Hong-Kong Protests

Gatekeeper

Brigadier
Registered Member
This may be closer to the truth. I take for granted that the Western dirty-tricks people have always had something subversive planned for China.

The brainwashing may not last forever. The Soviets undoubtedly tried to educate their children in what they considered the "right way", but when the kids grew up they still dumped the USSR. Similarly, when the Hong Kong economy deteriorates so much that the decay is undeniable -- especially when compared to Shenzhen, next door -- I think the sensible Hong Kongers will be sensible.

I'm not attacking you; I just think this is an interesting point to discuss.

No probs, this is what debating is all about, we all have opinions, mine might be as wrong or right as the next man!

And you maybe right, and I hope you are with regard to your analogy of the Soviets. However, I would say the Soviets is a unique case. It's very rarely we see an economy collapsed so deep and so fast! When that happens, I think it will change the minds of the most extreme radicals.

So as I can't foresee Hong Kong will repeat the Soviets experience anytime soon. These radicals having had over 20 years of radicalisation will not abandon their cause like those people from the Soviets times!
 
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Gatekeeper

Brigadier
Registered Member
Nothing wrong with re-education centres
Better than slave labour at US prison system
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There you have it, that one sentence showed how powerful the western MSM has been! Mentioning "re-education" camp proved the power of the MSM.

I noticed when I was reading the "terrorist" that was killed at point blank range whilst laying on the ground! The MSM made a big thing about how he had, after serving a prison term for "planning an attack" had went through....... wait for it.......

A DE-RADICALISATION program! Lol

So if in the west, its a de-radicalisation camp, and its a good thing. But if its in China, its a "Xinjiang type" "re-education" camp! and its a bad thing! Lol
 

Xizor

Captain
Registered Member
Neo Nazis is on the resurgent side in Europe ( especially the Eastern Europe). Skinheads are rearing their ugly heads ever more.
There seems to be neo-nazis in Czech Republic too. Very popular among neck-beards and basement dwelling incels, I guess. And they seem to be against the liberals and feminist movements. It is interesting to see the dynamics between the neo-nazis of different countries.
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Neo-nazis are very anti-communist. But apart from that they are basically a white supremacist collective who had reformed their racial identity and supremacist ideology from a pure germanic one to encompass everything "white". That means, in these day and age, anyone who looks the part. Slavs, Italians, Greeks and hell...even Spaniards (Iberians) are welcome. This is in stark contrast to the situation 70 years ago where all of these people were termed subhuman.

During the National Socialist ascendance during the 1930s, Hitler and his cronies cooked up a racial superiority narrative to garner better support and establish a new order. That is all well known. But what is not so known is the relation Nazis ( Germanic peoples) had with Slavic people. The German invasion of Czechoslovakia was based on the narrative that the ethnic eastern-german minority of Sudetenland was living under "discomfort" and subjugation of the Slavs of Czech. The original Nazis seeked to help their German brothers from the Western Slavic domination.
Ukrainian flirtation with Nazi Germany is very famous. Their mistrust for Russians are legendary. The Holodomor under the USSR and the belief that Stalin did it to quash the ukranian nationalists opposition to USSR was fresh in their minds when they flirted with the Nazis. Alas, they realized that they would never be equals to the Germanic people and they were second class citizens under the nazis.There was a drastic change of minds soon enough.
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Fast track forward, the new Slavic skinheads have become neo-nazis by projecting the superiority of Slavs. It is irony to the level 7. Seems like a fault of shoddy history classes and education. Nazism isn't Germanic superiority anymore. It is cross border white superiority that looks at melanin levels and roughly similar cranial features as identification tools.

Hong Kongers, who despite being from a top-tier city, has displayed quite grandiosely their ignorance of history and are bedfellows with Neo-Nazis. They are desperate for support. They don't care if it is Hitler/ Baghdadi/Osama Bin Laden who offers them support. They shall welcome it with open arms. Disgusting levels of naivety.
 

Nutrient

Junior Member
Registered Member
You based your argument on a simple "observation" that is "that lots of people are avoiding recent protests and and nearly all of them have NOT been showing up in recent protests which is refuted by the fact that 12/8 rally is one of the biggest rallies, maybe not top 5 rallies but at least one of the top 10 biggest rallies.

