What is the worst transition period during Chinese history between dynasties?

Discussion in 'Members' Club Room' started by jackliu, Nov 21, 2012.

  1. jackliu
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    jackliu Banned Idiot

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    What in your opinion do you rank the chaos of between Chinese dynasties and the outcome?

    For me, 1 being the worst and 6 being least worst. Ranking base on the actual chaos during transition, and the end result of post transition situations.


    1. The fall of Song and rise of Yuan, this is the worst because this is the first time the Chinese civilization have been totally conquered by another people, it also ended the very early attempt of Song's possible industrial revolution. And so many technology and knowledge was lost.

    2. Fall of Tang and rise of Song, vast amount of territory was lost to none Chinese tribes/states after Tang fall, and Song actually was never able to get them back until they got defeated by mongols.

    3. Fall of Qing and rise of PRC, this is first time that China faced an enemy that were more powerful than they are in all aspects in both military and culture, and this threat come from overseas rather than from North. The 50 years of civil war and foreign invasion didn't took as much toll on Chinese territorial integrity as much as a big toll on their culture dominance. So in the end, Japanese invasion was not nearly as bad as they time when Mongol completely took over. All in all,the transition was successful and it was able to significantly changed the Chinese worldview to adopt to the modern world. (same thing cannot be said for Middle East)

    4. The fall of Han and the 200 years it take for the rise of Tang. This is because after that fall of Han, it was a real possibility that China would stay fragmented forever, it endured the 3 kingdom, Jin and Southern and Northern Dynasties. Although during many of those periods, each government was flourishing, but war was always inevitable until Sui unify them.

    5. Fall of Ming and rise of Qing. This is 2nd time when entire China was conquered by a difference people, although they maintain Chinese territorial integrity overall, but it was a somewhat repressive government that kept it is distance from the Chinese population in the elite level. Overall they did a decent job guarding the Chinese civilization's interest.

    6. Fall of Yuan and rise of Ming. This is also the 1st time China was able to get rid of a ruling class that were from outside people, but during the chaos countless people died.

    What do you guys think?
     
  2. luhai
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    luhai Banned Idiot

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    fall of han, rise of Tang. 400+ years of mess so painful that school barely teach it outside of it being "period of cultral and ethnic integration" and in pop culture, only a very romantic notion of three kingdom is explored, and leads readers to beliece unification under jin is the end of chaos.... the real chaos comes just 30 year afterwards, and a almost completely different society emerged 400 years afterwards above rivers of blood.

    fall of northern song during year jingkang to rise of ming. also a new society emerged in rivers of blood and conquest. A inward looking one at that.
     
    #2 luhai, Nov 22, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2012

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