China's transport, tanker & heavy lift aircraft

[wanderingmind]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

All the hue and cry in this thread seems to be how China needs IL-76 and IL-78 aircraft and their Y-9s for tactical transport. Here, again, everyone's overlooking the little guys on the ground. Big lifters are great, as long as you've got big runways to put them on.

But how about footslogger Chen Wu's platoon way out in the boondocks? Where's China's equivalent of the C-27? Where's their equivalent of the U-8 Beaver? When young Chen gets hungry, does he have to wait for his bowl of rice to be trucked 200 miles from the big runway, then another 50 miles by helicopter, then another 10 miles by jeep? And vice-versa if he gets hurt?

If the PLA is smart, the PLAAF will do some expenditures on "ground interface support." Little birds aren't flashy big-ticket items, but they're the heart and soul of support operations. It's like the USA: the flyboys forget where they came from...

 

[isthvan]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

All the hue and cry in this thread seems to be how China needs IL-76 and IL-78 aircraft and their Y-9s for tactical transport. Here, again, everyone's overlooking the little guys on the ground. Big lifters are great, as long as you've got big runways to put them on.

But how about footslogger Chen Wu's platoon way out in the boondocks? Where's China's equivalent of the C-27? Where's their equivalent of the U-8 Beaver? When young Chen gets hungry, does he have to wait for his bowl of rice to be trucked 200 miles from the big runway, then another 50 miles by helicopter, then another 10 miles by jeep? And vice-versa if he gets hurt?

If the PLA is smart, the PLAAF will do some expenditures on "ground interface support." Little birds aren't flashy big-ticket items, but they're the heart and soul of support operations. It's like the USA: the flyboys forget where they came from...

Hi wanderingmind.
China has quite decent fleet of An-24/26 and indigenous version of An-26 called Y-7. This is more or less equivalent of C-27... As for Beaver I believe that Chinese still have large number of Y-5(An-2) in active service...

 

[tphuang]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

on Y-8F600 from the Zhuhai airshow as reported by flightglobal

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Airshow China 2006: Shaanxi assembles first batch of Y8-F600 test aircraft, sees certification by year-end
By Leithen Francis

Shaanxi Aircraft is undertaking final assembly of the first batch of Shaanxi Y8-F600 test aircraft and expects the freighter variant to be certificated by the end of next year. Shaanxi vice-president Liu Bin says the Y8-F600's first flight will be "in January or February next year".

China Postal Airlines, which operates five Y8-F100s, signed a letter of intent to be launch customer for an undisclosed number of Y8-F600s.

AIR SHOW CHINA


This article is part of a full report into Airshow China 2006. For more news stories from the Zhuhai show, click here

Shaanxi has also been speaking with other potential customers, such as Shaanxi United Delong Airlines in Xian and Okay Airways in Tianjin, says Liu. Shaanxi is waiting for United Delong's air operator's certificate to be approved before beginning formal negotiations.

The Pratt & Whitney Canada PW150B-powered Y8F-600 is a derivative of the Y8F-400, which used the indigenous WJ6 engine.

 

[BLUEJACKET]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

"Russia & Ukraine agreed to resume joint series production of AN-124 cargo plane. (max payload 150T, 30T more than the C-5 Galaxy). Cruise speed-750-800 км/hr., Range with max payload 4500 км, with 100 т - over 7,000 км."
Please see my post here-

http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/showthread.php?p=48602#post48602

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The PLAAF may also consider TU-330:

The aircraft is capable to operate on routs of 5600 km with payload of 20 t and for 3000 km range with payload of 30 t. Thus this aircraft can fully replace AN-12 a/c and partially IL-76 a/c on mid-range flights.
TU-330 a/c has been optimized to operate on mid-range routes wherein the aircraft has the best prime cost parameters.
Further important advantage of TU-330 a/c is a deep (up to 75%) commonality with certified passenger aircraft TU-204 and TU-214. Wide application on TU-330 aircraft the TU-204 and TU-214 a/c units and components tried out and tested during operation made it possible to cut down sharply the dates of research and development works and certification process for TU-330 a/c.
The aircraft will have more favorable market situation especially among airlines which operate TU-204 and TU-214 a/c. It also can be provided with engines of foreign production – Rolls-Royce, Pratt Whitney - which will facilitate its realization in western markets.
Airlines of Eastern and Western Europe, Middle East and South-East Asia express their keen interest in TU-330 a/c project during International Airshows.

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[tphuang]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

well, a little more detail on how that IL-76/78 order will be fulfilled.

