055 DDG Large Destroyer Thread

[Verum]

From what you've described he seems to have managed to say not very much in quite a few words, and what little he has said is immensely vague.

It's true, but what he did say was that 055 won't be 10,000 ton plus and will be a small incremental improvement (for tonnage) over the 052D. He said current 052C/D series hover around 7000 tons range; since 055 looks to be much bigger, so it will probably be at least 500 tons heavier than 7,000, but still quite a bit less than 10,000. So we can make an educated guess to place it around 7500-9500 range. But judging from what he said in that episode, having said increase won't be that drastic, I'm guessing it'll be high 7000s - low 8000s. This is probably at least true for early hulls. Later variants could increase to high 8000s or even low 9000s.

If I have to give a fairly exact number, I would say 7700 - 8000. Again, that is just my educated guess.

PS: I noticed wikipedia listed 052d around 7500 tons, but it's sourced from the "Navy Recognition" website, which itself isn't that credible. So I trust the Admiral a little more.

 

[Blitzo]

Did he actually say how much bigger 055 would be in terms of giving a number? If so then I would consider that to be something of note... But at the same time we should recall that even official declarations can sometimes be false, even deliberately false.

Also important, is whether the rear admiral speaking via his own speculation or as a representative of the navy, and what kind of relation does he have with the 055 project, if any?

 

[FarkTypeSoldier]

I just watched Rear Admiral Zhang on a military talkshow on "Beijing TV". The topic of the day was Type 055 DDG. In typical fashion of modern popular media, all their questions for the admiral were greatly exaggerated and even outrageous. One of them was whether if the DDG will be 13,000 tons plus, making it the biggest surface combatants in the world.

This is what he said specifically. He first started with USN's Spruance Class destoryer, which was the most successful design in history. Itself along with its related Ticonderoga and Arleigh Burke totalled to 100+ hulls produced. This reduces design risks and improve design maturation. But the biggest benefit of all is the reduced costs. Since those ships share high percentages of common parts, the mass production doesn't just lower costs but also make them easier to maintain for USN bases around the world. He said it's like designing a skyscraper and then build another 100 more using the same blueprint.

He said in this day and age, the hull is no longer that important. The true differences are in the weapons, engines and especially the electronics. He used Spruance-Arleigh Burke example again, fitting an old late 60's early 70's design with modern electronics and engines, still making it the most capable DDG in the world. He then drifted off course a bit, mentioning the MK-41 modules, saying they're like beer cans in a case, since they all are the same size, you can put any missiles you want in there.

Then he said China is very similar, sometimes even more careful than the US. He mentioned how first truly modern Chinese destroyer, 051, is only in the mid-4000s tons range. Then through each upgrades the tonnage improved by small increments, but still no more than 1000 tons per variance. Even though 055 is a much more different design than 052 class, it still wouldn't suddenly pop out as a totally different monster than the 052.

That's pretty much what he said in that episode, apart from the typical BS and out of this world jokes. But jokes aside, I do think he's telling the truth in this case.

I had watched this episode too... He made some good points as it would be a different issue of building a 10,000 ton warship is totally different from building a 10,000 ton commercial ship. From logistics to operation stages, a warship has to be managed, planned and built precisely to military specifications, of which is of different standards in commercial ship building.

He also added that naval architects have a lot more to do and the navy has not managed a large destroyer before other than a PLAN Sov. Hence the operating procedure for a large warship have to be written, theorised and executed before a 10,000 ton PLAN warship is built.

He concludes that the next Type 055 ddg should be at the region of 7000 to 8000 tons.

 

[FarkTypeSoldier]

Did he actually say how much bigger 055 would be in terms of giving a number? If so then I would consider that to be something of note... But at the same time we should recall that even official declarations can sometimes be false, even deliberately false.

Also important, is whether the rear admiral speaking via his own speculation or as a representative of the navy, and what kind of relation does he have with the 055 project, if any?

Professor Zhang ZhaoZhong, holds the rank of a Rear Admiral of the PLAN ("Prof ZZZ" in our forum), is a Chinese

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

at the

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

.

He used to be a Communication Officer on his active days. He should be a translator sort of role as he is well versed in English, mostly for communicating with western powers in the 1970s to 1980s where PLA had good military relations with the West. His commentary / critic style often contains humor but straight to the point. He could be exaggerated sometimes, likes to BS but he is also known to be a critical thinker.

Prof ZZZ is like a military spokesperson between the PLA and the public, other notable speakers from PLA are Sr. Col Luo Yuan, Sr. Col Du Wenlong. As for his tiles with PLAN, like I have mentioned, since he still holds the Rear Adm, he might know some "Top Secret" information due to his long and wide connections in the force, but cannot reveal too much to the public.

 

[broadsword]

He concludes that the next Type 055 ddg should be at the region of 7000 to 8000 tons.

That range looks way understated going by the measurements done here.

 

[JayBird]

From what you've described he seems to have managed to say not very much in quite a few words, and what little he has said is immensely vague.

HA.... that's exactly what Rear Admiral Zhang is famous and well known for as long as I remember. You have to take what he said with a huge grain of salt most of the time.

 

[Pmichael]

Well, makes me wonder how accurate the displacement stats are for Chinese ships.

The Type052D with just 7,500t full loaded appears to be quite overloaded.

 

[no_name]

A lot of Chinese military watchers jokingly refers to prof. ZZZ as the head of the PRC strategic obfuscation agency. (With Pinkov being the vice head and Gordon Chang heading the North America subdivision.)

The three legendary ability attributed to Prof ZZZ are:

-The ability to seriously put any weapon system at risk by talking about it. Famous example being comments made about Indian submarine before one was sunk in harbour, and the comment about engine on the Vikramaditya before the boilers gave way.

-The ability to curse a leader by paying well meaning attention to him. Examples includes saying that Saddam and Gaddafi would be OK. Also mad comments about Bin Laden and Bashir.

-The ability to drastically alter important international situations in unpredictable ways by commenting on it, for good or worse.

 

[Blitzo]

Let's put it this way, based off the 055 mock up, we know the real thing will have a beam of 20m at the very unlikely minimum, with a realistic beam of likely around 22m.

Even if we project 055's length at the same as 052D (155m, which is immensely unlikely given the current known configuration from the 055 mock up), and only a beam of 21m, that will still result in a ship that is well over 9000 tons full displacement, well over 8000 tons.

The only way 8000 tons might work is if it is a completely newly launched hull lacking any subsystems, armament, fuel, complement...

 

[snake65]

Let's put it this way, based off the 055 mock up, we know the real thing will have a beam of 20m at the very unlikely minimum, with a realistic beam of likely around 22m.

Even if we project 055's length at the same as 052D (155m, which is immensely unlikely given the current known configuration from the 055 mock up), and only a beam of 21m, that will still result in a ship that is well over 9000 tons full displacement, well over 8000 tons.

The only way 8000 tons might work is if it is a completely newly launched hull lacking any subsystems, armament, fuel, complement...

Arleigh Burke Flight I is 154m x 20m at 8200 tons full load. Flight III is 155m x 20m at 9600 full load.