Z-19 armed recon helicopter

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Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
TerraN_EmpirE said:
Not really. the USMC decided to stick with the AH1 Cobra due to there budgetary needs. They were offered a "Sea" Apache but placed there priority's elsewhere the mission sets of thereCobra and Apache over lap in most mission terms but Apache is the better tank killer or it was the latest brings the to to a close tie. now in terms of arms the analysis of Z19 and AH1 is flawed at best.
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Yes.

...and continuing some OT for comparison purpose...with the new four blade AH-1Z Viper, you are getting very nearly the same out of the Marine attack helicopter now as you do with an Apache...outside of the targeting mast and the heavier armor...and those are significant differences.

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Viper AH-1Z (US Marines):
Max Speed: 222 MPH
Cruise Speed: 160 MPH
Range: 370 nmi (426 mi, 685 km)
Useful load: 5,764 lbs
ceiling: 20,000 ft.
Guns: 1 × 20 mm M197 3-barreled Gatling cannon with 750 rounds
Hardpoints: Up to 6 pylon stations on stub wing
Rockets: 2.75 in (70 mm) Hydra 70 or APKWS II rockets – Mounted in LAU-68C/A (7 shot) or LAU-61D/A (19 shot) launchers
Missiles:
AIM-9 Sidewinder air-to-air missiles – 1 mounted on each wing tip station (total of 2)
AGM-114 Hellfire air-to-surface missiles – Up to 16 missiles mounted on M272 missile launchers, two on each wing.

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Apache AH-64D (US Army):
Max Speed: 227 MPH
Cruise Speed: 165 MPH
Range: 257 nmi (295 mi, 476 km) with Longbow radar mast
Useful load: 6,300 lbs
ceiling: 21,000 ft.
Guns: 1× 30 mm M230 Chain Gun with 1,200 rounds
Hardpoints: Four pylon stations on the stub wings. Longbows also have a station on each wingtip for an AIM-92 Stinger twin missile
Rockets: 2.75 in (70 mm) Hydra 70 or CRV7 70 mm air-to-ground rockets
Missiles: Typically up to 16 AGM-114 Hellfire; AIM-92 Stinger may also be carried.
.
 
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TerraN_EmpirE

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Jeff Head said:
Yes.

But with the new AH-1Z Viper, you are getting very near;ly the same out of the Marine attack helicopter now as you do with an Apache...outside of the targeting mast of course...and that is a significant difference.
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AH64E Apache Guardian specs which push Viper's back in terms o performance but when compared to Longbows, Vipers are a very equal contender, Also Vipers do have the Longbow millimeter wave radar. The same type as the Apache it's just mounted optionally on the stub wings instead of the rotor mast but yes Apache Longbow vs Viper is a virtual match but that is again neither here nor there as the Z19 is not built for the same mission and doctrinal notch.
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
TerraN_EmpirE said:
AH64E Apache Guardian specs which push Viper's back in terms o performance but when compared to Longbows, Vipers are a very equal contender, .
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Pardon the continued OT...but yes...the "Echo" Guardian. That's the new name they came up with for the AH-64D Block III. I forgot about it.

I think they are going to convert over 600 existing AH-64Ds to that config. Then they are going to build about 70 new builds too.

I heard they were going to make it maritime capable and we may see them on the LHDs? Maybe for foreign buyers.

Amazing birds.
 
S

Silvestre

Junior Member
Registered Member
Jeff Head said:
Yes.