The shortage of protesters was only part of my argument. My fundamental objection is to what you wrote:

The problem is not about the votes. The problem is that the HK people have spoken. And they are supporting the rioters which gave the rioters legitimacy. That would embolden and encourage the rioters to take extreme measures. Either the central government caves or they would face months or even years of unrest in HK.

By saying "the Hong Kong people have spoken ... And they are supporting the rioters" you were implying that a majority of the people are supporting the cockroaches.

The Dec 8 demonstration, in which less than 3 percent of Hong Kong's people showed up, does not prove your assertion. In fact, it lends weight to my position, which is that most Hong Kongers (maybe 97 percent) reject the violence.
 

Nutrient

Junior Member
Registered Member
20 000 is more than enough for a civil war.

Only luck of HK is China has control above the sea, so the Capitol cant shift the situation to civil war by shipping heavy weapons to the rioters. (like in Syria )

The key factor is that the cockroaches can't infiltrate the mainland and destroy much there. Perhaps they could do a trivial amount of damage in an afternoon excursion from Hong Kong, but they are far too few to do much, and they would be arrested in short order.

The point is that they are NOT guerrillas, able to hide among the mainland people as fish can hide in water (Mao Zedong). Nearly all mainlanders reject the cockroaches and will send the police after them. And the mainland police have not been disempowered.

Beijing can let the cockroaches ruin Hong Kong, knowing that the CIA poison cannot spread to mainland China.
 

KYli

Brigadier
The shortage of protesters was only part of my argument. My fundamental objection is to what you wrote:

By saying "the Hong Kong people have spoken ... And they are supporting the rioters" you were implying that a majority of the people are supporting the cockroaches.

The Dec 8 demonstration, in which less than 3 percent of Hong Kong's people showed up, does not prove your assertion. In fact, it lends weight to my position, which is that most Hong Kongers (maybe 97 percent) reject the violence.

You can spin all you want but your observation is wrong and that is a fact. All of your previous argument is based upon a simple observation that "nearly all of them have NOT been showing up in recent protests." As this observation has proven wrong, then you don't have anything to support your argument. Which I have argued many times that it is not a good indication since there are so many variables. As for 97% of the Hkers reject violence, you seriously think this statement can hold any water. This kind of statement only makes you look bad.

That's what I said all along. I have been saying many times that voting for the pan-Dems camp is equal to voting for the rioters. Hong Kongers knew that the pan-Dems camp has supported the rioters and never condemned violence. That means that the majority of the Hong Kong voters take the rioters side. I don't know what is not so unclear about my statement.
 

KYli

Brigadier
Both Joshua Wong and Fang Zhongxian have condemned Taiwan for refusing to do more to help the rioters who flee to Taiwan. I believe this would significantly weaken the radicals as many of them thought they could avoid prosecution as Taiwan and other countries would take them in open arm.

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Taiwan’s main opposition party has seized on President Tsai Ing-wen’s refusal to implement a long-delayed refugee bill that would allow Hong Kong protesters fleeing arrest in the city to settle on the island.

The Kuomintang (KMT) has raised the issue ahead of next month’s presidential election to attack Tsai, accusing her of “lying” about her support for the pro-democracy protests to win votes.

Last week, Hong Kong student representatives, including Baptist University Student Union president Keith Fong Chung-yin, visited the self-ruled island to lobby government representatives for greater measures to protect Hong Kong residents looking to settle there long-term, including speeding up passage of the refugee bill.

It is estimated that about 200 Hong Kong protesters have arrived in Taiwan to avoid arrest since the anti-extradition protests began in June, with many staying on short-term tourist visas that last for a maximum of 30 days but can be extended.

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Fang Zhongxian scolds the Taiwan Democratic Progressive Party: use Hong Kong people's blood for votes


The Taiwan Affairs Commission has stated that it doesn't encouraged to come to Taiwan illegally.

As Anti-extradition bill demonstration conflicts continue. HK college student union organized a delegation to Taiwan earlier this month, hoping that Taiwan will pass the Refugee Law as soon as possible to help Hong Kong youth protesters who fled to the local area to seek political asylum. Later, President Tsai Ing-wen of Taiwan stated that "the Refugee Act is not needed at this stage."

