plawolf
Lieutenant General
Old man would be more appropriate I think.
Russian flankers: Retirement home is looking mighty tempting!
Chinese flankers: Not yet old man.
China Flanker Thread III (land based, exclude J-15)
- Thread starter Blitzo
- Start date
Old man would be more appropriate I think.
Russian flankers: Retirement home is looking mighty tempting!
Chinese flankers: Not yet old man.
Is it just me that can’t buy membership to the channel?
I used to pay for the channel membership, but got cancelled by YouTube and can’t subscribe anymore.
I used this website to generate a transcript:
It's far from perfect but does give you some idea of what was being covered.
Script:
00:00
You know, after that Pakistan thing, you get this feeling...
00:03
...that some people, even if they come to this class, still think the Chinese are just lecturing, going on and on. Isn't this Pakistan "food and training" stuff more useful? So, do we study this class or not? Use it or not? How do we study it? Right, you were just talking for a long time about how they simulate NATO's air force.
00:33
This NATO air force — if we had such a NATO air force to go fight the Khokhols [derogatory term for Ukrainians] and Ukraine, that would be great. Isn't that just... drawing a circle to make it a perfect circle? Shut up. How dare you... the enemy Northern Federation? How many years has this been going on? Seven years? Seven years of fixed-term graphics. After May 7th, everyone who participated in exchanges and cooperation agreed: we held nothing back.
01:20
So, under these circumstances, even the Russians...
01:46
...have learned a lesson. When you have such tools at your disposal, you can't help but doubt something. This isn't just a simple technological achievement. There's a guiding operational doctrine that set these tactical-technical specifications, giving their weapons these capabilities.
02:03
At this point, you realize: it's not that their missiles are good, so they developed this doctrine. Nor is it that their doctrine is good, so they can make do with inferior weapons. What is it? It's mutual reinforcement — a highly sophisticated doctrine, and weapons tailored specifically to that doctrine. Right.
02:27
Do they [the Chinese] still have this ability? Wasn't I watching the Chinese come up all along? That Typhoon they brought — wasn't that a Flanker? And the Flanker... how much more can you do with it? Here we go again. Right, the best Flankers in the world are the Su-35 and the Su-30SM. Who here has ever seen an Su-30SM?
02:47
I heard it flew, but you haven't seen it either, have you? Last time you went to Gongtingcheng, it wasn't there — it was in Yelhusko. Is Chen Jun the only one who knows what an Su-30 SM-2 looks like? That's Shoigu. At your military forum, did you ask that guy...
03:11
...the guy from the factory, from Novosibirsk. Anyway, I never got an answer. Just the regular status, and then... whatever.
03:21
This is beyond our ability to reason. The Chinese have this ability. And the worst part is: the Pakistanis — if the Pakistanis make a big deal about shooting down Su-30s, the Russians will react differently. They'll feel very conflicted. On one hand, their Su-30 was shot down — an aircraft they've bought for years. But at the same time...
03:47
...they treat shooting down an Su-30 as a big deal. What does that mean? "Heroes of the world." Here we go again. Shooting down an Su-30 is not easy. Yes, contrary to Cao Cao's expectations. I am a hero. The hero tripped up. Just like Hua Xiong — they forged an 82-jin Great Saber just to take him down, and with one chop they were over-credentialed. Doesn't NATO have this 82-jin Great Saber? In the end, what did we find? Even if you farm intensively...
04:16
...you're just making smoke here. No one cares how you died. So the Russians, after all this talk — "In your victory, there is no mention of our -430. In Pakistani propaganda, there's no -430 either. Does that mean our aircraft are no good?" Shut up. The status of the Federation alliance's flag is also no good. Back to that phrase. Even if it's no good, you still have to fight with it.
04:36
This is the problem. Our J-16, including the naval J-15 aircraft, have demonstrated multiple times that this aircraft only shares the same aerodynamic shape. What you put inside is something the Russian Federation couldn't produce in its next incarnation. There you go again. Yes, that's true. But because the external shape is identical — the aerodynamics are completely the same...