...and continuing some OT for comparison purpose...with the new four blade AH-1Z Viper, you are getting very nearly the same out of the Marine attack helicopter now as you do with an Apache...outside of the targeting mast and the heavier armor...and those are significant differences.
Viper AH-1Z (US Marines):
Max Speed: 222 MPH
Cruise Speed: 160 MPH
Range: 370 nmi (426 mi, 685 km)
Useful load: 5,764 lbs
ceiling: 20,000 ft.
Guns: 1 × 20 mm M197 3-barreled Gatling cannon with 750 rounds
Hardpoints: Up to 6 pylon stations on stub wing
Rockets: 2.75 in (70 mm) Hydra 70 or APKWS II rockets – Mounted in LAU-68C/A (7 shot) or LAU-61D/A (19 shot) launchers
Missiles:
AIM-9 Sidewinder air-to-air missiles – 1 mounted on each wing tip station (total of 2)
AGM-114 Hellfire air-to-surface missiles – Up to 16 missiles mounted on M272 missile launchers, two on each wing.


Apache AH-64D (US Army):
Max Speed: 227 MPH
Cruise Speed: 165 MPH
Range: 257 nmi (295 mi, 476 km) with Longbow radar mast
Useful load: 6,300 lbs
ceiling: 21,000 ft.
Guns: 1× 30 mm M230 Chain Gun with 1,200 rounds
Hardpoints: Four pylon stations on the stub wings. Longbows also have a station on each wingtip for an AIM-92 Stinger twin missile
Rockets: 2.75 in (70 mm) Hydra 70 or CRV7 70 mm air-to-ground rockets
Missiles: Typically up to 16 AGM-114 Hellfire; AIM-92 Stinger may also be carried.
.
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Super attack helicopters.
 
MwRYum

MwRYum

Major
asif iqbal said:
Well to be honest 12 attack helicopters to cover a entire army group is cutting it pretty thin and there is 18 group armies within the PLA

If they add a LH unit to each of the 18 group armies we are look at 12 x 18 = 216 attack helos and similar number of scout helicopters

If they added two attack battalions of attack helos to each regiments that would mean 432 attack helos that's a good number

As a matter of fact if we look at attack helo ratio with tank ratio the number is pretty low, actually very low

I hope Z-10 and Z-19 production continues for next 10 years at same pace that would give PLA ground forces a good cover
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The PLA does require a larger army aviation to fulfil such demands, but their helicopter production capability just won't cut it, lacking the proper engine models and the definitive airframes...Z-10 is still more of a "getting there" but without proper high-performance engines, there's no extra power to mount passive IR suppressors, ECM and so forth. And even now, we never saw the Z-10 to fly with a full combat load either.
 
asif iqbal

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
Check it out !

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M

Melcane

New Member
Registered Member
PLA is going slow and steady and is not in hurry at all. China does not want to show off each and every thing. PLA shows off to ward off USA aggression. For example they have shown nuclear submarine type-093, submarine launched missiles JL-02, J-20 and J-31 to release the USA/ Japan pressure in the show off of no fly zone. In reality to show teeth to USA pacific pivot.
China would slowly embark on helos, airlifters Y-20/Y-30/Y-19/Y-9+ and army soldiers personal equipment updates in time frame of 2019-21.
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Melcane said:
PLA is going slow and steady and is not in hurry at all. China does not want to show off each and every thing. PLA shows off to ward off USA aggression. For example they have shown nuclear submarine type-093, submarine launched missiles JL-02, J-20 and J-31 to release the USA/ Japan pressure in the show off of no fly zone. In reality to show teeth to USA pacific pivot.
China would slowly embark on helos, airlifters Y-20/Y-30/Y-19/Y-9+ and army soldiers personal equipment updates in time frame of 2019-21.
Click to expand...
To the contrary, the PRC is aggressively developing its new helicopters and building many types, from two distinct attack choppers, to new multi-role helicopters, etc..

Also, Melcane...

STOP with the US aggression comments and flame bait.

This is a multi-national forum and we respect one another.

The US and China, despite some friction, have numerous joint interests and pursue them amiably. The PLAN being invite to and participating in RIMPAC this year is a good example.

READ SD's RULES OF BEHAIVIOR.

If you will abide by and comply with these rules and do not post antagonistic or argumentative things like this, your stay and experience here at SD will also be amiable.

DO NOT RESPOND TO THIS MODERATION
 
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