Fang Zhongxian, president of the Student Union of the Baptist University, recently published a criticism on a social platform. If the DPP only talks about supporting the protests of Hong Kong people without specific measures, it is inevitable that the DPP is suspected of only using the blood of Hong Kong people in exchange for Taiwanese vote. In addition, there have been reports that more than 200 Hong Kong demonstrators have fled to Taiwan. The Taiwan Affairs Commission emphasizes that it absolutely discouraged to come to Taiwan through illegal channels and calls for no law breaking.

Fang Zhongxian posted on Facebook a few days ago that he believes that Taiwan needs to help Hong Kong. In addition to human rights issues, there are also "Hong Kong today, Taiwan tomorrow". He said that in the face of the threat of the Communist Party of China, Taiwanese rescue Hong Kong people is a necessary obligation and strategic policy "If Hong Kong falls, Taiwan will be completely isolated from the Chinese free world."

Fang Zhongxian posted on Facebook a few days ago that he believes that Taiwan needs to help Hong Kong. In addition to human rights issues, there are also "Hong Kong today, Taiwan tomorrow". He said that in the face of the threat of the Communist Party of China, Taiwanese rescue Hong Kong people is a necessary obligation and strategic policy. "If Hong Kong falls, Taiwan will be completely isolated from the Chinese free world."

He emphasized that rebellion against totalitarianism must have a clear banner, and reiterated that the Taiwan government was required to establish the Refugee Law and amend Article 18 of the Hong Kong-Macao Relations Regulations. He hoped that there would be a clear mechanism to assist politically persecuted people in Hong Kong. When Hong Kong people are killed in Taiwan, they have no way to ask for help. "We in Hong Kong just want a clear commitment from the Taiwanese government. It's simple," he said.

Fang Zhongxian believes that the Taiwan government's low-key handling of Hong Kong people's asylum cases can of course relieve the complicated problems of administrative legislation and avoid controversy. However, at the moment of the Taiwan election, if the DPP only speaks in support of the protests of the Hong Kong people, without specific measures to support the Hong Kong protesters, "it is inevitable that the DPP would only want to use the blood of Hong Kong people in exchange for Taiwan Suspected of being voted. "

Fang re-posted last night, stating that Hong Kong people and Taiwanese must stop infighting and support each other. The Taiwan Affairs Commission emphasizes: against Illegal way to come to Taiwan

方仲賢斥台灣民進黨:用港人鮮血換選票

台陸委會曾表示,不鼓勵非法來台。

反修例示威衝突持續,有大專學生會本月初組團遠赴台灣,希望台灣盡快通過《難民法》,助逃往當地、曾參與反修例的港青示威者尋求政治庇護,卻遭當地政府冷待,台灣的蔡英文總統及後表明「現階段不需要《難民法》」。

浸會大學學生會會長方仲賢日前在社交平台發文批評,若民進黨只口講支持港人抗爭,無具體措施條文支持,難免令人聯想到民進黨涉嫌只想用港人鮮血來換取台灣人選票。另外,就有報道指逾二百名香港示威者潛逃台灣,陸委會強調絕對不鼓勵經由非法途徑來台,呼籲切勿犯法。

方仲賢日前在facebook發文,認為台灣要幫助香港的原因,除了涉及人權問題,還有「今日香港,明日台灣」,他說面對中共武統威脅,台灣人救援香港人是必要之義務及戰略方針,「假若香港淪陷,台灣就會喺華人自由世界入面被徹底孤立。」

他強調,反抗極權要旗幟鮮明,重申要求台灣政府立《難民法》及修改《港澳關係條例》第十八條,是希望有明確機制接濟香港受政治逼害人士,又稱如沒有任何相關指引,港人遇難到台灣便求助無門。他說:「我哋香港人只係希望要台灣政府一個明確嘅承諾咁簡單而已。」