05:01
Even the J-15T, with its oblique intake cut — if you carefully compare the intake shape, it's still identical. Knowing the Russians as we do, the more identical the external shape, the more they care. And judging from the content of this conversation, you get the vague feeling they're hiding something.
05:21
The 2015 Victory Parade — they were hiding these things. When they hid them, their attitude was exactly the same as when we hosted the German armored corps delegation. "Oh, the Panzer III is nice. The Panzer IV is nice. Surely your best tanks aren't these — we know." All classified, right? Here, look at our T-76 — that kind of vibe.
05:50
"Ah, right, back then I was hiding that T-34." "Yes." "I didn't show them the KV either." "Right." "Yes, exactly." "But now?" "Ah, now?" "Oh, he showed us the J-16." "Ah, so. We all know that back during that — uh, it should have been a China joint exercise — yes, at Qingtongxia, the J-20 appeared, fired a string of flares, and left. Left. What did that mean?"
06:15
"Did he think this aircraft was inferior to our Su-57, so he didn't dare to show off and just popped off some flares and ran away? Afraid of exposing flaws." "You see, the rivets are still ours — old Russian rivets, still wearing our clothes — the rivets are still our flaws." "Philosophy of state law." Later, by the time of the 5th-gen air combat, this wave of exchanges was over.
06:37
Hiding things — they have stuff to hide. What are they hiding? Come September 3rd, 2025, your boss, right there on the city gate tower, holding binoculars. You look up — certain things are flying overhead. So that's what they've been hiding. Given the Chinese character, if they were hiding things in 2024, will they stop hiding things in 2025?
07:00
This is also why, within the relevant projects...
07:19
...those newly graduated young Russian flight cadres accept it more easily and think more deeply. While some of the older Russian flight officers — especially those with glorious SVO [Special Military Operation] experience — fall into what category?
07:37
The most conflicted. On one hand, back during Aviadarts, China was already demanding. Back then, there were no weapon-based dogfights, but there was no SVO either — only Syria. They'd talk: "When I flew my Su-34, how many ISIS tents did I bomb? I bomb ISIS tents, I bomb Free Syrian Army terrorists." At that time, what was it?
07:58
"Ah, driving across the vast desert at 70 kilometers per hour, I calculate lead perfectly — no need for KAB-500S, I just dive and drop four high-explosive bombs." Then a very young PLA pilot stands up and asks, "So, how many guided munitions does your unit fire in a year?" That's the kind of question. "I — our regiment commander has fired some. I'll have you know — back when you were a kid, you weren't even born yet."
08:26
(Unintelligible / trailing off)
08:51
The more you think about it, the worse it feels. Relatively speaking, the young pilots of the Russian Air Force — Aerospace Forces — are more like blank slates. One important thing: for the young ones, admitting that today's Russian Aerospace Forces are inferior to today's People's Liberation Army Air Force — that's not shameful. In such moments, talking about your combat experience only shows that you have combat experience. But for those who participated in the SVO...
09:19
"That's not shameful for you — it's shameful for me." "No, it's not shameful — it is shameful." "Your shame belongs to others — it's my shame. I'm the one who went out to fight. I'm the one dropping unguided bombs. I'm standing there blabbing, and then you tell me, 'None of this is necessary.'"
It's far from perfect but does give you some idea of what was being covered.
Script:
00:00
You know, after that Pakistan thing, you get this feeling...
00:03
...that some people, even if they come to this class, still think the Chinese are just lecturing, going on and on. Isn't this Pakistan "food and training" stuff more useful? So, do we study this class or not? Use it or not? How do we study it? Right, you were just talking for a long time about how they simulate NATO's air force.