MOSCOW. Dec 27 (Interfax-AVN) - The Tashkent Aircraft Production
Association (TAPO) will produce 16 Ilyushin Il-76 aircraft under a
Chinese contract, while another 22 aircraft, including four Il-78
refueling tankers, will be produced at Aviastar-SP in Ulyanovsk, with
the Ilyushin Aviation Complex being the main contractor, a source in the
defense and industry complex told Interfax.
"Assuming that TAPO cannot execute the Chinese contract by its own
means for objective reasons, a decision to build some Il-76 and Il-78
aircraft in Russia was taken. The launch of a serial production at the
Ulyanovsk's Aviastar-SP enterprise is being prepared," the source said.
In fact, the contract will be divided between the factories in
Tashkent and Ulyanovsk, he said. "The work to produce 16 Il-76 aircraft
in Tashkent has begun. Planes will be completed and delivered to China.
The other 22 planes are scheduled to be produced at the Ulyanovsk
factory in close cooperation with other Russian enterprises," the source
said.
All Il-76 modifications (Il-76MD, Il-76MF, Il-78 and others) will
be produced in Ulyanovsk. Actual production is unlikely to begin before
2010, he said.
The relocation of Il-76 production from Uzbekistan to Russia will
require significant investment, some $400 million-$500 million, with all
the money expected to come from the budget.
"Taking into consideration that the U.S. dollar exchange rate has
declined substantially since the deal was reached 18 months ago, while
prices for materials and components have grown, the Chinese contract is
barely profitable. Assuming the relocation of the Il-76 production to
Russia, the contract is even a loss maker. Nevertheless Russia cannot
fail to implement the contract, because a Chinese customer has
officially informed Russia that the contract has already come into
operation on its side," the source said.
The contract to deliver 38 planes, including 34 Il-76MD and four
Il-78 aircraft, to China was signed in September 2005. Experts appraise
the deal at $1.5 billion. The first plane is to be delivered to the
customer in 2007, the last in 2012. "The terms are likely to be
extended," the source said.

 

[BLUEJACKET]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

Dec. 27, 2006
Ilyushin Co. to Construct Aircraft for China
Russia’s state exporter of armaments, Rosoboronexport has changed the key contactor for constructing 38 Il-76 and Il-78 transport aircraft for China worth more than $1 billion overall. Ilyushin Co. will be in charge of the contract instead of Tashkent Chkalov Aircraft Association, Rosoboronexport decided.
In January, Rosoboronexport will conclude an agency agreement (i.e. the agreement with the key contractor) with Ilyushin Aircraft Co., said a source with the government on condition of anonymity.
The agreement will set into motion the last year’s contract for supplying to China 34 Il-76 MD transport and assault aircraft and four Il-78 refueling aircraft for a total worth of $1.045 billion. The former main contractor, Tashkent Chkalov Aircraft Association will construct no more than 15 planes to be delivered from 2008 to 2010. Aviastar-SP, Ulyanovsk, will make the remaining 23 planes.
Russia’s goverment will appropriate 6.4 billion rubles for this purpose before 2009. The serial production is slated to begin in 2010, and Ulyanovsk enterprise is expected to annually come up with ten planes of Il-76MD or Il-76MF type starting from 2012. The change of the main contractor will put off the contract deadline from 2012 to 2013.

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To fulfill the contract on time, the Russians could also either sell some newer Il-76MD/78s from their

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and/or offer some AN-124s (each can haul twice as much) instead of some IL-76s.
Indeed, PLAAF may also want to get more capable Il-76MFs later, (as

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ordered 2).

The Il-76MF is a 6.6m (22ft) stretch of the Il-76MD Candid (military) or TD (civil) freighter. It can carry 60t (132,600lb) over 3,600km (1950nm) and its maximum range is 9,600km.

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[Deino]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

Just found at the CDF !!

一航公布的大飞机专项的概念图 类似于C-17的大型军用运输机

... is it a real concept or only another "dream" ??

Deino

 

[tphuang]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

hey Deino, I think this might interest you

2007年01月08日20:21 中国新闻网 %I vhSp{

　　中新社北京一月八日电 (记者 孙自法)中国国防科学技术工业委员会秘书长、新闻发言人黄强八日下午说，目前，中国正在对大飞机研制这一国家重大科技专项进行积极、谨慎的论证。  IS8|]

?5",tl6
　　中国二○○七年国防科技工业工作会议当天在北京举行，黄强在是次会议的新闻发布会上回答本社记者提问时透露了这一信息。他说，中国的大飞机研制一直以来备受海内外关注，中国老百姓的呼声也越来越高。大飞机代表一个国家竞争力的制高点，中国将通过军民统筹来推进大飞机的研制。 !U`-"`#g1
5rl6n2cUk_
　　这位发言人表示，大飞机研制的难度很大，周期当然比较长，他估计中国大飞机专项将跨两到三个五年计划，关键是前期工作要做得充分、扎实一些。 |rV5Qb[H
q MU9":g>
　　国防科工委于上一年度工作会议上首次披露，“十一五”期间，中国航空工业将适时启动大飞机的研制。此后不久，国务院发布《国家中长期科学和技术发展规划纲要(二○○六—二○二○年)》，大飞机与载人航天工程、“嫦娥”工程等一起被列入该纲要十六个国家重大科技专项中。

basically, saying that China is looking to develop a new plane, but the project is extremely challenging and it would take two to three five year period to develop it. So, the project is probably going to take from 2006 to 2020.

 

[Pointblank]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

Just found at the CDF !!

一航公布的大飞机专项的概念图 类似于C-17的大型军用运输机

... is it a real concept or only another "dream" ??

Deino


[qimg]http://www.centurychina.com/plaboard/uploads/Y-New_all.jpg[/qimg]

Looks like a Boeing C-17 Globemaster... Same basic shape and configuration...

 

[montyp165]

Re: China's transport plane capacities

AS-90 engined Il-76s would be best for placeholders until the new domestic medium transport is developed. Domestic production of An-124 would be great for heavy lift, though.