方仲賢認為,台灣政府低調處理港人來台避難案件,當然可以免除行政立法的繁複問題及迴避言論。不過,目前正值台灣大選,如若民進黨只口講支持香港人抗爭,而無具體措施條文支持香港抗爭者,「難免令人聯想到民進黨有只想用香港人嘅鮮血嚟換取台灣人嘅選票之嫌」。

方昨晚再發文,指香港人與台灣人一定要停止內訌,互相扶持。陸委會:不鼓勵非法方式來台

另外,美國《紐約時報》早前報道指有超過二百名香港示威者因擔心當局秋後算帳,以及未能獲得公平審訊,決定潛逃到台灣暫避。

陸委會昨日回應,港澳居民若因政治因素向台灣請求援助,按「港澳條例」現行法規架構下已有處理機制。

陸委會重申支持港人爭取自由、民主及人權,也關心香港的發展,但台灣是一個法治社會,台灣政府絕對不鼓勵任何人透過非法途徑來台。對於以非合法方式來台者,包括本人與協助來台者,除了需要面臨刑事責任追究,也有安全上的極大風險與疑慮,呼籲相關人士不要鋌而走險。

台灣競爭力論壇執行長謝明輝接受中通社訪問時亦分析,非法到台人士一經發現,將依照「移民法」遣返香港,沒有任何部門可以收留他們。他認為蔡英文在台灣大選期間將對偷渡者「睜一隻眼閉一隻眼」,因目前反修例風波還能發揮餘熱,但大選過後,偷渡者再無利用價值,更存在「反動」基因,他估計最後無論何人當選,都會按「移民法」將非法入境者移送出境。據悉,有台灣律師稱,暫時未有任何港人政治庇護申請獲得批准。
 

KYli

Brigadier
Not sure what the radicals want to achieve with these bombs except senseless killings, which can be designated as terrorism.

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Hong Kong bombs: school where IEDs were found claims there is no evidence linking devices to students or staff
  • Wah Yan College opens as normal on Tuesday as students begin end-of-term exams
  • Explosives were found underneath building accessible to public on Monday
The school where two bombs were found on Monday claimed there was no evidence linking the devices to any members of the school, as students sat their exams as scheduled on Tuesday morning.

Late on Monday, bomb disposal officers
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containing 10kg (22lb) of high-grade explosives at the Wah Yan College Hong Kong campus on Queen’s Road East in Wan Chai. A school cleaner spotted the bomb under a building supported by pillars on a slope at about 5.30pm Monday.

“The site where the bombs were uncovered belonged to the school, but it is an open area outside the gates that can be accessed by the public,” the school said in a statement.

So Ying-lun, an assistant supervisor at the school, said they had “not found any evidence pointing at teachers or students responsible for placing or making the bomb”, but said the area the devices were found in was not covered by security cameras.

According to police, the two explosive devices contained two different types of explosives, and had a range of up to 50 to 100 metres (164 to 328 feet).

So admitted he was shocked and concerned when police alerted the school about bombs on campus.

“As far as we know, the police closed off nearby roads last night and conducted a thorough inspection. They lifted the cordon before midnight. So we believe the campus is safe,” So said.

A Form Six student surnamed Law said he passed by the area the bombs were found several times on Monday.

“I was a bit worried because the bomb was placed right in the school,” he said.

But Chan, 13, a Form One student who declined to give his full name, suspected the bomb could have been planted by outsiders as the campus sits on a hill surrounded by public roads.

“I don’t think any of our students could do such a thing,” Chan said.

A student in Form Three, known as Tsang, said he learned a bomb had been found on campus through social media on Monday night.

“I’m not too worried to go to school today, at least the bombs were removed.” he said. “I don’t think our students made [the bombs].”

7087cc02-1aec-11ea-8971-922fdc94075f_1320x770_114527.jpg


A father who was dropping his son off at school by car said there was an online notice last night assuring parents the school was safe.

“It should be safe. I will also come to pick up my son after his exam,” the father, who gave his surname as Hon, said.

The school’s spokesman said students from Form One to Form Five would sit their end-of-semester exams on Tuesday, while Form Six students would carry on with their classes. Both are expected to end by 1.10pm.

Over the past six months, Hong Kong has been rocked by an anti-government movement sparked by the now-withdrawn extradition bill, with increasingly violent clashes between protesters and police.