00:33
This NATO air force — if we had such a NATO air force to go fight the Khokhols [derogatory term for Ukrainians] and Ukraine, that would be great. Isn't that just... drawing a circle to make it a perfect circle? Shut up. How dare you... the enemy Northern Federation? How many years has this been going on? Seven years? Seven years of fixed-term graphics. After May 7th, everyone who participated in exchanges and cooperation agreed: we held nothing back.
01:20
So, under these circumstances, even the Russians...
01:46
...have learned a lesson. When you have such tools at your disposal, you can't help but doubt something. This isn't just a simple technological achievement. There's a guiding operational doctrine that set these tactical-technical specifications, giving their weapons these capabilities.
02:03
At this point, you realize: it's not that their missiles are good, so they developed this doctrine. Nor is it that their doctrine is good, so they can make do with inferior weapons. What is it? It's mutual reinforcement — a highly sophisticated doctrine, and weapons tailored specifically to that doctrine. Right.
02:27
Do they [the Chinese] still have this ability? Wasn't I watching the Chinese come up all along? That Typhoon they brought — wasn't that a Flanker? And the Flanker... how much more can you do with it? Here we go again. Right, the best Flankers in the world are the Su-35 and the Su-30SM. Who here has ever seen an Su-30SM?
02:47
I heard it flew, but you haven't seen it either, have you? Last time you went to Gongtingcheng, it wasn't there — it was in Yelhusko. Is Chen Jun the only one who knows what an Su-30 SM-2 looks like? That's Shoigu. At your military forum, did you ask that guy...
03:11
...the guy from the factory, from Novosibirsk. Anyway, I never got an answer. Just the regular status, and then... whatever.
03:21
This is beyond our ability to reason. The Chinese have this ability. And the worst part is: the Pakistanis — if the Pakistanis make a big deal about shooting down Su-30s, the Russians will react differently. They'll feel very conflicted. On one hand, their Su-30 was shot down — an aircraft they've bought for years. But at the same time...
03:47
...they treat shooting down an Su-30 as a big deal. What does that mean? "Heroes of the world." Here we go again. Shooting down an Su-30 is not easy. Yes, contrary to Cao Cao's expectations. I am a hero. The hero tripped up. Just like Hua Xiong — they forged an 82-jin Great Saber just to take him down, and with one chop they were over-credentialed. Doesn't NATO have this 82-jin Great Saber? In the end, what did we find? Even if you farm intensively...
04:16
...you're just making smoke here. No one cares how you died. So the Russians, after all this talk — "In your victory, there is no mention of our -430. In Pakistani propaganda, there's no -430 either. Does that mean our aircraft are no good?" Shut up. The status of the Federation alliance's flag is also no good. Back to that phrase. Even if it's no good, you still have to fight with it.
04:36
This is the problem. Our J-16, including the naval J-15 aircraft, have demonstrated multiple times that this aircraft only shares the same aerodynamic shape. What you put inside is something the Russian Federation couldn't produce in its next incarnation. There you go again. Yes, that's true. But because the external shape is identical — the aerodynamics are completely the same...
05:01
Even the J-15T, with its oblique intake cut — if you carefully compare the intake shape, it's still identical. Knowing the Russians as we do, the more identical the external shape, the more they care. And judging from the content of this conversation, you get the vague feeling they're hiding something.
05:21
The 2015 Victory Parade — they were hiding these things. When they hid them, their attitude was exactly the same as when we hosted the German armored corps delegation. "Oh, the Panzer III is nice. The Panzer IV is nice. Surely your best tanks aren't these — we know." All classified, right? Here, look at our T-76 — that kind of vibe.
05:50
"Ah, right, back then I was hiding that T-34." "Yes." "I didn't show them the KV either." "Right." "Yes, exactly." "But now?" "Ah, now?" "Oh, he showed us the J-16." "Ah, so. We all know that back during that — uh, it should have been a China joint exercise — yes, at Qingtongxia, the J-20 appeared, fired a string of flares, and left. Left. What did that mean?"
