the U-VLS, even if you can fit them. It may simply mean the PLAN has no intention of using these missiles on this VLS or this ship, not because of any technical limitation.

Instead of the YU-8, what I think is another YJ-18 variation, where instead of the terminal rocket stage, the second stage is now a torpedo. This is similar to the antisubmarine Kalibr or the Yu-11. Its like a torpedo strapped to the YJ-18 booster and flight section.

 

[by78]

A newly released satellite image taken a month ago, showing three 055s and one 052D under construction at Dalian shipyard. Sharing it here because it nicely shows of the size difference between the two classes.

 

[asif iqbal]

What a clear photo from space ? Thats just unbelievable !!

why couldn't see get this type of photo when we had the 2 x Type 055 + Type 052DL in there

those blurry photos kept us guessing for months

shame its now half empty and soon will be full empty

This dock has done well giving us

7 x Type 052D/L + 4 x Type 055 in the last 5 years

thats over 100,000 tons of warships or 25% of the entire tonnage of the Royal Navy from one shipyard

 

[SAC]

When looking at anti-aircraft carrier missions, you do not actually need to sink the carrier, merely rendering it hors de combat will likely be sufficient to achieve the mission. This is of course influenced by the duration of a conflict, where a longer duration conflict may allow the carrier to return to service. In the past, a torpedo into the rudder was one such approach. Now, it appears as though China can also achieve this outcome by means of a ballistic missile. When looking at a potential ship-launched anti-ship ballistic missile, the missile does not need to have a large unitary warhead, but rather submunitions similar in concept to a runway denial weapon. I recall an image some years ago of an anti-ship ballistic missile test displaying the distribution of submunition detonations with an overlay of a carrier’s flight deck. Unfortunately, I can no longer find it.

 

[palejade]

When looking at anti-aircraft carrier missions, you do not actually need to sink the carrier, merely rendering it hors de combat will likely be sufficient to achieve the mission.

People often lose track of the bigger picture. To stop the aircraft from operating from a carrier it may be easier to pick on a softer target - the fuel replenishment ships. Stop them from getting to the carrier and it will run out of aviation fuel ... eventually.