On Sunday, the Court of Final Appeal in Central and the High Court in Admiralty were
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. Weapons
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, three daggers, knives and 105 bullets were also seized before the rally started. Since June, police have arrested 6,022 people aged between 11 and 84 over offences related to the protests. Of the arrestees, 2,392 are students.Police also found more than 10,000 petrol bombs at several universities in November after protesters barricaded themselves on campuses and fought police.
 
Not sure what the radicals want to achieve with these bombs except senseless killings, which can be designated as terrorism.

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Hong Kong bombs: school where IEDs were found claims there is no evidence linking devices to students or staff
  • Wah Yan College opens as normal on Tuesday as students begin end-of-term exams
  • Explosives were found underneath building accessible to public on Monday
The school where two bombs were found on Monday claimed there was no evidence linking the devices to any members of the school, as students sat their exams as scheduled on Tuesday morning.

Late on Monday, bomb disposal officers
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containing 10kg (22lb) of high-grade explosives at the Wah Yan College Hong Kong campus on Queen’s Road East in Wan Chai. A school cleaner spotted the bomb under a building supported by pillars on a slope at about 5.30pm Monday.

“The site where the bombs were uncovered belonged to the school, but it is an open area outside the gates that can be accessed by the public,” the school said in a statement.

So Ying-lun, an assistant supervisor at the school, said they had “not found any evidence pointing at teachers or students responsible for placing or making the bomb”, but said the area the devices were found in was not covered by security cameras.

According to police, the two explosive devices contained two different types of explosives, and had a range of up to 50 to 100 metres (164 to 328 feet).

So admitted he was shocked and concerned when police alerted the school about bombs on campus.

“As far as we know, the police closed off nearby roads last night and conducted a thorough inspection. They lifted the cordon before midnight. So we believe the campus is safe,” So said.

A Form Six student surnamed Law said he passed by the area the bombs were found several times on Monday.

“I was a bit worried because the bomb was placed right in the school,” he said.

But Chan, 13, a Form One student who declined to give his full name, suspected the bomb could have been planted by outsiders as the campus sits on a hill surrounded by public roads.

“I don’t think any of our students could do such a thing,” Chan said.

A student in Form Three, known as Tsang, said he learned a bomb had been found on campus through social media on Monday night.

“I’m not too worried to go to school today, at least the bombs were removed.” he said. “I don’t think our students made [the bombs].”

7087cc02-1aec-11ea-8971-922fdc94075f_1320x770_114527.jpg


A father who was dropping his son off at school by car said there was an online notice last night assuring parents the school was safe.

“It should be safe. I will also come to pick up my son after his exam,” the father, who gave his surname as Hon, said.

The school’s spokesman said students from Form One to Form Five would sit their end-of-semester exams on Tuesday, while Form Six students would carry on with their classes. Both are expected to end by 1.10pm.

Over the past six months, Hong Kong has been rocked by an anti-government movement sparked by the now-withdrawn extradition bill, with increasingly violent clashes between protesters and police.

On Sunday, the Court of Final Appeal in Central and the High Court in Admiralty were
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. Weapons
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, three daggers, knives and 105 bullets were also seized before the rally started. Since June, police have arrested 6,022 people aged between 11 and 84 over offences related to the protests. Of the arrestees, 2,392 are students.Police also found more than 10,000 petrol bombs at several universities in November after protesters barricaded themselves on campuses and fought police.

The rioters have been committing terrorism the moment they began assaulting and harassing people and destroying public and private property to intimidate and prevent people from going about their lives, hypocritically while claiming to fight for "freedom and democracy". It would be appropriate for the Hong Kong authorities to meet the opposition's demand of not referring to the riots and rioters as "riots and rioters" and hold both the rioters and their supporters accountable as terrorists.
 
through images.google.com traced to:
30-11-2007
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single source linked through "crew" as identified by google:
Clipboard593.jpg



4 May 2017
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multiple sources here, I've skimmed over the story I linked


iu


Some images of Neo-Nazis on their "struggle". Seems to be from czech Republic.
12.9.2012
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single source


of course I'll now contact Mods about relevance to
Hong-Kong Protests

reported
 
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