06:15
"Did he think this aircraft was inferior to our Su-57, so he didn't dare to show off and just popped off some flares and ran away? Afraid of exposing flaws." "You see, the rivets are still ours — old Russian rivets, still wearing our clothes — the rivets are still our flaws." "Philosophy of state law." Later, by the time of the 5th-gen air combat, this wave of exchanges was over.
06:37
Hiding things — they have stuff to hide. What are they hiding? Come September 3rd, 2025, your boss, right there on the city gate tower, holding binoculars. You look up — certain things are flying overhead. So that's what they've been hiding. Given the Chinese character, if they were hiding things in 2024, will they stop hiding things in 2025?
07:00
This is also why, within the relevant projects...
07:19
...those newly graduated young Russian flight cadres accept it more easily and think more deeply. While some of the older Russian flight officers — especially those with glorious SVO [Special Military Operation] experience — fall into what category?
07:37
The most conflicted. On one hand, back during Aviadarts, China was already demanding. Back then, there were no weapon-based dogfights, but there was no SVO either — only Syria. They'd talk: "When I flew my Su-34, how many ISIS tents did I bomb? I bomb ISIS tents, I bomb Free Syrian Army terrorists." At that time, what was it?
07:58
"Ah, driving across the vast desert at 70 kilometers per hour, I calculate lead perfectly — no need for KAB-500S, I just dive and drop four high-explosive bombs." Then a very young PLA pilot stands up and asks, "So, how many guided munitions does your unit fire in a year?" That's the kind of question. "I — our regiment commander has fired some. I'll have you know — back when you were a kid, you weren't even born yet."
08:26
(Unintelligible / trailing off)
08:51
The more you think about it, the worse it feels. Relatively speaking, the young pilots of the Russian Air Force — Aerospace Forces — are more like blank slates. One important thing: for the young ones, admitting that today's Russian Aerospace Forces are inferior to today's People's Liberation Army Air Force — that's not shameful. In such moments, talking about your combat experience only shows that you have combat experience. But for those who participated in the SVO...
09:19
"That's not shameful for you — it's shameful for me." "No, it's not shameful — it is shameful." "Your shame belongs to others — it's my shame. I'm the one who went out to fight. I'm the one dropping unguided bombs. I'm standing there blabbing, and then you tell me, 'None of this is necessary.'"
Proof that AI still sucks at translating Chinese military fan speak.
Engineer
Major
They were talking trash most of the show anyway. Those of you who don't understand Chinese really didn't miss much.
But that’s the best part of the show…
There’s a reason I just wait for others to share things.
no chinese military fan speak is simply not that far removed from a bunch of hoodlums talking smack on the street corner.
i listened to it last night and it's really just a bunch of freewheeling vagueposting. i mean its cool to hear the chinese side of shittalk but it feels like im manually panning for gold
fair is fair though, they're paid to entertain, not to brief me.
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These guys (and many others) are a total waste of time but occasionally give nuggets of gold. I find listening to their podcasts the worst brainrot a human can subject themself to. Rely on others to distill the gold. Happens so occasionally it's not worth opening a single chinese military podcast if it isn't your full time job. I honestly feel bad for Western spies whose job it is to sift through the mountain ranges of Chinese military fan podcast for a grain of something potentially accurate to cross check with.
Some of these guys are a bit connected but they all talk with a "low class" and uneducated tone. And yes, it is hoodlum vernacular half the time. Makes you wonder.
Some of these guys are a bit connected but they all talk with a "low class" and uneducated tone. And yes, it is hoodlum vernacular half the time. Makes you wonder.
Sometimes I wonder if they deliberately make it have such a low signal to noise ratio to make it harder for outsiders to efficiently get information.
But most of it is probably deliberately wanting to make it a form of entertainment and to be "personalities" and "content creators" in their own right. I suppose it's a fair tradeoff for being able to get what is ultimately some credible and predictive information now and then, but it does lend the risk of making PLA watching too colloquial, self-satisfied and too meme-heavy.