055 DDG Large Destroyer Thread

[i.e.]

The offset funnels have existed before, such as on horizon class, or akizuki class.

started with the Spruance class.

 

[FarkTypeSoldier]

I agree with Blitzo that this is a strange design with a bad taste of ship asthetics...

Personally I would like to see a more stealthier hull and bridge design.

This is just a modification off the 052D design.

Of course since it is fan art, we could only appreciate his/her effort but just don't take it seriously.

Good day

 

[shen]

without VLS AShM or land attack cruise missile(at least not confirmed), there is not point for PLAN to have ships with a huge number of VLS.
if PLAN want a cruiser sized ship, it would be better to build something along the line of the Danish Absalon class. Big enough for at least dual hangar for Z-8 size helicopters, carry enough fuel and store to operate independently without replenishment ship support for pirate hunting missions, and a large flex deck to support limited power projection as well as soft-power missions.

 

[Blitzo]

A "super absalon" would be more suited for lower intensity missions than a true cruiser.

Cruisers and more multi role ships like absalon fulfill completely different missions, and even if 055 can't fire cruise missiles vertically for some strange reason, there is still every reason for it to have many VLS cells for pure SAMs. Certainly, there is no rationale for replacing 055 with some kind of multirole module based support ship even if it lacks comprehensive land attack capabilities.


That said, I would support the idea for the next generation frigate to have some module based capabilities, but also some more traditional attack and air defense weapons too. I find the type 26 GCS an attractive design.


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If anything, there is an argument against a cruiser sized absalon, because it would be too big and expensive to use against pirates and lower intensity missions (054As can do just as well anyway), and also too lightly armed to be a proper cruiser. Nor do they need semi-power projection ships of this type, of this size, not when they are focusing on LPDs, LHAs, and carriers.

 

[shen]

"true cruisers" were traditionally low intensity warships. they were intended to cruise independently in remote stations, performing either commerce raiding or commerce protection. the Soviets never called their Slava and Kirov class ships cruisers. these large ships built around powerful heavy AShM batteries were closer to battleships in their role.
bigger ship are not necessarily more expensive to operate, especially if it can operate independently without support ships. a super Absalon fitted with Type 54a's weapon system and also better aviation facility, maybe the 130mm canon for better shore bombardment capability, and a large flex deck, operating without replenishment ship support can perform anti-pirate patrol mission more efficiently and cheaply.

 

[Blitzo]

"true cruisers" were traditionally low intensity warships. they were intended to cruise independently in remote stations, performing either commerce raiding or commerce protection. the Soviets never called their Slava and Kirov class ships cruisers. these large ships built around powerful heavy AShM batteries were closer to battleships in their role.
bigger ship are not necessarily more expensive to operate, especially if it can operate independently without support ships. a super Absalon fitted with Type 54a's weapon system and also better aviation facility, maybe the 130mm canon for better shore bombardment capability, and a large flex deck, operating without replenishment ship support can perform anti-pirate patrol mission more efficiently and cheaply.

I don't think Slava and Kirov could be called battleships -- for one, they lack the prerequisite armour necessary for a ship to be called a battleship. Maybe in the future the term will re-emerge to define a new class of warship as how the original frigate has turned from a ship of the line sized vessel designed for independent operations, to being defined as something like a destroyer escort in WWII, to today's modern, medium armed vessels which are again capable of independent operations or as part of a task group.

Warship classes meanings change, but to clarify, what I mean by a "true cruiser" is today's definition -- a heavily armed warship capable of undertaking independent operations, with enhanced command capabilities relative to a destroyer, and also the ability to lead SAGs or act as the leader of a task force's escort group.


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I'm not sure whether a super absalon would be more efficient than the PLAN's current anti piracy set up -- it might well be. However, fighting pirates and other such low intensity missions are far from the PLAN's main objectives, therefore investing in such vessels for the time being seems illogical to me.

I mean, they might find producing a couple of super-absalons would be more efficient in fighting pirates, sure, but that will be effectively the only mission they're good for. They would basically be relegated to a support/auxiliary role during high intensity missions, which the PLAN is more geared towards anyhow.


The PLAN's anti piracy missions are an excuse to test out their new, ships and crews anyway -- building a dedicated class for that mission would remove one of the best excuses to deploy their surface combatants out there anyway!
(And, if things go well in coming years, then the PLAN will soon have a more permanent and capable presence in the indian ocean region in the first place, and the ability to fight pirates will be only a footnote in the PLAN's reasons for being there -- they won't need super absalons if they are already committed to stationing a SAG or CVBG in the indian ocean permanently!)

 

[chuck731]

"true cruisers" were traditionally low intensity warships. they were intended to cruise independently in remote stations, performing either commerce raiding or commerce protection. the Soviets never called their Slava and Kirov class ships cruisers. these large ships built around powerful heavy AShM batteries were closer to battleships in their role.
bigger ship are not necessarily more expensive to operate, especially if it can operate independently without support ships. a super Absalon fitted with Type 54a's weapon system and also better aviation facility, maybe the 130mm canon for better shore bombardment capability, and a large flex deck, operating without replenishment ship support can perform anti-pirate patrol mission more efficiently and cheaply.

Actually, soviets did call Kirov class cruisers. Slava class were called "large anti-submarine ship", despite their heavy anti-ship armaments. From 1955-1975 soviet politically motivated official doctrine espoused supremacy of the submarine, and large surface ships didn't get built unless they were titled "large anti-submarine ship" as a ruse to disguise their true role from the politburo.

True cruisers were not low intensity warships. Lighter true cruisers were always intended to function as scouts and screening vessels for the battle fleet, to lead destroyer squadrons and help them break through enemy destroyer screens during pitched battle between fleets of battleships. larger cruisers were always intended to brush aside enemy light cruiser screens, and in a pinch, lend their fire power to the main line of battleships.

 

[franco-russe]

No, the SLAVA class has always been classified missile cruises's (RKR).

But it is true that the KRESTA I class was originally classified as large ASW ships (BPK) until they became RKR in 1975.

 

[Jura The idiot]

...

But it is true that the KRESTA I class was originally classified as large ASW ships (BPK) until they became RKR in 1975.

Link please (Kuzin & Nikolski only says "... в конце 70-х годов они и
были переквалифицированы в ракетные крейсера ..." about ships of "проект 1134", and Russian wikipedia seems to copy this I just wonder about the year, 1975, thank you!

 

[Jura The idiot]

... the Soviets never called their Slava and Kirov class ships cruisers. ...

Pardon me?

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

I think you should be able to recognize Slava and Kirov under Проект 1164 and Проект 1144 entries, respectively, while this webpage is devoted to "missile cruisers" ...